Hollies' Greatest stereo mixes: mixed when?

I thought there was some discussion about this years ago, but I can't seem to find it. My understanding is that, with a few exceptions (noted below), the stereo mixes on Hollies' Greatest were first issued on that LP. Yet the mixing style varies widely from song to song. For example, "Bus Stop" is essentially twin-track, while "On a Carousel" is nice left-center-right stereo. Presumably some tracks were mixed specifically for the LP, but perhaps others were mixed earlier and simply not released at the time? Does anyone know when the various mixes were made?

Below is the tracklisting of the album, with recording and original release dates, the first stereo releases to my knowledge, as well as some notes about the mixes. Any corrections are appreciated.

I Can't Let Go
Recorded: 13 January 1966
Released: 18 February 1966
First stereo release: Would You Believe?, Parlophone PCS 7008, 1 June, 1966
Notes: Backing left, vocals and overdubs right.

Bus Stop
Recorded: 18 May 1966
Released: 17 June 1966
First stereo release: Hollies' Greatest, Parlophone PCS 7057, August 1968
Notes: Backing left, vocals and solo overdubs right.

We're Through
Recorded: 25 August 1963
Released: 1964
First stereo release: Hollies' Greatest, Parlophone PCS 7057, August 1968
Notes: Backing left, overdubs right, double-tracked vocals center.

Carrie Anne
Recorded: 1 May 1967
Released: 26 May 1967
First stereo release: Hollies' Greatest, Parlophone PCS 7057, August 1968
Notes: Backing left, vocals and overdubs right.

Here I Go Again
Recorded: 13 April 1964
Released: May 1964
First stereo release: Hollies' Greatest, Parlophone PCS 7057, August 1968
Notes: Vocals split left and right, backing and high harmony vocal overdub center.

King Midas In Reverse
Recorded: 3 & 4 August 1967
Released: 22 September 1967
First stereo release: Dear Eloise/King Midas In Reverse, Epic BN 26344, 27 November 1967
Notes: Backing left, orchestra right, double-tracked vocals right (intro) and center (remainder).

Yes I Will
Recorded: 15 December 1964
Released: August 1968
First stereo release: Hollies' Greatest, Parlophone PCS 7057, August 1968
Notes: Backing left, overdubs right, double-tracked vocals center. Alternate recording: 45 take recorded 3 January 1965.

I'm Alive
Recorded: 5 May 1965
Released: 21 May 1965
First stereo release: Hollies' Greatest, Parlophone PCS 7057, August 1968
Notes: Backing left, vocals and overdubs right.

Just One Look
Recorded: ?
Released: February 1964
First stereo release: Hollies' Greatest, Parlophone PCS 7057, August 1968
Notes: Backing left, overdubs right, double-tracked vocals center. Missing the tambourine present on the mono mix.

On a Carousel
Recorded: 11 & 13 January 1967
Released: 10 February 1967
First stereo release: Hollies' Greatest, Parlophone PCS 7057, August 1968
Notes: Backing left, vocals center, overdubs right.

Stay
Recorded: ?
Released: November 1963.
First stereo release: Stay With The Hollies, Parlophone PCS 3054, January 1964
Notes: Vocals left, backing right. Seems to be a twin-track recording.

Look Through Any Window
Recorded: 30 June 1965
Released: 27 August 1965
First stereo release: Hollies' Greatest, Parlophone PCS 7057, August 1968
Notes: Backing left, vocals right-center and right.

Stop Stop Stop
Recorded: 20 June & 17 August 1966
Released: 7 October 1966
First stereo release: For Certain Because, Parlophone PCS 7011, 9 December 1966
Notes: Backing left, vocals center, overdubs right.

Jennifer Eccles
Recorded: 3 February 1968
Released: 22 March 1968
First stereo release: Hollies' Greatest, Parlophone PCS 7057, August 1968
Notes: Backing left, vocals split center and right, overdubs center and right, whistles left and right.

The variation in mixing styles is really odd. Thoughts?

 

Although the LP cover stated Would You Believe as being in both mono and stereo in June 1966 only the mono version was released then, the stereo version PCS 7008 actually was released early in 1967 AFTER the mono/stereo release of 'For Certain Because...' in October 1966

thus 'I Can't Let Go' first appears in stereo early in 1967 on that belated release....and featured the 'go to mono' few seconds as later on 'Hollies Greatest' LP in 1968 - presumably there must have been some kind of glitch on the stereo master and a quick 'repair' job was done by inserting a bit of the mono version !

the 'Hollies Recording' tracks generally have better stereo sound, tho' Jennifer Eccles has an odd change in it were instrumentation vanishes on one stereo channel part way through

several early Hollies albums - the second and third UK sets - only had mono versions at the time with stereo versions released much later, but their debut UK album 'Stay With...' and later 'For Certain...' had generally better stereo versions on most tracks tho' 'Evolution' in 1967 reverted to that vocals one channel / most instruments on the other ultra basic stereo sound

the faster alternate version in stereo of Yes I Will was only on stereo versions of Hollies Greatest, the mono version PMC 7057 featured the mono hit single version - presumably EMI had mislaid the stereo master of the original hit single version of Yes I Will then....later in 1978 it's the hit single take in fake stereo on 'Twenty Golden Greats' but with some copies featuring the alternate faster version in true stereo

- but since then it appears EMI located the true stereo version of the original hit single version as it is on later compilations including the 'evergreen' Air That I Breathe best of....and the 'white clouds' Greatest CD

 

Links to the mixes on YouTube for those not familiar with them:

I Can't Let Go
Recorded: 13 January 1966
Released: 18 February 1966
First stereo release: Would You Believe?, Parlophone PCS 7008, 1 June, 1966
Notes: Backing left, vocals and overdubs right.

Bus Stop
Recorded: 18 May 1966
Released: 17 June 1966
First stereo release: Hollies' Greatest, Parlophone PCS 7057, August 1968
Notes: Backing left, vocals and solo overdubs right.

We're Through
Recorded: 25 August 1963
Released: 1964
First stereo release: Hollies' Greatest, Parlophone PCS 7057, August 1968
Notes: Backing left, overdubs right, double-tracked vocals center.

Carrie Anne
Recorded: 1 May 1967
Released: 26 May 1967
First stereo release: Hollies' Greatest, Parlophone PCS 7057, August 1968
Notes: Backing left, vocals and overdubs right.

Here I Go Again
Recorded: 13 April 1964
Released: May 1964
First stereo release: Hollies' Greatest, Parlophone PCS 7057, August 1968
Notes: Vocals split left and right, backing and high harmony vocal overdub center.

King Midas In Reverse
Recorded: 3 & 4 August 1967
Released: 22 September 1967
First stereo release: Dear Eloise/King Midas In Reverse, Epic BN 26344, 27 November 1967
Notes: Backing left, orchestra right, double-tracked vocals right (intro) and center (remainder).

Yes I Will
Recorded: 15 December 1964
Released: August 1968
First stereo release: Hollies' Greatest, Parlophone PCS 7057, August 1968
Notes: Backing left, overdubs right, double-tracked vocals center. Alternate recording: 45 take recorded 3 January 1965.

I'm Alive
Recorded: 5 May 1965
Released: 21 May 1965
First stereo release: Hollies' Greatest, Parlophone PCS 7057, August 1968
Notes: Backing left, vocals and overdubs right.

Just One Look
Recorded: ?
Released: February 1964
First stereo release: Hollies' Greatest, Parlophone PCS 7057, August 1968
Notes: Backing left, overdubs right, double-tracked vocals center. Missing the tambourine present on the mono mix.

On a Carousel
Recorded: 11 & 13 January 1967
Released: 10 February 1967
First stereo release: Hollies' Greatest, Parlophone PCS 7057, August 1968
Notes: Backing left, vocals center, overdubs right.

Stay
Recorded: ?
Released: November 1963.
First stereo release: Stay With The Hollies, Parlophone PCS 3054, January 1964
Notes: Vocals left, backing right. Seems to be a twin-track recording.

Look Through Any Window
Recorded: 30 June 1965
Released: 27 August 1965
First stereo release: Hollies' Greatest, Parlophone PCS 7057, August 1968
Notes: Backing left, vocals right-center and right.

Stop Stop Stop
Recorded: 20 June & 17 August 1966
Released: 7 October 1966
First stereo release: For Certain Because, Parlophone PCS 7011, 9 December 1966
Notes: Backing left, vocals center, overdubs right.

Jennifer Eccles
Recorded: 3 February 1968
Released: 22 March 1968
First stereo release: Hollies' Greatest, Parlophone PCS 7057, August 1968
Notes: Backing left, vocals split center and right, overdubs center and right, whistles left and right.

Most of those are from 20 Golden Greats, but oddly the videos of Yes I Will and Look Through Any Window don't match my CD. Yes I Will is the mono mix of the 45 take, while Look Through Any Window is the mix from the 30th Anniversary set. Was the CD actually changed at some point, or is this just a YouTube oddity?

 

AFAIK Bus Stop, I'm Alive and We're Through were first released in stereo about a year earlier on Regal SREG 2024.

 

Interesting. Some info about that:

"A UK version of the US "Bus Stop" album (Imperial LP-12330), issued one month later for export only. On this "Baby That's All" is replaced by "I'm Alive" and "You Know He Did" by "Stop Stop Stop", otherwise the same tracking order. It's a compilation of numbers recorded 1964-66, all previously released on '45 and/or LP. As far as I understand the mixes used here are not the same as on US "Bus Stop". I don't have that any more, but remember at least some of the songs came in fake stereo and there was more reverb. All cuts on this are true stereo and it's almost reverb-free, coming trough very natural. Not a big fan of any Hollies sixties stereo and would have liked the mono versions better, but the pressing and audio on here is so good I can live with it. First press had label as shown and laminated flip/back cover. (HÖLY*)(ÖXÄP*)(SXS*)"

MONOLOVER: THE HOLLIES SREG 2024 (-67) UK EXPORT STEREO

A month after the US "Bus Stop" LP would put its release date as November 1966. Of course, while Bus Stop and I'm Alive both have twin-track style mixes, We're Through doesn't.

While I'm not certain, it seems likely the song hadn't previously been mixed to stereo, and that when a stereo mix was made for Hollies' Greatest the wrong tape was pulled to mix from.

If the versions on YouTube match the CDs, the former is the mono mix, while the latter is the Ron Furmanek remix with the channels reversed:

 

That's the Ron Furmanek remix.

 

I don't know but it's an interesting question. In order to inject personal comment I would like to say that the 60's stereo mix of I Can't Let Go ranks alongside the stereo Get Off Of My Cloud as one of the worst stereo mixes ever of a stonking hot 60's classic. The 45 mixes of those two are gems for power and content, I Can't Let Go arguably being The Hollies' finest moment and yet the stereo mixes are even less than barely feeble. I was as gobsmacked at how bad the stereo mixes were as I was gobsmacked at how great the 45s are.

 

1. I Can't Let Go
Was mixed for stereo for "Would You Believe" in 1966, but the stereo mix of this LP wasn't actually issued in the UK until April 1967, AFTER the following studio LP "For Certain Because..." in December 1966 and after it's inclusion in stereo on the German "Hollies Greatest" (Odeon SMO 74236) in early 1967.

2. Bus Stop
First featured on "The Hollies" (export Regal SREG 2024) in April/May 1967. And the German "Hollies Greatest" (Odeon SMO 74236) in early 1967.

3. We're Through
First featured on "The Hollies" (export, Regal SREG 2024) in April/May 1967.

4. Carrie Anne
First features in stereo on the US LP "Evolution Featuring Carrie Anne" (Epic BN26315) in July 1967. A slightly remixed version with centralised vocals and phased backing appears on the German "Hollies Greatest Hits" (Hansa 78575 IT) in October 1968.

5. Here I Go Again
First features on "Hollies Greatest", Parlophone PCS 7057, August 1968.

6. King Midas In Reverse
Was actually mixed for stereo in August 1967, as it was recorded by running two 4-track tape recorders simultaneously, and to prevent issues of syncing the tapes, the track was mixed for mono and stereo on the same day that the orchestra was added (while the Hollies were on tour) so that the tape machines would be operating in perfect sync. And that's why the track wasn't remixed into a less primitive stereo mix until 2010, but unfortunately they seemingly overdubbed a new drum track.

7. Yes I Will
This was mixed for "Hollies Greatest", Parlophone PCS 7057 as it's an early take used by mistake. The proper stereo mix of the original single version wasn't released until 1993, and a phased stereo mix of the mono single was used in lieu of this early take, at the request of the Hollies, on all future official EMI/Parlophone releases through the 1970s and 1980s.

8. I'm Alive
First featured on "The Hollies" (export, Regal SREG 2024) in April/May 1967.

9. Just One Look
First features on "Hollies Greatest", Parlophone PCS 7057, August 1968, though it was previously featured on only a Swedish only hits compilation "The Hollies" PMCS 309, in 1965 in mono. Strangely, this one slips the net for being included on various other greatest hits compilations issued prior to "Hollies Greatest" in 1968.

10. On A Carousel
First features on "Hollies Greatest", Parlophone PCS 7057, August 1968. It was previously featured on "Hollies Greatest Hits" in America on Imperial Records LP12350, but it's a fake stereo mix.

11. Stay
First features on "Hollies Greatest", Parlophone PCS 7057, August 1968. Note that the guitar solo is slightly different to the original mono mix.

12. Look Though Any Window
Two stereo mixes of this exist. This is the first stereo mix, first used on the German "Hollies Greatest" (Odeon SMO 74236) in early 1967. In 1972, EMI cleared out some of their session tapes, and the session tape for LTAW was scrapped. Before these tapes were wiped, engineers were invited to experiment with them. Someone (unknown) made a few remixes of Hollies hits, not knowing if stereo mixes existed. Stereo mix number two enters the scene here, missing the backing vocals in the final outtro. This mix appears to be favourited in later compilations, making the early mix rarer.

13. Stop! Stop! Stop!
First issued in stereo on "For Certain Because..." (PCS 7011) in December 1966.

14. Jennifer Eccles
First features on "Hollies Greatest", Parlophone PCS 7057, August 1968. Note that the mono version of the LP (PMC 7057) is the ONLY place you'll find the mono mix of "Jennifer Eccles" other than the original single. It's never been issued on CD, and is actually something of a rarity, as the mono mix runs for nearly ten seconds longer.

 

Some copies of 'Twenty Golden Greats' UK album released in 1978 featured the original mono hit single version of 'Yes I Will' enhanced for stereo, while others featured the alternate faster stereo version originally mistakenly issued on 'Hollies Greatest' in 1968 which is also on the CD version too

the vinyl LP of 'Twenty Golden Greats' has 'Stop Stop Stop' in mono by mistake, but it's in stereo on the CD version

'Stay' as featured on stereo 'Hollies Greatest' in 1968 had also appeared in true if basic stereo on 'Stay With The Hollies' stereo version PCS 3054 earlier in January 1964 with the slightly differing guitar solo to the mono hit single version (most noticeable is that there is a very slight 'build up' on guitar for the solo with a few notes in stereo before the guitar fully hits the solo, while in the mono hit version the guitar comes straight in at full blast playing the solo, it's very brief but just enough to be a noticeable difference - Ron Richards probably edited the take slightly for the mono single version mix to make it sound more dynamic and instant)

 

FWIW the flipback cover says "6711", so maybe it was issued in November?

 

Thanks for the information. A few comments:

Are you sure this was done via 2 4-tracks in sync? Or was it made by bouncing from 4-track to 4-track? If there were 7 or 8 tracks to mix from, it's somewhat surprising the final stereo mix is as basic as it is.

Note this was first remixed in the early '90s for the 30th Anniversary set but was not included on it. I've heard the beginning of that mix, and my recollection is it is even more deconstructed than the 2010 remix. My feeling was that mix was from 3 stages of 4-track tapes, while the newer mix was only from the final 2, although it's been a few years since I've compared.

My guess is the actual 1972 mix has the backing vocals in the breaks; what's on the 30th Anniversary set very clearly has edits in those spots to a different mix, and I believe Ron Furmanek has commented to that effect.

I haven't heard it, but what does it run 10 seconds longer compared to? The CDs of 20 Golden Greats and Epic Anthology both have the stereo mix, but 20 Golden Greats has an 11 second longer fade. Is the mono 10 seconds longer than *that*? Or actually about the same?

 

I liked the 2003 hollies greatest hits album. I thought that sounded best less shrill etc. I also like 1993 remix of dear eloise on another greatest hits album. The 1973 hits albums was a favorite of mine in my teens

 

I assume "King Midas in Reverse" was the same situation as the orchestra on "A Day in the Life".

 

Is there documentation to that effect? Because it doesn’t really sound like it.

 

How could I forget that?! I am sorry, I messed up there!

 

Regarding "King Midas", they were heavily into experimenting with recording techniques at the time, particularly slowing down and speeding up tapes. The Beatles had tried the same technique of using two machines to create an 8-track recorder when they recorded "Only A Northern Song" earlier in the year. That too didn't work, and we wouldn't hear it in stereo until "Anthology" pieced it all together with a computer in 1994.

Ron Furmanek did remix "King Midas" for his 1993 "30th Anniversary Collection", but it was vetoed by the Hollies for inclusion, along with his mix of "Carrie Anne". They are the only two pre-1971 tracks on the compilation presented in their original stereo mix. The Hollies' reason for disliking the mixes has never been elaborated on, apparently Graham Nash loved Ron's new mix of "Midas". So I didn't include it in my comments, as it's not officially available and I've never heard it.

I wonder how bad his mix must have appeared to the Hollies if they turned it down, but approved the utter abomination that is the 2010 mix?!

 

The SHM-CD?

 

Side comment for lucpac - interesting what you say in your OP about "not finding " an earlier discussion.
I was looking for the What's That Sound Buffalo Springfield thread just now and couldn't find it either.
Maybe it was deleted?

 

Hey Cameron.39 don't worry re stereo 'Stay' - the whole field re stereo and mono tracks and variations etc is massive and it's very easy to overlook things for the most informed people - which I know you are re Hollies

 

Again, is this documented somewhere, re King Midas? Or is it speculation? I ask because there doesn't seem to be any reason why they would have done so. For A Day In The Life they wanted to record the orchestra multiple times to get a larger sound, but I'm not hearing that on King Midas, which seems to be a much smaller ensemble. It's also mixed like a straight 4-track recording.

I haven't compared every track, but I'm Alive seems like it's probably just the original mix tweaked slightly.

 

The SHM CD isn't an official release, and it's source for the mono "Jennifer Eccles" is the vinyl LP or single.

It was part of a radio interview with Graham Nash several years ago. I can't remember which one and where off the top of my head. He explained his absolute distaste for the 2010 remix, and explained his frustration re Ron Furmanek's remix and the other Hollies not allowing it on the compilation. Graham said it was the stereo mix that the song deserved.
He also explained, rather than bounce down the tracks, they decided to just record over eight tracks and the theory was that they would remain in sync. The Hollies experimented with lots of recording techniques, especially around that time. For me, the most impressive was their use of out of phase speaker monitors. Two huge speakers playing the mono track back, pointing at each other and one is out of phase (+ and - reversed) with a directional vocal mic placed in the middle. They'd be able to hear the track without headphones and sing along in time, and no audio from the backing would be spilled onto the vocal track.

 

I can't comment on the latter, but why would you claim it isn't an official release?

Are you sure about that? SOP at EMI was one speaker, with the microphone set to figure-of-eight, with the null pointed towards the speaker. The two speaker story sounds like somebody got confused.

 

It's a Japanese only release, not endorsed by the Hollies themselves, who own their own catalogue and lease it back to EMI. The Japanese issues weren't recognised as being official versions of the albums.

As for the speaker comment, see this video, around the 2:10 mark:

 

They are official releases, released by Warner music.

Nearly certain he's mistaken, for multiple reasons:

1) EMI didn't have Altec 604Es, they had Altec 605As.
2) The speakers he describes, which *were* used for overdubbing, were not Altecs, but rather EMI's own "White Elephant" speakers.
3) It's well documented that it was standard practice at EMI to place a speaker at a 90 degree angle to a mic set to figure of eight when overdubbing, pre-headphones.

My guess is he was mixing up 2 out of phase speakers with the fact that the two sides of a mic set to figure of eight are out of phase with each other, so any sound hitting both sides equally (as it does at a 90 degree angle) cancels out.