David Bowie A New Career In A New Town 1977 1982 Boxset 3

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by Zach Johnson, Dec 28, 2016.

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  1. NorthNY Mark

    NorthNY Mark Forum Resident

    Location:
    Canton, NY, USA
    I think the folks on the forum mainly liked the CD set, which involved flat transfers. What Fremer reviewed was the LP set--a completely different ball of wax (pun only partially intended).
     
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  2. soundQman

    soundQman Idealist of the Musical Apocalypse

    Location:
    Arlington, VA, USA
    Wow. Great performance. Is that Reeves Gabrels on the red guitar and behind the shades?
     
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  3. His Masters Vice

    His Masters Vice W.C. Fields Forever

    Location:
    Sydney, Australia
    That may well be what happened. However I suspect they tried various fixes and used the wrong one. So let's say "Fix 5" was fine, but they accidentally put "Fix 4" in by mistake when assembling the album. Clearly someone should have listened to the final result afterwards.

    As for Parlophone's initial "explanation", that was probably just hot air from some PR person who had heard something of the issues with the master tapes. Eventually either Tony Visconti or Ray Staff must have listened to the track and realised, "Uh oh, that's not good". Possibly they even said "Uh oh, that's the wrong version of 'the fix'!"
     
  4. Let's Dance.

    It sold a lot so it would make sense to me.
     
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  5. Juggsnelson

    Juggsnelson Forum Resident

    Location:
    Long Island
    Certainly is. Great band here with Gail Ann Dorsey on bass.
     
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  6. OldSoul

    OldSoul Forum Resident

    Location:
    Oberlin, OH
    Since we're so offtrack talking about Outside, does anyone wanna revisit the 1997/8 Best Ofs issue on Google Play? Check my posts from a few pages ago if you didn't see. I really want to get to the bottom of this. Is Peter Mew really did approach remastering two drastically different ways in 2 years, I find that very interesting.
     
  7. BlueSpeedway

    BlueSpeedway Forum Resident

    Location:
    England
    Ironically the Earthling bonus disc in the set misses out my favourite Dead Man Walking mix.
     
  8. ccbarr

    ccbarr Forum Resident

    Location:
    Iowa, USA
    I would, but I may be a bit more forgiving than I should. I definitely hear the sound drop at the 2:50 mark of "Heroes", it lasts about 15 seconds that I can tell, and the Low remaster doesn't sound any better than my 1999 CD, but it doesn't sound worse. Those are the two main issues for me. I really like the Lodger remix, it seems to have more life to it, same with Scary Monsters.

    I should say that I've ripped all these CDs FLAC files and mainly listen on my Pono, with Sennheiser HD 700 headphones and a Beyerdynamic A20 headphone amp. I should say everything sounds the same on my old RCA CD player and reviver. And we are getting the "Heroes" replacement disc, so I'd go for it and make sure to keep the receipt.

    But again, this is just me, many others on here know a lot more about sound quality, overall though I'm digging the set. Sorry for the garbled message, but I hope it helps.
     
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  9. TonyCzar

    TonyCzar Forum Resident

    Location:
    PhIladelphia, PA
    I don't know if this is any help, but I just took a look through the "Platinum Collection" CD booklet, and ...

    * on the final disc (1980/1987) the non-single-edit digital remasterings almost all carry a 1999 copyright on the remaster: "Time Will Crawl", "Blue Jean", "Loving the Alien", and "Up the Hill Backwards".

    * On the single-edit front, 2002 pretty much carries the day: the single edits of 10 different tracks on this 19-track disc show 2002 remastering copyrights. Also showing 2002 mastering copyrights: "This is not America", "When the Wind Blows". Interesting outliers: "Alabama Song" with a 2005 remaster, which corresponds to the year they finally threw these three discs into the "Platinum Collection" package; "Under Pressure" (1994) and "Drowned Girl" (omitted).

    * on the 1974/1979 disc.... No individual digital remastering copyright dates are provided, but every track carries two copyright dates: original release year, and 1998, which was the year this individual disc was originally re-released, and would have been the 2nd year of Bowie's 15-year-long agreement with EMI for his 1969-1990 stuff. So, nothing on disc 2 (including "Sound and Vision", not identified as the single version here) is going to be a "1999" remaster, at least on the original single disc released in 1998.
    But then, maybe "1999" was the date retroactively slapped on Mew's remastering work going back to 1997, for legal purposes. :shrug:

    * on the 1969/1974 disc...same deal: Two copyright dates, original release year, and 1997, the year the standalone 69/74 disc came out. No copyright dates on individual digital remastering jobs. Bowie's first year with the EMI deal.


    Back cover of booklet just says "Mastered by Peter Mew at Abbey Road Studios"

    So, it looks like 1997 means:

    * EMI/Parlophone cut a big check for Bowie catalogue.
    * Bowie had the bonds hanging over his head
    * Bowie's vision for three distinct hits compilations, an idea vetoed at Ryko, was apparently greeted with a "Yes, Sir" at EMI/Parlophone.
    * The digital remastering elves didn't retire working for EMI/Parlophone' Bowie stash in 1999: There were SACDs to be made and singles to remaster for 2002. Boutique vinyl. "Alabama Song" for 2005. Anniversary editions of his glam-rock stuff. 5.1 Surround DVDs.
     
    Last edited: Oct 13, 2017
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  10. BlueSpeedway

    BlueSpeedway Forum Resident

    Location:
    England
    It might not be relevant, or it might be a clue to any 1997-1998 vs 1999 differences, but I believe the 1999s have the credit Mastered by Peter Mew with Nigel Reeve. Lodger 1999 definitely has that credit, because I played it yesterday.
     
  11. Neonbeam

    Neonbeam All Art Was Once Contemporary

    Location:
    Berlin
    Well... what you should actually wonder about is which album in box 4 wouldn't be a candidate :laughup:
     
  12. imarcq

    imarcq Pushing through the Market Square...

  13. BlueSpeedway

    BlueSpeedway Forum Resident

    Location:
    England
    And Garson there too. It was great seeing him with Alomar for that (first?) Outside era TV performance. And although at the time I had only heard of Dorsey, knew nothing about her, I loved that moment where her side profile moves in front of the camera as she stalks forwards while attacking her bass.
     
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  14. Solace

    Solace Forum Resident

    Location:
    Brussels, Belgium
    I always thought it was the SACDS that were flat transfers, not the CDs. A great-sounding set in any case (with perhaps the slight exception of the s/t and Avalon, but that's another discussion).
     
  15. ParanoidAndroid

    ParanoidAndroid Forum Resident

    Location:
    Bournemouth, UK
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  16. Flaming Torch

    Flaming Torch Forum Resident

    Apologies to all but which Roxy Music box set? There is a fairly recent vinyl box.
     
  17. BlueSpeedway

    BlueSpeedway Forum Resident

    Location:
    England
    Thanks. Interesting, although I almost stopped trying to read it due to the huge, more intrusive than normal adverts on the mobile version. And I did stop reading at this point, I'm afraid:

    "Low has never sounded better".
     
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  18. Phillip Walch

    Phillip Walch Forum Resident

    Yeah it was meant to lead up to the millennium. It would have been an interesting project had it continued.
     
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  19. Solace

    Solace Forum Resident

    Location:
    Brussels, Belgium
    The 2012 CD set. There were also SACDs released the same year which were flat transfers I believe. Both sounded very good indeed. The recent vinyl boxset was not as well received however.
     
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  20. I meant the CD box set.
     
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  21. bonjo

    bonjo Forum Resident

    Location:
    USA
    [
    The vinyl box was mastered 1/2 speed by Miles Showell. Robert Ludwig had nothing to do with any of it.

    As for compression/limiting, this is the direct quote from Miles: The files I worked from for the Roxy Music box set were high resolution flat transfers from the original analogue tapes which were lovingly made here at Abbey Road a few years ago.

    It's almost like you're talking about the old CD remasters which *were* done by Ludwig.

    I think the vinyl box sounds really good, apart from Manifesto (which I never liked much anyway). The first 5 all sound great, and they're the ones that count.
     
  22. Vaughan

    Vaughan Forum Resident

    I don't know - I think it's important, and indeed interesting, to read alternative views. I may not agree with what some have said about the box, but I'm always curious about what people are saying and feeling. The issues only come about when one tries to defend a position. There are many times when I read someone saying X recording isn't good, yet I've always enjoyed it. If I recall correctly, there were some naysayers about Space Oddity (79 Version) before, but I've always really liked it. I also enjoyed the remix of Sound and Vision the Ryko's gave us, but suspect others would turn their noses up.

    You risk learning nothing if you indulge in conformation bias, imo. The article is just one point of view.
     
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  23. Mister President

    Mister President Forum Resident

    So in just 4 days the vinyl set on Amazon UK has gone from £151 to £183 to now £201 again.
     
  24. oldturkey

    oldturkey Forum Resident

    That article is so wrong it just upsets me.

    He says Lodger "has generally been considered the underachiever of this lot...Although esteem for Lodger has grown over the years, it rarely gets mentioned as among Bowie’s finest work." and he calls the original LP "dreary".

    I have a review by Tim Lott, Record Mirror, from 5 May 1979 which disagrees

    THE ARTFUL LODGER: TIM LOTT exclusively reviews the new David Bowie album, Lodger (5 out of 5 stars).
    "For all those mugs who stuck the knife in and pulled out the 'Bowie Backlash' well, IT STOPS HERE.
    It stops here because there's an immense tidebreaker in the wash of Bowie's imaginary decline; the sheer invention, gall and genius that is 'Lodger'"


    This new article just dismisses what many fans (who, I expect, have invested much more of their time listening to Bowie's music than himself) have said almost universally (cheerleaders for the box do exist on this thread as we well know, but the overwhelming view is critical).

    "A quick glance at fan reactions and discussions about the box reveals that some of the self-appointed experts and audiophiles continue to bitch quite authoritatively about this or that bit of minutia, consigning the whole project to the trash-heap of disgraceful ineptitude over a (non)issue that most other Bowie fans (just as devoted if perhaps less strident and certain in their denunciations) would simply shrug off as insignificant, if they noticed at all....it seems hard to fathom how this was missed by the production team. To be fair, many listeners insist that the complaint is overblown and they can barely hear it. Flaws both real and imagined aside, there can be no doubt that A New Career in a New Town (1977–1982) represents an improvement in sound quality for these landmark recordings—they are bolder, crisper and more vividly alive than ever."

    What a joke.



     
  25. BlueSpeedway

    BlueSpeedway Forum Resident

    Location:
    England
    It's a small thing, but in a wider context, I noticed a little thing today while in a record store. The Parlophone jewel case reissue of the EMI jewel case 1999 Low remaster has added, for no reason that I can think of, the Parlophone logo on the front photo of Bowie. It's very small, but no others of their 1969-1980 jewel reissues have it. A tiny sign of things to come perhaps, that someone put it there, in the middle of a truly "iconic" album cover, for no reason apparent to me, and presumably nobody questioned it before production or asked "why has the Parlophone logo been put only onto the front of Low and not the others?"

    Maybe karmaman, who works in that sort of realm, has a thought about it. Or more likely he has better things to think about :laugh:
     
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