Is Liz Phair one of Rock's Greatest Living Tragedies?

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by I333I, Mar 1, 2013.

  1. I333I

    I333I Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Ventura
    I've been listening to her first 2 cd's again. They are masterpieces, IMHO. They are still fresh, edgy, have great hooks and a nice helping of bad attitude. I remember being a bit put off when I read an interview after Whip Smart when she made a comment about wanting commercial success.
    From then on she went from "okay" to "horrid", again IMHO.
    Is Liz Phair one of Rock's Greatest Tragedies? Will she ever come back to us?
     
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  2. Holy Diver

    Holy Diver Member Of The Midnight Society

    Location:
    Greater St. Louis
    Did she die? I don't consider her a tragedy. I liked her stuff when it came out, and not bad to look at. Not everyone can be The Stones.
     
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  3. I333I

    I333I Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Ventura
    She isn't dead, hence the word "living" in the title of the thread.
     
  4. ReadySteady

    ReadySteady Custom Title

    Yeah, shame on her for wanting commercial success. :rolleyes:

    I enjoy all of her albums (well, that last one was kind of a letdown, but whatever). She's doing what she wants so I say more power to her.
     
  5. dsky

    dsky Little Blue Light

    Location:
    Fukuoka
    Hmmm, she'd have some stiff competition for that title but she sure did go downhill. Fast.
    Exile was amazing. Whipsmart was middling to poor. Everything after that was shocking, not that I paid much attention post-WS.
     
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  6. I333I

    I333I Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Ventura


    She expressed disappointment in record sales even though she was quite respected (at the time) in the indie world. I sensed a shift into new territory and I was right. A shame indeed.
     
  7. Do you want fame but work for free?
     
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  8. ReadySteady

    ReadySteady Custom Title

    A person doesn't make a living from critical respect alone.
     
  9. I333I

    I333I Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Ventura

    I don't know. Ask Om, Sleep, Love, Enslaved, Pallbearer, Cornelius, YOB, The Sword....
     
  10. I333I

    I333I Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Ventura
    Yes, but one might question that person's motives, no? After her first two cd's her output is ****. Why? Because she choose to work with terrible producers, take on an imaginary image and write songs that were pale versions of her earlier works.
     
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  11. ReadySteady

    ReadySteady Custom Title

    I would rank whitechocolatespaceegg right with Exile and ahead of Whip-Smart, so I guess you could say I disagree.
     
  12. ElizabethH

    ElizabethH Well-Known Member

    Location:
    SE Wisconsin,USA
    Yeah, shame on her for doing what she wanted instead of what some fan wanted.
    No artists should be alowed to have thier own thoughts once some guy gloms on to them.At that moment the artist should be 'flash frozen' and shipped off to fulfill the dream of the worshipping fan.
    Maybe for her she did not get what she hoped to gain.. but that happens to most people.
     
  13. Fullbug

    Fullbug Forum Resident

    The lesson here is: you have to tour if you want to score.
     
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  14. power popper

    power popper Forum Resident

    I like Exile in Guyville, Whip-Smart and white chocolate space egg just fine. To me, the self-titled album signaled in can't-miss terms that Liz wanted across-the-board pop success on a par with the teen acts of the day. My problem is not with that particular ambition, but that she sold herself so short in her attempt to achieve it. Suddenly, everything special about her previous music was drained out to fit a formula, and the result didn't satisfy anyone -- except Liz herself (or so she claimed) and a few who'd never heard her before and liked the single "Why Can't I?" As far as I can tell, the experience gained her nothing artistically or monetarily (though I could be wrong on either point). I didn't even know Somebody's Miracle had come out until long after its release date. By then, I and many others had moved on.

    Only time will tell whether Phair makes any kind of change in her music that redeems her as an artist. She might be perfectly happy to take the Rod Stewart template -- a career filled with slick, serviceable fodder and speckled with the occasional brilliant reminder of early glories -- and run with it.
     
  15. markbrow

    markbrow Forum President

    Location:
    Denver
    I loved her early albums. My daughter loved her later albums. Win/win.
     
  16. Jackson

    Jackson Forum Resident

    Location:
    MA, USA
    But it wasn't critical respect that ''did' her in, any attention she's ever gotten was as a result of it.
     
  17. Monosterio

    Monosterio Forum Resident

    Location:
    South Florida
    This thread needs photos:

    [​IMG]
     
  18. ampmods

    ampmods Forum Resident

    Location:
    Boston, MA, USA
    She had a good run. But what should her career have looked like? It's not like she was as edgey as someone like PJ Harvey or Bjork. She was more like Sheryl Crow. Nevertheless... she had/has a career making music and she could probably tour on any of those earlier albums even now and sell tickets.
     
  19. audiotom

    audiotom Ground Control to Major Tom

    Location:
    New Orleans La USA
    Her first three albums are great, wcse should have been the commercial breakthrough, it is a real shame it wasn't more heavily promoted.

    When she / her record label started bringing in Avril Lavine's formulatic songwriters it was all downhill

    "I am extraordinary if you ever get to know me, average every day saint psycho super godess" is a long way from Stratford on Guy

    I also didn't like her new "I just had singing lessons" recast vocal delivery - very thin and it lost all her playfulness and vulnerability

    It's unfair to say that Guyville was her only flash of brilliance, but it was a steep and disappointing drop off post wcse
     
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  20. slstokes2216

    slstokes2216 Forum Resident

    Location:
    USA
    I'm with you. She allowed us, even encouraged us, to believe that she was a unique voice and personality who had relished being indie and independent of the old star making system. She wasn't.
     
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  21. AZRunner

    AZRunner Forum Resident

    Location:
    Tampa, FL
    The white mesh top with white shorts? :p I'd forgotten how hot she was, actually I'd forgotten her, period.
     
  22. dumangl

    dumangl Forum Resident

    I only have Exile In Guysville and I think it's very good. I really need to explore her work further.
     
  23. Rfreeman

    Rfreeman Forum Resident

    Location:
    Lawrenceville, NJ
    I'm going with Jim Gordon
     
  24. Monosterio

    Monosterio Forum Resident

    Location:
    South Florida
    :agree: ... :drool:
    :(

    Btw, I consider it one rock's greatest tragedies that I can't post that pic here.:winkgrin:
     
  25. Rfreeman

    Rfreeman Forum Resident

    Location:
    Lawrenceville, NJ
    Saw Liz live after her second album and she was absolutely terrible. Can't carry a tune. I imagine her recordings were spliced together from hundreds of takes.
     
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