Need to upgrade

Discussion in 'Audio Hardware' started by mooseman, Apr 21, 2017.

  1. mooseman

    mooseman Forum Resident Thread Starter

    I was checking this one out, what da think?
    TEAC TN-400S (Bordeaux)
    Poor guy here...need a working horse TT like the old Technics 1200. No sissy TT like Rega, Pro ject or Orbit with the straight tone arm and hard to replace cards.
     
  2. c-eling

    c-eling Forum Resident

    Workhorse you say?
    Terchnics SL-1900, thing is a DD beast :agree:
     
  3. mooseman

    mooseman Forum Resident Thread Starter

    :( I should have started a thread on what's the best Beatle album pressing to buy, mono or stereo? What's up people, dude needs help here.
    I'm poor but not that poor.
     
    c-eling likes this.
  4. patient_ot

    patient_ot Forum Resident

    Location:
    USA
    I wouldn't buy that. I'd hit up local shops, CL, USAudioMart, etc. and find what it sounds like you really want - a used Japanese direct drive that accepts a universal headshell. Do not get hung up on the brand. Look for the heavy S-shaped arm, universal headshell, and quartz lock.
     
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  5. patient_ot

    patient_ot Forum Resident

    Location:
    USA
    This makes no sense.
     
  6. c-eling

    c-eling Forum Resident

    :laugh:
    You'd be surprised...
    If I ever need to work on it some kids even did a neat CAD breakdown of it :D
     
  7. mooseman

    mooseman Forum Resident Thread Starter

    That's what I want, S-shaped arm and universal head shell, quartz, real metal body, NO PLASTIC. So that Tech that I listed is not good?
     
  8. patient_ot

    patient_ot Forum Resident

    Location:
    USA
    The TEAC you listed is not what you just described. It's a belt drive TT with a cheap built in preamp. IIRC a number of this model also had issues with QC and would start going haywire with the speed control/pitch after a few months of use. I wouldn't touch one of those, personally.

    The Technics is a different ballgame. The problem you are going to have is that anything with the Technics name gets marked up by secondhand sellers. Another Japanese brand with similar specs and features will often sell for less. Look around and see what's out there locally. Don't buy anything used online. When you find something, look up the specs and download the manual on Vinyl Engine. Make sure everything is working and that you can fully test it before you buy.

    Re: these types of old Japanese direct drives, there will be some plastic. I wouldn't get hung up about it, though stay away from the really super lightweight cheap models. Those won't have the S-arm anyway. If you don't like the look of the hybrid plastic/metal body on a lot of these turntables, you can have it re-plinthed by building your own or having someone build a custom plinth for you down the road when you have more money.
     
    Helom likes this.
  9. mooseman

    mooseman Forum Resident Thread Starter

    This is really depressing. I hope my audio tech 120 lasts for another year.
     
  10. Helom

    Helom Forum Resident

    Location:
    U.S.
    What is your absolute maximum budget?

    It's already been covered in the last thread, but the Pioneer PLX-1000 is the most robust DD turntable you'll find (new) under $600. Never mind the naysayers, these turntables are built like tanks. The tonearm bearings are a non-issue. You can spend much more than $600 on a tonearm alone, and still get one with loose bearings. I have experienced this myself with some highly regarded tonearms.
    IME, a little bearing looseness does not affect the sound, as there are constant forces in play that keep them from chattering. If you get one with this minor issue, you should be able to return it if you buy from an authorized dealer.

    Did you get some hands on experience with one of the cheapo belt-drives available from Pro-ject and others in this price range? They feel like toys, nothing like the Pioneer.

    If you absolutely can't swing $600 (less for a used one) for the Pioneer, I suggest looking for a restored vintage Pioneer, Yamaha, or Kenwood DD table. Some very nice examples can often be found on eBay for $300 to $500.
     
    mooseman likes this.
  11. mooseman

    mooseman Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Thanks Helom, I needed some more positive view points on the Pioneer. The negatives on the Pioneer keep coming, so I am in limbo. I can afford to spend up to $1000 and some change but I don't want to spend on those brands that I have mentioned. One problem is that the pioneer keeps getting that tag (DJ Turntable) I hate that.
     
  12. patient_ot

    patient_ot Forum Resident

    Location:
    USA
    Explain? You will have to put in some legwork if you want a decent vintage turntable.
     
  13. patient_ot

    patient_ot Forum Resident

    Location:
    USA
    $1K should be plenty for a nice vintage Japanese direct drive. RE: the Pioneer, it's no more a DJ unit than some of the other stuff discussed here or what you are using now.

    Put a DJ cart on it and a slipmat and it's a DJ deck. Put a nice home listening cart on it, a rubber or cork mat, and now it's an audiophile deck. All depends on how you set it up.
     
  14. mooseman

    mooseman Forum Resident Thread Starter

    I wonder if I should just buy another audio technica 120...I keep going around circles with the Pioneer and a refurbished Technics. I can get a refurbished Technics at a store here in NYC Turntable Lab, a bunch of kids work there, another negative for me but they will service the TT if there's anything wrong with it. $850. Technics: SL-1200MK5 Turntable - Stokyo MCC Refurbished
     
  15. Helom

    Helom Forum Resident

    Location:
    U.S.
    The "DJ" term will always be tagged to these turntables, just as it will with others like it. Don't get hung up on this label, it's a good thing. These are built to withstand a beating from road travel and club use.

    Some more personal insight: I had a $3000 VPI Classic in my system for a while and it was not a big upgrade over the Pioneer. It managed to do a couple things better, but definitely wasn't worth the price gap IMO. Maybe my preamp at the time wasn't up to snuff?...Idk. I now have an $3000 Acoustic Signature, it is also better, but mostly due to my personal preference in the way it presents the music, not so much in terms of background noise, detail extraction, or tracking. It has more to do with PRaT.

    HifiGuy believes his Rega P3 is a big improvement, I have no reason to doubt his assessment. IMO, you should still consider the P3 despite its lack of a removable headshell. Needle Doctor sells both Rega and Pioneer. I would give them a call, explain your situation, concerns and budget, and see what they recommend.
     
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  16. Helom

    Helom Forum Resident

    Location:
    U.S.
    Buying another AT120 would be a huge mistake. :shake: I've also owned one of those.

    Another thing to consider with the Pioneer is that it also has some minor upgrade paths. The feet can be replaced with Isonoe feet, the KAB tonearm damper can be fitted to the Pioneer, as well as upgraded headshells.
     
    Last edited: Apr 21, 2017
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  17. patient_ot

    patient_ot Forum Resident

    Location:
    USA
    TTLab apparently doesn't accept returns on those units. That would be a dealbreaker for me. I'd be inclined to find a refurb elsewhere, or buy a used one that is not totally trashed and send it to a specialist for repair/going over. If you do buy used, make sure you don't overpay and you set aside a budget for repair work. They are tanks, but repair work is not uncommon on these, especially if they were DJ'd to death (trashed tonearm bearings and such) or modded in some kind of half-assed way.
     
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  18. davidb1

    davidb1 Well-Known Member

    Location:
    Atlanta, GA
    Why not post a WTB in the sub-forum here with location and budget?
     
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