Now using the Tascam DR-05 handheld recorder for needledrops

I searched the forum for info on the Tascam DR-05 recorder. Got one yesterday from Guitar Center. At $74, you know it's gotta be a piece of junk, right? But between the 24 bit conversion [with sampling rates up to 96k] and the battery power, the sonic results are noticeably better for my needledrops than the onboard resources of the I-MAC that I previously used for A/D conversion. The results seem both quieter and smoother using this cheap handheld recorder than using the convertors on the I-MAC. I wonder if anyone else has any experience with this little recorder. The suggested retail is $179 but seems to have a street price under $100.

The recording medium of the TASCAM DR-05 is a tiny memory chip. The installed chip is 2 gig, enough for two hours of stereo recording at 44.1/24. There's a USB 2 interface that enables one to take the Wav [or MP-3] file and drop it into editing software, like Audacity. There's also built-in microphones. I haven't given that part of the recorder a real workout. So far, seems like it would be fine for interviews but less than ideal for music. The 1/8 inch microphone/line input is set for peaking around -10db, which doesn't allow for overload for a hot signal from a mixing board. But the phono signal from the Kenwood KR 9600's tape out is low in level, so I have no problems with overloading. I am really surprised at how good the sound is on needledrops made with this device. Anyone else try this hand-held recorder?

 

I've heard a couple of samples on the web and this one sounds pretty good. It's with the built-in omni mikes. I think it sounds quiet and has good sound, better than with some others I've heard.

http://soundcloud.com/cliffetzel/dr0000-0001-edit

The only thing I wonder is if this machine has true line-in capabilities, or is it an attenuated mike input?

What do others think?

 

I've had to drop the level on the recorder slightly to dub LPs that are cut "hot", otherwise no problems. Although it obviously will need a passive attenuator if one intends to hook up to a +4db line out, it doesn't have a problem with my Kenwood KR 9600. The Kenwood has two Phono Preamp inputs, one has a greater overload margin and that's the one I'm using. I suspect that much of the DR-05's cost cutting comes from the device's digital nature. I've read that more expensive models from Tascam have a toggle switch between "Line In" and "Microphone In." I'm not sure if the difference is realized in the digital domain. However, 24 bits ought to allow a lot of room for attenuation in the digital domain. There's an onboard limiter on this baby. $74. Unbelievable!

I was just playing some needledrops made with the DR-05 over the rig that has the turntable. The needledrops are very similar in character to the LPs. Mind you, that's playing back the CDs I burned off the Wav file recorded by the DR-05. Playback over the handheld's d/a is 'thinner' sounding than the CD player. Have to say that some of the de-clicked dubs sound better than just playing the LP. But the best LPs have a touch more of that "something" than the dubs. However, it is very close.

 

This looks interesting. I've been patiently perusing craigslist for a used cd-recorder because I thought these digital recorders were too expensive, but at $75 I might be in.

What are you using to mate the RCA outs from your phonostage to the 1/8" input jack?

 

A half-meter Monster Cable, RCA plugs on one end, 1/8" stereo plug on the other. Was given to me at a street sale last year. When going from the tape out of the Harman Kardon 630, I used a lower end 3 meter interconnect, also with 1/8" plugs to RCA plugs. That was from Guitar Center. There was something producing hum with the HK set-up, probably the phono pre, though something may have been electrically hinky in hooking up the vintage receiver to an I-Mac. In any case, the Kenwood's preamp is quite good and very quiet, the interface between the Kenwood and the Tascam works out better. I suspect that battery power has something to do with the overall cleanliness of the sound.

 

I have the DR-100 which I bought along with some mics to do some stealth concert recording, but the device doubles wonderfully as a vinyl ripper for the same reason the OP stated. I think TASCAM makes some quality products.

 

I use the DR-100 exclusively for all needledrops - it's a killer piece of kit and my transfer results are outstanding (all done @ 24/96).

VP

 

Not the DR-05, but I have two DR-08s for live recording. As you say, one must be careful with the line-in levels. I've contemplated buying or making an attenuator but haven't gotten around to it yet.

My main complaint would be it seems somewhat noisy when using external mics. It seems pretty quiet with the internal mics, but when I plug in external mics the noise level rises noticeably. Not sure if that is an issue with the DR-05 or not.

Also, battery life is not what I'd like to see.

That said, they are still quite impressive, especially for the price. I just got some 16 GB micro SD cards for $18 apiece. Pretty amazing, for more than 16 hours of record time at 24/44.1.

 

I didn't buy the little recorder with the intention of returning to live recording. The lack of noise when hooked up to the Kenwood KR 9600 is a big, big plus. As a line-level recorder,the DR-05 has very little self-noise.

It would be great would be for Tascam to make an ADC for recording only,designed to hook up easily to outboard gear. This recorder would have inputs for XLRs, 1/4" & 1/8" jacks and RCA inputs. Maybe a pair of phantom power mic inputs, but the ability to easily hook up to pro gear would be the focus here. I'd give it bigger meters, a backlighting option and a decent breakout power supply—I'd love to try a gel cell as a power supply. It could be the Swiss Army Knife for concert documentation/live recording. Just plug it in to the output of the Mackie or SSL or whatever.

 

I also use a DR-100 for needledrops. Fabulous device.

 

Many devices a step up have dual XLR/TRS inputs with phantom power. For 1/8" or RCA you would just need adapters or the right cables.

 

There are many shaver recorders on the market
Not many like line ip levels
They are designed for mic/instrument use, -60,-40 dB not 0 or+22 dB...
External pads or the more expensive larger versions are the answer imho.

 

So I've done a little poking around and it seems I would likely need some sort of attenuator to use this device either connected directly to my phono-pre or to the tapeouts on my integrated amp. Robin L, you don't mention using any kind of attenuator. Is that right? The signal from my phono-pre is considerably lower level than the signal coming from my cd player. Maybe it's low enough to work without an attenuator?

 

It all depends on what the levels are.

It's been a while since I've experimented, but I *think* I was ok with my phono stage but had issues with my CD players.

 

Are there any handheld recorders capable of 24/192?

 

And I thought I had it easy recoding my band with a mini disc (over cassette tapes)

 

I use the DR2D for needledrops. Love the results!

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B003838PHQ/ref=oh_o03_s00_i00_details

 

Haven't tried with CDs but there's no reason to anyway—rip 'em instead. I am not using an attenuator with the Kenwood KR 9600 as phono preamp. Levels have to be set low but sonically there's no problems. Works better than any other LP recording device I've previously owned.

 

So I grabbed one of these over the weekend. Figured it was a good solution for me since my stereo is in a different room than my computer and I can use it to record my kids' piano recitals.

My inaugural needledrop was a German Island pressing of John Cale's Caribbean Sunset album, not because it sounds particularly good (it doesn't) but because it has never been issued on cd.

I first tried hooking up the Tascam unit directly to the outs of my phono pre, but the levels were way too high that way. Second try was to hook it up to the pre-amp outs of my integrated amp. That way the output level was adjustable with my volume control and I was able to get a pretty much ideal signal going into the Tascam. I monitored the recording on headphones using the Tascam's headphone/lineout jack. SQ from there was not very good, but that was not reflective of how the actual recording sounded--just a crummy headphone stage.

My first attempt turned out to be a bit of a bust. I recorded at 96k/24 bit wav (best possible setting on the Tascam) only to discover that my editing software, Sony Sound Forge 8.0, does not support that level of resolution (I guess I need to upgrade to version 10.0). So I had to dial the Tascam back to cd resolution level 44.1k/16 bit. After that I was able to do a bit of editing, get the tracks into iTunes, convert to Apple Lossless for safekeeping, and downsample to a smaller file format for my iPod without too much trouble.

Anway, to get to the point of my longwinded tale, the little Tascam worked quite well. I did not find the functions/controls to be entirely intuitive, but the manual is reasonably well written so it was easy enough to get the job done. I have not attempted to compare my recording to the original lp on my main system--I guess I'd have to burn it to cd to that properly, so I'm not going to bother. But listening to the results on my iPod I am quite pleased. The tracks from Caribbean Sunset sound just fine and fit in quite nicely with the other cd-sourced John Cale tracks on my iPod.

So this seems like $75 well spent and I'm now in the needledrop business Thanks for the tip, Robin L

 

I use Audacity for editing functions. I can use 44.1/at 24 bit, useful for making CDs. This helps with level adjustments or EQ changes. I suspect you can find adaptors that will drop level to the recorder using a resistor network. That should offer better sound than going through the additional processing in the preamp. Whatever else is going on, the A/D converter in the DR-05 'sounds' really good.

 

Been doing this for a while with the Edirol R1 that I've had forever. The flash memory and lack of moving parts add no motor noise; it has line-in and monitor capability; my pre-amp has a gain control--no complaints, other than the 24/44.1 limit on it. The Tascam sounds nice for the price, especially if it does 24/96.

 

I considered other options for dropping the level, but I was happy to solve the issue without having to buy more stuff. I'm guessing for my purposes (listening at the gym or in the car with my iPod) any gains to be had by getting my pre-amp out of the chain would be negligible, but I could be wrong. . .

Audacity is free, isn't it? I bought Sound Forge several years ago as an ill-informed impulse buy when it was on sale at Fry's. The latest version will support the higher res file formats, but I may be better served to cut my losses and move on rather than pay to upgrade. This was my first time to ever actually use it. . .

 

I'd like to mention the Sanyo Xacti icr-xps01m is being closed out at Guitar Center for $69. I picked up two of them after checking into some online samples. I have several handheld recorders and this one is among the best. The ultra tiny omni microphones are excellent. I think you'll be surprised at how good it sounds and it is almost too small. It looks like an ultra-small cell phone. It could almost go on a key chain.

I've used the line in from an external preamp and the sound we equally excellent. Of course the preamp was a Sound Devices MP-1

Check out this demo on You tube.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tJ77l46Ekt4&feature=related

 

Audacity is free.

http://audacity.sourceforge.net/

I recommend "Click Repair' for $40. It's a bit of software that erases clicks and pops, leaving the music seemingly untouched. If you're a critical listener using high rez gear, you'll maybe hear artifacts, but for the sort of casual listening you're describing it's nowhere near as obnoxious as typical data reduced MP3s. Really works wonders for records that are a pain to hear without de-clicking.

http://www.clickrepair.net/

 

I know everyone swears by Click Repair. Sound Forge actually has some built in tools for click removal and noise reduction, but I wasn't too impressed with how they worked. Fortunately, my lp was very clean and had almost no quiet parts so I was mostly just tinkering with the fades. I figure when I run into a record with a lot of issues, I'll use Click Repair's 30 day free trial and see how much better it is.