Can a 6 watt Tube Amp Replace an 85 Watt vintage Solid State (Rachel vs Sansui)?

This is my first post on the forum after following discussions for years. Apologies... I actually have several topics to post as time permits. Thanks to all forum users for providing me an unlimited source of music education and equipment information. Thank you to our host for setting such a high bar of excellence.

I recently ordered a Decware Model SE34I.4 "Rachel" (single ended triode integrated 6 watt amp). I ordered it on 26 Sep 2014 and received it on 25 Oct 2014. So, a delivery time of a month for a hand built tube amp made in the USA. Rachel is intended to replace my Sansui AU-717 originally purchased in 1980 (still original and working). The amp feeds a pair of Zu Audio Druid Mark 4 extremely efficient 12 Ohm speakers.

Steve Deckert at Decware was extremely helpful in the ordering process and actually owns a pair of Druids. Conversation with Steve is very informative and nonstressed. An exceptional job done by all support staff during ordering, build, and testing phases with email updates at each stage. Rachel arrived well wrapped and double boxed. Also ordered a pair of silver interconnects. Quality process throughout. Disclaimer: I have no existing or past relationship with Decware and simply selected their product based on research, quality, service, economics, and simplicity. I fully expect the amp to last a lifetime (my Sansui lasted for 34 years of heavy use).

I set the amp up today and initially played Karen Carpenter's cover of Freddie Allen's "We've Only Just Begun" mastered by Barry Diament (The Singles 1969-1973 ~1985 A&M Comp from Japan for US). What a nice start. Sound is still a bit muddy yet amp initially sounds both warmer and provides more detail than the Sansui. I expect the sound to improve with more burn-in time.

I am still evaluating the amp regarding volume level and clipping. I will post updates.

If there are other forum members out there with similar equipment, I'd appreciate input on any shared experiences. Let's leave tube rolling for another discussion.

BTW... I am streaming music via WiFi and new router to a Squeezebox Classic to Rachel to Zus. New generation of routers (60+ Mbps) easily handle flac files including 24-192 (so far). Logitech Media Server software still handles and accesses thousands of ripped CDs stored on a QNAP NAS via Droid phone or computers.

Comments and experinces welcome. I have a LOT of listening time invested in the Sansui. Will Rachel prove to be a better long term solution?

Best regards to all.

 

How loud do you like to play your music?
What kind of music do you like?

 

This probably should be in the hardware section.

 

I listen to a huge variety of music... though I typically exclude county, classical, and rap. The Zus perform well with vocals and I've also seen multiple pairs used for raves (very loud). While using the Sansui (85 watts) I never got the volume beyond 50% (-18 dB). Rachel's volume is still being evaluated. Obviously not as loud as the Sansui but better detail and clarity. My days of playing Deep Purple, Van Halen, The Who, etc. at concert level are few and far between.



Steve Deckert provide an interesting loudness analysis chart comparing speaker efficiency on the Decware Site, Decware Amplifier Selection Guide at: http://www.decware.com/newsite/buyingguide.html. The Zus have a rated efficiency of 101 dB/W/M.



I am trying to refine my equipment to better appreciate the difference between mastering (A better DAC will be the next purchase]. For example Diament, Marino, and Davis masterings of Led Zeppelin III have similar EAC peak values (loudness):

Diament 91.1 / 85.0 / 100.0 / 98.0 / 89.4 / 80.4 / 80.4 / 67.1 / 76.1 / 63.1

Marino 100.0 / 100.0 / 100.0 / 100.0 / 100.0 / 100.0 / 100.0 / 99.6 / 100.0 / 87.0

Davis 97.6 / 91.9 / 97.0 / 97.0 / 97.6 / 97.7 / 97.5 / 93.7 / 93.7 / 97.4



Other CDs for example have much different loudness levels. For example Diament and Jensen masterings of Jim Croce's Photographs & Memories do NOT similar EAC peak values (loudness):

Diament 99.0 / 85.3 / 63.8 / 88.1 / 72.7 / 65.1 / 86.4 / 88.4 / 67.2 / 84.1 / 67.3 / 74.5 / 61.6 / 75.6

Jensen 100.0 / 100.0 / 99.9 / 100.0 / 100.0 / 100.0 / 100.0 / 100.0 / 100.0 / 100.0 / 100.0 / 100.0 / 100.0 / 100.0



Other CDs have low EAC peak values (loudness):

Herbie Hancock Maiden Voyage 50.6 / 39.4 / 35.4 / 40.9 / 53.6

Joe Jackson Night and Day 52.4 / 48.7 / 46.3 / 40.5 / 38.3 / 39.3 / 37.0 / 42.3 / 41.8

Bob Dylan Nashville Skyline 49.2 / 46.5 / 52.8 / 45.0 / 46.7 / 43.6 / 51.8 / 44.6 / 47.2 / 58.1



Rachel's 6 Watts from tubes widens the noticeable differences in masterings but does not provide the louder volume levels of the Sansui. So far I'm not missing the loss of watts



Initial opinion: Rachel is a fair trade for everyday listening levels given a reasonable budget for a tube amp.



NOTE: If I need more volume, there is an option to bridge the amp into mono using the Decware Series Floating Output Bridge--I'm not sure of all the details.

 

Yes perhaps hardware, I'll leave it up to a gort. I typically read forum posts as a newsfeed on my phone... so forum sections are transparent.

Thank you!

 

Now that you've had the Decware amp a few months, I'm curious to know if you still enjoy it and your impression of it after this amount of time.

 

Yes... I'm still enjoying the amp and appreciating the sound. I just replied to another post regarding the SE34I.4 and stated that I still have the Sansui in the same cabinet and have not felt the urge to hook it up to the Druids.

As stated above... I have a simple system without bells and whistles....
NAS>Squeezebox>Amp>Speakers

I look at it as an extreme setup. It can sound extremely good given a good recording or annoying as he11 given a CD with uncorrected preemphasis, poor mastering, or even streamed NPR news and podcasts.

I most appreciate vocals on the system... it's what I bought the speakers for. The amp makes them better..... my 2 cents..

 

I'd say it has a lot to do with volume- if you find that you need to run the tube amp wide open to achieve the listening volume you are looking for, you are going to get some clipping which won't sound great, even on a tube amp. Going from an 85-watt to a 6-watt amp is a pretty dramatic difference. As long as you aren't running out of headroom with the 6-watt, you should be okay I suppose.

 

Thanks for the response. Just posted on the other thread as well.
The rest of my setup is a Rega P5 into a Musical Surroundings PhonomenaII, an OPPO BD-105 for CD/Blue Ray/ and computer audio HD recordings. A couple of analog tape recorders (portastudio, HK cassette deck) and finally a MOTU A/D converter for recording. Most of the ancillary stuff I can patch in and out, so it's not always hooked up to my current amp/preamp.

 

My Dansette record player was 3 W, valve ,mono elliptical speaker
It sounded great fully cranked up with the lid down
Probably 10% distortion.

 

Thanks to whoever moved to post to hardware.

 

I keep listening for clipping... when an especially loudly mastered recording comes up I'll find myself additional running over to the amp to additionally watch the meters...

I suppose that will continue for a while since I'm still not willing to fully crank the volume higher than around 60%

 

A friend of mine uses a 3W amplifier (using 6A3 output tubes) with his Zu Omen speakers - lots of pop and rock - with no complaints about volume levels. Note - I've never heard this system since he lives over in California.

I've tried to convince him to get another amplifier with a bit more power, but there seems to be some synergy with the 6A3/Omen pairing since he hasn't been happy with any solid-stater that he's tried.