Audio Note OTO SE vs M2 + PrimaLuna

Current setup:
Audio Note AN-E/LX Hemp
VTA SP9 pre with PH12 phono
PrimaLuna Prologue Four (NOS Mullard CV4004 + CV4003, Shuguang Treasure 6CA7-Z)
Linn LP12

I’ve been having issues with the SP9 and I’m about ready to get rid of it. The goal is to eventually have a mostly Audio Note system. My first inclination is to go for an M2 Phono and continue using my PrimaLuna power amp for now, but I do wonder if replacing the whole kit with an OTO Phono SE might yield a benefit. Ideally I would try both options in my home, but unfortunately that is not so easy with no AN dealers close to me.

I believe the OTO is essentially an M1 + P1, so my assumption is that an M2 + a well-built power amp should be the better option. I’d be interested to hear your thoughts and experiences though.

Somewhat related question: does anyone know if AN preamps/amps are able to run on different mains voltage? I’m on assignment in Germany but will eventually return to Canada and it would be nice to bring this home with me.

Thanks,
Jon

 

I can only say that I was surprised by the quality of the M1 Phono, which is what lives inside my Soro SE. But because I have only experienced it with its partner P2 se, it's difficult to directly compare with the other phono sections that I have used with other power amplifiers. Don't discount the synergy that an Oto or Soro will bring to the party. Either may well surpass the M2 + PrimaLuna.

 

Most (I can’t say “all” since I haven’t looked several categories} can be easily changed by a competent tech. Drop a note to the factory about the specific model / vintage (internal changes are made all the time)

 

I've seen M2's for sale that had been converted from 220 to 110. There are of course many different vintages of M2, but it seems a safe bet.

 

This is what has me wondering. Thanks for the notes. More deliberation is needed. There is a used OTO available to me within a reasonable shipping distance, so I wonder if I should just grab that and be happy. I do like the flexibility of separates though. If only the OTO had a pre-out...

 

I'd go with the M2 and Prima Luna power amp. You can always upgrade to an AN power amp down the road. You can't upgrade the OTO.

The M2 is much MUCH better than the ARC IMO. I would be happy with the M2 but I happened to be a bit flush with cash at the time and was going to buy the M6. So I sort of split the difference and went M3. If you don't directly compare these things the M2 and M3 are probably where you get the most bang for buck.

Going higher requires going higher everywhere else as well. The M1 is no slouch either mind you.

 

Thanks Richard. I don’t think I could ever justify the cost of an M6 (he said, naively), but the M3 has definitely been in the back of my mind. Perhaps the M2 is an appropriate compromise for my current expat situation. As an added benefit, I have just learned that my wife prefers the look of the PL’s exposed tubes vs. the large black-boxed OTO.

 

Well I got an M2 Phono in the end. The difference is hilarious actually. This is so much better than the SP9 that my wife noticed it immediately. The depth and weight of the instruments is phenomenal.

I also spoke with AN UK about switching it over to 110V when I move back to Canada and they said it’s an easy job.

 

I don't think ARC is really in the same league. Their prices are in the same league, just not the sound.

The M2 is great. I often think I'd rather change careers and be a dealer so I could spend my days listening to all the stuff I like and building systems. But rose coloured glasses I am sure.

AN has a boatload of power amp optuons down the road including those not on their website. I'm going to the AN dealer in about 25 minutes. Going to talk about Empress, and other power amp options. Can't afford yet but doing the homework the 2 watt 45 tube amp is relatively affordable and sounds really good. Just not sure it has enough power. But then if 7 watts is enough maybe 2 watts is enough.

Glad you're enjoying your system.

 

The fellow I bought the M2 off also has a pair of Empress Silver low gain for sale, 2 years old. I’d love to buy them but can’t justify the expense at the moment. That’s probably a decision I’ll regret. I’d like to get the DAC 0.1x as well though...

I’ve always kind of thought the M3 would be my goal as far as the preamp goes, but man the M2 is very impressive. My wife made several comments on the sound last night and she never does that. In her words: “it’s like the band is in the room - the music is all around me.”

 

I would highly NOT recommend mixing AN with Prima Luna, they have totally different sonic characteristics, such as quality of spaciousness, imaging, and natural low level acoustic details. They will not compliment each other.

 

Empress Silver amplifiers are absolutely wonderful to hear and see. It is a last-purchase item, if any amp is, and worth suffering a bit of temporary financial hardship to reach amazing audio quality at home.

 

I would opt for the Oto Phono SE Signature and be done with upgrading. It is an excellent match for the LX Hemp’s and with such a balanced setup the urge to upgrade is limited.

 

I am in the same boat - but it always depends on how much the hardship is - after all he did just buy a preamp that costs more than most, even audiophiles, spend on their entire stereo. The Empress Silver Signature is what I am striving for but too much for me at the moment.

I was auditioning the Jinro from my M3 today through CD 4.1 - pretty spectacular as usual - the Hong Kong dealer sold the TT3 Reference turntable recently. WOW.

 

I’ll have to suffer the mismatch for now, but I can appreciate what you’re saying. And can assure you that it doesn’t sound bad - maybe that is a testament to the M2. Anyway, one mindblowing upgrade at a time my friend.

 

I’ve heard Warren’s Empress Silver, and it DOES sound great. In fact, when he switched out his Empress for his Empress Silver, I wasn’t aware of it until I asked him why his great-sounding system sounded even better. He had switched in a new Empress Silver that didn’t even have time to break in, and sounded that much better even without breakin.

Even more amazing was that right before that, he used the Empress Silver at T. H. E. Show. Without breakin - wild! Gutsy? But it sounded great! Paired with a Voss phonostage, folks sat through a symphonic piece, and when it ended, there was silence at first, and then a big WOW from the folks listening.

As far as the Oto SE, I would STRONGLY recommend that, if that’s the direction you are leaning, make the push to the Oto Sig SE. I had both in my system. I first had Steve’s Oto Phono Sig SE, though with different tubes. I loved it. Then Steve took it back, and Warren gave me an Oto Phono SE to try. I really did not like it, particularly compared to the Sig. Since my own Sig arrived, and after breakin, I’ve been happy.(do a thread name search for Audio Note Heaven for the entire story).

Of course “happy” is relative, as Warren’s Empress Silver with, I think, the same speakers you have, sounds even better. And then there is Steve’s system, which blows it all out of the water, but at a much greater cost.

My opinion.

Hope this helps.

 

Thanks for the thoughts. The OTO is off the table now as I’m very happy with the M2 and will eventually (probably when I’m back in Canada) add a pair of AN monoblocks. The Empress is an obvious choice in that regard, but will have to decide how far to go with them - silver vs. silver signature...a decision for another day. In the meantime I’m enjoying the music.

 

couple of classic HiFi dealer quotes here, to add to my collection.

 

To be fair, I think the only dealer in this thread is mr. Jarrett, and he makes honest mention of his occupation in his forum avatar.

 

the jinro is the single best audio component I have ever heard.

 

Yep , pretty awesome. If the OP can swing it, it’s audio heaven on earth - for life!

 

I would like to restate this, if nobody minds:

"To be fair, I think (I am) the only dealer who makes honest mention of (my) occupation in (my) forum avatar." We don't know who else may be audio dealers here.

 

Just to make sure that you fully understand your experience, please let me explain that the Jinro played into $25000 speakers (AN/E-AlNiCo) is the best audio component you've "ever heard". But I suspect the 2nd best amplifier that you've ever heard was the Empress monos played into $8000 speakers, the AN/E-Lexus-HE.

What I am trying to emphasize is that you cannot isolate the sound of a "single audio component" from the rest of the system (particularly the amplifier and speaker). Some amplifier/speaker combinations sound better than others, and must be evaluated as a synergistic pair.

 

The M3 and Empress Silver vs M3 and Jinro is an interesting competition. Both amps are considered Level 3 and I have to agree - they both sound great - but they are different. 211 versus 2a3. The Empress monoblocks 2a3 (and I suppose the 300B monoblocks) has the advantage of distributed weight - easier to move around - individual dedicated power supplies. The Jinro has the advantage of also being an integrated amplifier - and considerably more output power - and it is a copper Ongaku. I remember years ago what Peter thought I should buy and he immediately said to me "just buy a Jinro." It's tough to argue against it.

But every show and every dealer ALWAYS has a preamp going into the Jinro - so as good as the Jinro is - it seems to me that it should be treated as a power amp.

I can probably swing the Empress Silver and maybe Sig sometime next year - the Jinro though LOL - Where the hell does it fit - these darn Hong Kong Apartments are so small -

 

hi warren! i hope you are well.

yes, i do understand what i said. again, i said the jinro was the single best audio component i have heard ... we were talking about amps. yes, the speakers made the experience better but a different set of amps on those speaker would sound different. my point is, the jinro is a very very special piece!