Music Matters Definitive Blue Note 45 RPM and 33 & 1/3 RPM vinyl series (pt7)

Yes, I hear ya. I love this record!

 

Off topic, but interesting for Lee Morgan fans:
In Stores Tomorrow: Lee Morgan, THE ROULETTE SIDES 10” | Rhino

Edit: and a nice Kenny Clarke Francy Boland Big Band reissue, with picture sleeve
MPS

 

Woah! Thanks for the heads up. I may pick it up this weekend if my local shop has it in stock.

 

I still contend MM isn't pressing anymore, thus the price hike on their site. If people are willing to pay that much it's better for MM is they purchase straight through MM than a second party. They are trying to maximize profits before they run out. With the shortage of pressing plants I think it would be difficult for them to just press more. I'm just happy I got my 33's I wanted. Don't really want the 45s. I predict in one or two years these titles will be gone and not more will be produced. I might be off on the time line; but I'm almost certain once the inventory is gone that will be it.

 

Those prices fluctuate, sometimes dramatically. We discussed this months ago when MM began this pricing practice and some members bought up titles thinking that it would be the last chance to get it, only to see it drop in price a couple months later after being "out of stock" for a bit. So it's assumed that prices go up as runs deplete, rather than a title actually approaching the licensed limit.

 

Shady

 

They get potential buyers to think it's on its last legs and hike the prices. Then print some more and start the process all over again.

 

It's aggravating to read these ongoing complaints about pricing when the records were initially available at reasonable prices for quite some time, and it wasn't a secret they were coming out or that they were extremely well done. Maybe if there had been more support for these excellent reissues earlier, Music Matters might be in better shape now.

 

There was PLENTY of support. You're making assertions that just aren't true. The real shananigans started when MM pulled distribution to other retailers. As a reminder, they asserted that they were doing this to keep prices consistent, as some other retailers were playing pricing games. But almost immediately, MM started to raise their prices. They raised the retail on their 33s from $35 to $40. But soon only offered the $40 price to subscribers, upping the price individually to $44. But that price didn't last long, as popular titles were soon raised to $48 to $56 to $65.

Then, as someone stated, they'd get in some new stock and lower the price for a short while to $44, then it would go up again without warning.

This is really bad customer service, or it least doesn't look good. A restaurant sometimes has to raise prices on a certain item because of a sudden burst of costs to produce it - say, the cost of beef goes up $2 per pound. Okay, fine. And they usually will inform the customers of that on the menu with an apology for the raising the prices. But there's no explanation for MM raising the costs. And supply siders and ultra-capitalists here don't seem to care about the effect that poor customer service, including poor communication, has on its customers. There are many here, maybe not a majority, but many who have a bitter taste in their mouth about purchasing their product, as wonderful as the product may be.

 

Exactly. Let me wait a decade and then start trying to buy them and then bitch about it.

 

Bitter taste in their mouth? That's a bit dramatic. These are records, not medical insurance. You'll be ok if you don't buy something from a manufacturer that upsets you. While I'm no fan of price hikes (who is?), let's try to put things in perspective. Your restaurant analogy is also a false equivalency. The restaurant didn't have to deal with retailers inflating their prices on the food they prepared for many years. Price hikes notwithstanding, it's still often cheaper to get a fair bit of titles directly from Music Matters, including the ones they raised prices on.

We also aren't privy to the financial reality of running Music Matters and what they have to contend with. We have no idea what their books are like. There could be a myriad of reasons for why prices went up beyond nefarious greed many seem hell bent on insinuating. If you want to get rich quick, I can think of a million other avenues to take before reissuing 50+ year old jazz records to audiophiles. That actually sounds like a recipe to get broke quick. How they even dealt with some of us for a decade is a miracle in of itself. Some guys here will return 5 records in a row if they hear one measly tick on an otherwise perfect record. Imagine eating losses like that all the time.

FYI - This pricing point has really been beaten to death.

 

NO manufacturer does fluctuating prices like that. And no supplier would be able to get away with it. And you have completely ignored the facts. Your blind support, no matter what they do, astounds me. You're like an abused wife who stands behind their husband no matter what. Sheesh.

Go ahead and buy. That's your prerogative. As I previously stated, I know there are those who feel the way you do. There are also plenty who feel the way I do. And there will be more who will express their frustration who are new to MM and experience their weird pricing scheme. Just don't be surprised when that happens.

 

Hear hear and totally agree

 

There are a few. And no one has been harping on and on and on about it as you do.

The majority of the folks here understand MMs stance and arent bawlbags about it.

 

The series is over. I have all the titles and I paid retail for them all. I never said you aren't entitled to your feelings and opinions, or that you couldn't express them. Likewise, I should be able to express mine without being called an abused wife standing by her man. That's just insulting, and uncalled for. I'm no sycophant, but I'm not going to keep complaining about the same thing over and over again. Especially when free will is involved. There's a lot I don't like. I may voice my opinion about it once or twice, but I'll leave it at that and move on.

You've made it apparent for quite sometime that you aren't happy with Music Matters. We've heard you loud and clear. Do a search for your name in this thread and take an inventory of your posts. A big chunk of it is you just complaining. How long are you going to continue posting the same thing in the same thread about a company you are clearly upset with?

Ok, fine. Music Matters raised their prices. That sucks. You told us it sucks. We know it does. Oh well, life goes on. So what do you want us to do about it? Join you in protest by posting angry messages on forums? What are you accomplishing by repeating this ad nauseam?

Not sure about you, but when I'm disgusted by something, I leave it alone and move on. You seem to remain on the periphery of this thread, posting the same complaints at any given opportunity. It would be one thing if these posts were around the same time period, but they aren't. I can go back a year, and you'll be there posting the same thing. I can almost copy and paste your posts.

Suit yourself, but it's rather annoying to see this thread bumped up thinking there's news on the horizon or a lively discussion about the available titles or the music, only to see it's you again complaining about prices. It's been years now.

 

What MM did was ethically wrong, not the pricing issue, how they lied about the distributors mishandled the product. It was a flat-out lie.

They can do whatever they want with the pricing because most titles were available at issue price for a long time. They lost me as a customer when they forced subscription to get regular pricing and charged a premium for select titles. They look like a wounded animal slowly dieing now with their pricing games. Sad, great product poorly run company IMO.

 

Some people handle liar's better than other's, I'm in the same camp as you. I dislike being lied to.

 

I only have five MM re issues, one 33 and four 45s, the mastering is excellent I can't complain, sleeves are awesome also but the pressing quality is very inconsistent. They are supposed to be a premiun product right?? Well three of five have a fair amount of clicks, one 45 even have S shaped marks and hairlines, the S mark doesn't affect playing in any way and I can live with a non esthetically perfect record but the hairlines make a repeated click noise and that is very annoying, is not too loud but is there. I can't blame the seller because records came sealed but after paying $90 each (with $20 shipping included) sometimes more, is really disappointing. Also after MM increase the price of a particular title on their web, re sellers like Import Cds increase their prices too that sucks IMO.

I wasn't aware of MM reissues until one year ago so maybe it is my fault and I can't complain too much about their prices but the quality control of the records OMG, maybe it is an american plants problem (QRP also) because of the vinyl boom and increased demand but why MOFI sells almost perfect records?? both are pressed at RTI right? and both are premiun products. I was thinking that maybe I have very bad luck with Music Matters but then I found this blog with a review of Clarke-Bolan the Golden 8 Clarke – Boland: The Golden 8 (1961) Blue Note MM33 excellent sound and click and pops, that is exactly how my records sound.

Don't get me wrong I love Music Matters and appreciate the effort of producing excellent sounding BN classics. I only have five at the moment but I will buy more in the future even with all the pressing and QC problems everytime I put on my turntable MM titles like Basra, Solid or True Blue I wish a could buy the whole MM catalog but with the expensive shipping and not knowing if a lemon will come my wish list has been reduced to twenty titles.

 

I got news for you that feel your "lied to". That IS the music industry. The entire industry is smoke and mirrors.

From the ability of the engineer to manipulate sound to make the artist sound better than they actually are to the marketing of companies screaming "Last chance wharehouse find!!"

And guess what? Even the "appalled" buyers are in the game at times. Nobody flips for a profit here now do they? Or buys two super duper two step mfsl's in order to make a few bucks? Naaaah, no one supplements their habit to do that!

That is the nature of entertainment. Its like used car salesmen. There will always be something better and more amazing!!! It will be LIMITED!!!! Buy now or forever regret it (eventhough the mastering of Kind Of Blue will be redone AGAIN in 3 or 4 yrs)

The MMs guys are simply carrying on a tradition. Be smart enough to realize that it is a game and sometimes a little bit rough. And do not be surprised when people that sale music for a living in the end want to make a bit of money. Or at least break even.

 

Do you guys listen to these records? Does anyone want to talk about them?

 

Sure. Ive talked about them quite a bit. Start a convo since you are interested in doing so

 

Oh, I've tried many times myself.

I recently got Hank Mobley's Quartet and Quintet albums and Paul Chambers Quintet.

Hank Mobley Quartet was initially issued as a 10" and was recorded in 1955. It sounds just like you'd expect a record from that error to sound: congested, muffled, far from audiophile in any sense. But Mobley shines through. The performances are worth hearing even if the technology wasn't there to capture them in highest fidelity.

Hank Mobley Quintet is a different story. Both were recorded in Hackensack, in mono, but by this time something must have changed in RVG's technology or technique. Perhaps both. The clarity here is pretty stunning for a record of this age.

I've only had a chance to spin one disc of the Paul Chambers Quintet and that was while the kid was playing. Such a bass led album will need a proper listen at night, on headphones.

I'm within 10 of having all the 45s that weren't repeated on 33. I have all the 33s. Best vinyl reissue program in history, in my opinion. I hope they keep going with more Blue Notes or another label.

 

Well, as far as I'm concerned I bought 4 MM releases and love the hell out of them, although I paid top dollar (guess I got on the band wagon too late). However, these will be my last ones I buy until there is a price drop. However, I still have a feeling they won't be pressing these continually and this may be the ed of the line for them. Sure even at the original $35 price range I would have thought they were a steal. Jazz is the one musical genre I'm really picky about as far as sound quality, so again I picked out my most wanted Blue Note releases and love them. Fact is these are the best sounding Blue Note releases (more so than the originals from what I've read) so if you take that into account I'd much rather pay their retail price for a better sounding product than two a three times as much for an original.

 

I agree on Quintet... Excellent sound on that one. Never heard the Chambers, unfortunately.

 

The Paul Chambers record is interesting. When Chambers leads, you get all the nimbleness of his playing, including his famous bow work. When the horns (Donald Byrd and Clifford Jordan) lead, you get a pretty typical Blue Note blowing session. When Elvin Jones solos, you get a young and future master pushing against the constraints of hard bop in 1957. But it coheres fairly well and the whole is greater than the sum of its parts. And the parts are pretty damn good, too.