Has anyone bought The Who Ultimate Collection CD's?

So THAT'S what that button's for...lol! Thanks!

 

For the screenshots I used the print screen key. I cropped it in PSP. Here is the waveform of I Can See For Miles from the US Meaty Beaty Big & Bouncy cd.



What a difference! Every song on the Ultimate Collection is clipped. Unlistenable.

 

WOW, thanks Jason...what a difference. Is your first scan from I Can See For Miles off the Ultimate Collection? I just don't explain why PROFESSIONAL engineers take the time to go back and find the best source material and then compress, no noise and EQ it to death. And what about the record executives or anyone else in the control room. Doesn't anyone listen to the final product and if so how could they think this is a well done job.

If I were there I would fire them all.

 

You're calling Jon Astley a "professional"? Ha!

The only reason Jon gets to do what he does is because he's Pete's (ex?) brother-in-law. I think Universal just doesn't want to anger Pete.

 

Thanks Jason. That comparisons just about says it all.

 

Quoting Steve H:

In fact Steve, It is that very reason that after buying the horrible sounding Ultimate Collection I ran out and bought the Canadian MBBB. Love the sound. It outclasses this new anthology by leaps and bounds.

Brian

 

Ultimate Who

Go buy the MFSL versions Who's Next(or the DCC one), Who Are You, Live at Leed's, and Quadrophenia. These are excellent transfers to CD and come pretty close to clean vinyl. I use them as a reference when trying out new equipment...........

Be careful when seeing these new "remasters"-typically they add a little gain and run them through a new DAC hence 24 or 20 Bit.

If these new "remasters" came close to the work done by Steve and MFSL, you would not be here on this website asking.


What would be interesting is if they described the process in which they remastered these discs-did they run them though tube equipment, what kind of DAC process.

Other people to trust would be people like Doug Sax, and Bob Ludwig. Look them up at www.allmusic.com. You will embark on a long journey.
Ferg

 

Re: Ultimate Who

Umm...the MoFi Who's Next is a piece of ****. Essentially the same thing as the 1995 remix/remaster. Live At Leeds essentially a clone of the remix/remaster as well.

DCC never did Who's Next, but Steve did when he was at MCA. If you can't find an original copy a current Canadian one will suffice.

Who Are You and Quad aren't bad, but the original Polydors are generally regarded as having the edge.

 

lukpac

[personal attack deleted - HZ]

 

Has anyone considered the possibility that Universal is happy with the job Jon Astley is doing? After all, before being exposed to this web site, didn't many of us think that today's louder, harsher discs actually sounded better than ever? Isn't that why we traded in our older, better CDs--because we didn't know any better? Well, that's exactly where the overwhelming majority of today's CD buyers stand.

The Beatles 1 CD has been described in this forum as a "sonic disaster." Imagine if a typical CD buyer who owns that disc came upon that comment: They would think the forum member who made that assessment is insane. A sonic disaster? C'mon, it sounds snappy and loud! No-noise? It's the digital age, baby--I want my CDs to sound clean!

That typical listener, if he were to read this thread after listening to Ultimate Collection, would think the exact same thing.

A more interesting question is: Since we've all been burned multiple times by bad CDs, why do WE keep buying every new remaster that comes along? Let's face it: Other than the work of Steve Hoffman, Sony Legacy and maybe a couple of small labels, the best-sounding CDs were released before the mid-90s. Practically everything since then has been overkill. And even when a new remaster sounds really good, often it's only slightly better--if at all--than the previous master (Bob Marley, Steely Dan, etc.).

Remember, the majors aren't making their CDs to please US. They're making them for all those folks who want the explosions on their Armageddon DVD to sound REALLY LOUD.

 

Mr. Astley, in the new ICE, on The Ultimate Who:

"The whole record is, for the first time, taken from the original masters of all the original mixes. I spent a lot of time this year searching the vaults, including Germany, and [MCA's} Andy McKaie and I came up with quite a few original masters."

Your thoughts?

 

Bill,

I read that too. And yet, listening to Happy jack and Call Me Lightning in fake stereo, Astley had to do something to get them to sound that way. It has already been commented that Astley has added no-noise to many of the tracks. Andy gave him decent source tapes, but his remastering strikes again. Lukpac spent a lot of his time critiquing this CD for us song-by song earlier in this post. I appreciate that. I will yield to his expertise as to what he's done to these mixes.

Brian

 

Astley is well-known for factual inaccuracy, be it deliberate or careless, and he is not a reliable source of information. Based on Luke's comments it seems likely the master tapes were used for some tracks, but not for others. If the Who's Next tracks, for example, are hissier than what's on the Canadian CD, then they can't possibly be from the original master tape.

 

Speaking for myself, I don't buy every remaster that comes along, I try to make informed purchases. After the "All Things Must Pass" debacle, I vowed never again to buy an Astley-mangled CD, and thus I've been spared Live at Leeds Deluxe and the Ultimate Collection.

It's an overgeneralization to say that virtually all remasters are inferior to that which they replace. The current Beach Boys CDs, for example, far outclass the early-90s versions. Ditto for Hendrix, and the post-1970 Stones and Kinks catalogs.

 

Well, that's not *necessarily* the case. It seems as if the treble is jacked up a bit on the new set, so that could possibly explain more hiss.

 

As far as being happy with Astley - while I don't know the details, I've heard that the "remastered" The Kids Are Alright soundtrack was rejected a number of times because it sounded so bad.

As I've said before, I think as long as it's somewhat listenable, Universal doesn't have much of a choice. With the reissue series, most of the power has gone in The Who's/Pete's hands, which means Astley is in charge. I'm not sure Universal is in a position to say "you can't use Astley anymore".

A few years ago I was talking to an exec in charge of reissues at one of the big labels, and was telling him about some of Astley's goof-ups, notably the use of fake stereo on A Quick One. His response? "That sounds like Jon."

As far as newer reissues not being good - sometimes that's true, sometimes not. Hell, if Universal had one of their house engineers master this I think we would have had a pretty great set.

 

So, I take it after reading this thread that if I want the all-around best-sounding CD covering The Who's career, I should buy "Who's Better, Who's Best"? Yes or no?

If I can't get that, if I actually had to choose between (gasp!) "My Generation: The Very Best Of The Who" and "Ultimate Collection," which one would you guys recommend?

By the way, "Who's Better, Who's Best" IS available through absound.com, though it's listed under the title "Who's Best."

Bobby

 

bobbylion,

The general concencus around here is that the best available Who albums are the 3 most talked about. The Canadian (cheap ones) Who's Next. Meaty, Beaty, Big & Bouncy, and Who's Missing. The MFSL's, Quadraphenia and Who Are You. Altough Luke won't agree on the MFSL's.

All compilation Who albums suck horribly, is the general idea.

Hope this helps you on your quest.

 

Thanks, Dave.

Still, if I was to buy one compilation basically covering their entire career, you would recommend...? (The least of all evils.)

Bobby

 

Who's Better Who's Best isn't bad. It has the Stereo mix of I'm A Boy, the single version of Won't Get Fooled Again, Join Together without noise reduction, the single version of See me Feel Me without noise reduction and a good master of Substitute. That and Meaty Beaty are good compilations to have. Greatest Hits might be good, I haven't heard the cd so I don't know if it sounds good. It has single versions of Relay and Love Reign O'er Me. Those 3 cds will probably cost you as much as the Ultimate Collection and provide MUCH better sound quality.

P.S. Is the version of Love Reign O'er Me the original single mix with organ at the end or just an edit of the long version? I need a new preamp, so I can't check the LP.

 

That would be a conditional "yes". The Talmy stuff (especially I Can't Explain) sounds better on the Meaty cd in my opinion, but Meaty of course only goes up to 1969. In terms of career-spanning scope and overall competence, WBWB is probably the best single cd.

I haven't heard Ultimate Collection, but I would probably pick it over "My Generation: The Very Best..." because it has all original mixes and the stereo Magic Bus.

 

Well, I don't know about that.

For starters, MBBB doesn't have the single version of I'm A Boy, and the transfer of Substitute is probably the worst I've ever heard. It seems to me there's another stinker as well. WBWB takes care of both of these for you.

On the other hand, MBBB does have the best sounding version of I Can't Explain anywhere (for the next few months, anyway), and has pretty nice transfers of most of the other tracks.

Of course, neither CD has Let's See Action or a number of other later hits.

 

Lukpac,

Can you explain your "for the next few months" comment? Is this referring to how frequently The Who release compilations?

Bobby

 

You mean like the Stereo version on MCA's MBBB done by Steve?

bobbylion, Luke is our foremost Who authority here.