Do you think Warren Zevon should be in the R&R HOF?

OK, then how about a general induction of all Africans who played music prior to R&R? Clearly, the R&R beat was derived from African Music. Or maybe this was done and I missed it.

 

The problems with that rule are: A) Many people already in didn't write their own stuff B) Three Dog Night's versions are almost all, without question, the definitive versions of those songs and C) Joan Jett is in and how many of her charting singles are covers?

 

Honestly, I don't see how rock and roll in any but the most attenuated sense can be traced to African music at all. The rock and roll beat isn't derived at all from African music -- not that there's one "African" music, it's a vast continent with millennia of history and various civilizations, languages and culture with lots of different traditions, but the West African cultures that were forceably brought to the New World with slavery had musical traditions much more based on 2 against 3 polyrhythms, the kind of thing you see more in the Yoruban influence on Afro-Caribbean music and down into salsa and maybe jazz...maybe you hear it a little bit in rock via the Bo Diddley beat or something. But I don't think it's at all the genesis of rock's very straight ahead, four to the floor kind of rhythm. But, yeah, the hall does have a category of inductees, "Early Influences" so individuals from the pre-rock era are in the Hall in that category. And since rock is a distinctly American blend of cultural influences, I'm sure the museum touches on the Africanisms (more in the kind of bent notes and flatted fifths and sevenths, and a lead voice floating against a ground beat than in the rock rhythm I think) and the Anglo-Americanism in it's educational programs and displays.

 

He took himself to the Louvre museum and through himself against a wall ! I suspect he we do the same in the RRHOF !!

 

I believe the line of logic goes like this: Africans who were brought to America as slaves developed unique styles of music that incorporated their native forms of music with European influences in the New World which become early gospel, jazz and blues music. Jazz and blues evolved within themselves and later blended with American country music (itself in turn influenced strongly from European roots) and blues to become rock and roll. The musical DNA shared by African music and modern rock and roll may be very thinned out, but it seems to me it would be hard to argue that it's not there.

Just my 2 cents, of course.

 

I don't disagree with that broad outline. I just don't think the rock rhythm -- which is a very four square rhythm -- is one of the discernible Africanisms that survive in rock. Blues mode bent notes, a kind of lead line that floats over the ground beat, those things for sure. But the slaves who were taken to the new world were mostly from West Africa and the music traditions from the cultures there were, and are, heavily cross rhythmic with a lot of three against two kind of patterns, the kind of think you hear in the new world in salsa and afro-caribbean music and even to some degree in jazz and in what Jelly Roll Morton called jazz's "latin tinge." Something more like this than like the really 1-2-3-4 rock and roll rhythm which I think is more of a new world rhythm.

 

Oh yeah.

 

David Letterman Is Right: Warren Zevon Should Be in the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame

 

right, because a woman inducted could only be affirmative action

 

Absolutely, a real artist !

And one of the best guests on The Larry Sanders Show !

RIP x 2

 

What's up with your obsession with The Pistols in this thread?

 

you are correct

 

just not a fan, i understand the significance of the whole punk movement, but hall of fame, i respectfully disagree.

 

Yes, Zevon should be in! His music and songwriting is right up there and from what I have read was very well respected by many. One of my favorites. One thing I have not read is if he was an influence on other musicians- have not heard his name used in that sense from other notable musicians after him. Dylans playing of his songs after his death tells me all I need to know!!

 

Sure, and have Springsteen induct him.

 

I vote yes.

 

The Rock And Roll Hall Of Fame is illegitimate in my view.
Reason #1 - Warren Zevon is not in it. Personally I think he should be inducted by an Act of the United Nations. And David Letterman should induct him.

 

Percy Sledge was not a one hit wonder.
He had that massive hit we all know, and had other top ten hits in the R&B charts, and top twenties on Hot 100.
Those other songs were great too.
Look them up.
He was a great soul star ; one helluva singer, performer, and talent and well deserving of induction of the hall. (Whatever one considers the halls worth, etc. )
P.S. Joe Tex deserves it to... Maybe one day....Think his name has been tossed around in consideration as much as Chic.

 

Maybe. What should probably happen with the hall is the same thing that happens in Cooperstown; a veteran's committee, now known as the Eras Committee. If you cannot get in via the normal route, then this might be your shot. IIRC, Ron Santo got in the HOF in this manner. Were his stats good enough? Probably. He was the best 3rd baseman in the National League, with most of his records being broken by Mike Schmidt.

 

"Things To Do In Denver When You're Dead."

 

The die is cast: Future questions regarding induction will inevitably focus less on the artist and more on the Hall due its seemingly inexplicable and inconsistent methodology, as well as lack of transparency. For what it's worth, I think the qualification "of Fame" is entirely problematic, but given the subjectivity of art perhaps it's this debate that keeps the Hall vital in the public forum. The "Museum for the General Appreciation and Celebration of Rock and Roll" would likely have shuttered it's doors years ago.../peace,K

 

Yes and David Letterman should induct him along with Jackson Browne Warren's polar opposite (and biggest supporter/earliest fan).

 

Let's get this straight Mike, you are saying here that if a woman is given an award in something like the Hall of Fame that it must be down to politically correct tokenism?

''people should get there based on talent'. You are saying that Nyro had no talent? Or are you saying that talent wasn't the reason why she was inducted? Either way, how do you know this?

 

Why don't you think she doesn't deserve to be in? Not commercially successful enough or not great enough artist?

 

Not rock and not particularly popular. Nor nearly as influential as Joni Mitchell (who is deservedly in) or even Carly Simon, who is not.