It took a approximately four days for a response. They said they'd be in touch with details once the discs were ready, so I assume they are building an email list. They didn't mention proof of purchase but it wouldn't hurt to have it ready just in case.
It took me about two hours to get this reply: Dr. Rhino <[email protected]> Today at 4:52 PM To: Sparky Thank you for your email. Our production department has advised that replacement discs are being created. I will update you when they become available. I apologize for the inconvenience and thank you for your patience. If you have any questions, please let me know. Dr. Rhino (In my email I gave my mailing address and my order number and I attached a screen capture of my importcds receipt.)
Personally - and I am now almost ashamed to admit it - I spent the first several years of my Surround Music listening all but dismissing Quad. Several reasons; chief among them 1.) the lack of a centre channel and an LFE channel, 2.) very few of the Quad digital reissue offerings (on DTS CD at that stage) appealed to me, 3.) unfamiliar artists, unfamiliar albums (I was chicken.. and spoilt by Queen, Eagles, Fleetwood Mac et al on DVD-A in 5.1.. who the hell were Poco when they were at home? ), 4.) how could old out of date technology (so I thought) match upto spanky new 5.1 music in the 21st century (the new 5.1 surround stuff with 6-channels had to be better than that old Quad with only 4-channels.. haha!) 14 years down the line, I look back on "kindergarten Surround me" and I have to laugh.. and almost marvel at the education in - and greater appreciation of - Surround Music that Quad has given me. Hand on heart, I have had as much of a blast, if not more so, in the years since opening my mind to Quad than I ever had with 5.1.. my 5.1 music hobby was getting to the stage I was seeking out ever more obscure & harder and harder to find SACDs of new Surround Music, many woefully out of print and ball-bustlingly expensive on the aftermarket and the end result from a musical enjoyment and/or surround mix quality when I did manage to track down a large number of these 5.1's was underwhelming, to say the least.. so often the surround mixes were lacking, either room/venue ambience in the rears or just plain poorly mixed to my ears, especially relative to the surround mixes of Classic albums like Rumours, Hotel California, A Night At The Opera, etc.. I had been spoiled in the early 2000's by having the opportunity to hear some of my favourite albums and some truly Classic albums at that in great 5.1 surround and no disrespect to any artists or the mixing engineers behind those more obscure 5.1 SACDs etc and certain releases down the line but I felt like I was getting to the dregs and scraping the bottom of the barrel, for me the law of diminishing returns had well and truly set in. The time was right for me, to go ass-backwards relative to a number of Surround Music devotees here and at QQ, who I realise have been into this hobby many decades longer than me and did it the other way round, the logical/chromnological way around = Quad first, followed by a nice big gap where nobody gave a damn about Surround Music, then onto the 5.1 DTS/DVD-A/SACD era. I did DTS/DVD-A/SACD first, then went back and got into the legacy Quad scene. So after feeling like I'd exhausted the 5.1 offerings that were out there (I fully appreciate New 5.1 releases are coming out all the time, I am Not talking about them, I am talking about what was already out there in 5.1 at that point for me a few years ago versus what was out there from the selection of old Quads) and after taking the time, delving ever deeper into the Quad backstory and Quads immense contribution to Surround Music, by gaining experience of Quad mixes through sheer trial and error, broadening my musical horizons, exploring many hugely unfamiliar artists from America in the 70's (a number of those acts that saw release in Quad made little to no impression crossing over to this country and just weren't on my radar).. getting into 5.1 was like dipping a toe in the water (I picked up DVD-A's and DTS CD's from familiar artists and that felt good but years down the line again and again experimenting with unknown artists in 5.1 wasn't as much fun anymore.. I got into Quad and it was like plunging into a pool, still very much into the unknown but the polar opposite happened time and again I loved what I found, incredible artists from the 70's in albums full of unfamiliar but brilliant songs, incredible musicianship, production that was often sublime.. ..and well, that rather brings me to where I'm at with Surround music right now.. Chicago is just one of many great American artists who's 70's output I was quite unfamiliar with (grew up with them in the 80's/90's.. bit sappy, bit lightweight, could take or leave em, you know? my how I've come to discover how different a band they were in the 70's!) I have had the most wonderful time getting to know their music and all in Surround sound, thanks to so many of their albums from that era being released in Quadraphonic surround sound.. and well fast forward in time and here Chicago are now, back again on the Surround scene, with all 9 of their Quad releases represented in MultiChannel High Resolution quality in one set. Wow. This Quadio set is like going 'back to the future', we get to go back to that time, a golden era for some for popular music and its all hi-tech quality.. I hope it does well for Rhino and they choose to follow suit with releases for other artists who were well-represented in the Quad era (the Doobies and The Eagles come to mind right off the bat). Bravo Rhino Quadio! Hear Hear (oh and Hear Hear! for those rear rears..!) Oh and PS. I don't miss the Centre channel one bit.
Can you point to one or two releases that put you over the top when it came to quad. I can, and it's one of the obvious ones, but I would love to hear yours first if you have one. To get back to this release, quality full range speakers for your rears is a must. Many 5.1 stuff you can get away with smallish rears with quality mains. This mix will make poor rears sound poor. So much going on. As much as I like the Doors 5.1 mixes, if you listen to The Soft Parade, immediately after a Chicago disc, you realize how much music information is being pumped out of the rears. It is not a subtle. And that is a 5.1 mix I consider good which is telling...
That's a separate issue, but I don't believe for a second the lesser frequency response of my rear speakers is what is making quad mixes disappointing to listen to. They were disappointing (not the Chicago, but others) when I had full range speakers for the rears which was the case until 1 month ago. It's the mix itself. I have the living room I have. Walls aren't fungible. Balance isn't an issue at all with movies or 5.1 music mixes. The amount of clearance between the speakers and the wall is almost the same for my front and rear channels. There's about 3 feet from the back of my front tower speakers to the wall behind them. There's about 2.25 feet between the side of my rear speakers and the rear wall against which my chair (listening position) sits. It seems as if you are intent on trying to convince me my room and equipment are why I don't like the quad mixes.
Comparing a quad mix to a 5.1 mix is a very "personal preference" type of thing. If you don't like "stuff in the back", then you probably won't like a lot of quad mixes because when quad arrived is was an extension of the stereo concept and was in most pop/rock cases, not front-centric. The idea was to spread the mix around and isolate elements in different corners giving the listener a wider sound stage, although the lead vocal generally lived in the fronts. Only when the first home theater setups arrived and we moved from VHS and Beta HiFi to LaserDisc and finally DTS/SACD/DVD-A did the modern 5.1 audio mix emerge with a front focused mix with accents in the rear. An excellent example of a comparison would be the Billy Cobham "Spectrum" album, first available as a WB/Rhino DVD-A with a new style 5.1 mix, and just recently released Audio Fidelity SACD that contains the original quadraphonic mix from Atlantic that was up until now unreleased. If you have the opportunity to compare these two mixes, your preference between 5.1 and 4.0 will come out clearly and easily. Being an old quad guy, I was thrilled to finally hear the quad mix and prefer it much more than the DVD-A.
Got it. Just giving you my experience. In my other post quoting you, I specifically mentioned that there is a big difference in what you said first, don't hear the lead vocals, and what you said second, I hear them, but I don't like the mix. I conceded the fact you dont like the mix. I then went on to give you my personal experience living with my listening position against the back wall. That can actually be good for two channel listening. Bass is increased, it can sound very nice. But for multichannel listening, in my experience, it didn't work for me because of the reasons I mentioned. I understand you can't move your walls. This release has so much info in the rears, small rear speakers is not ideal. Many 5.1 releases move the info up front. The rears don't do as much work. That is not the case for this release. Moving forward, don't take my posts personally. Disregard what you think is false.
I was trying to understand why a few people here were complaining about the vocals on at least one of the Chicago songs. So I broke out my Chicago V dvda 5.1 yesterday and the difference is huge. Vocals in three speakers instead of one. But the rears just didn't have that same quad feel for lack of a better word. It was up front and center. I like the balance of sound that the Chicago mixes provide. If you have small rear speakers, it is impossible to get all that info from the mix. I love the Andy Jackson style of modern day mixing. Closer to the origional quad style! However, Mr. Wilson strikes a balance that is hard to match. 5.1 mixes that center vocals and also doesn't treat the rears like an afterthought. And he stays true to the origional. Love that balanced approach. Caravan - In The Land Of Gray And Pink is one mix of his that takes all my favorite attributes of quad and blends it with modern 5.1 mixes.
Very good question.. it was quite an odd and partly inauspicious start (could also be a factor in why I eschewed Quad for a while!) but the first Quads I heard would be a couple of Q8's I had picked up in a box full of Stereo 8-tracks from a junk shop when I was a kid (I was quite into 8-track in my mid-teens.. for reasons that are quite unclear to me now!) one was Shirley Bassey which I don't remember anything about as it soon turned into squid ink spaghetti spilling out all over the floor so I just chucked it and the other was Earth Wind & Fire's "That's The Way Of The World", I was absolutely riveted to the spot listening to that one, even just two channels in isolation, (I only owned a Stereo deck!) it really knocked me out, it was a hoot and I could tell even though it wasn't authentic Quad it was a whole different ball game from my other 8-tracks, there were things happening and there were other things not happening that I kinda knew should be there, my interest was piqued put it that way.. but other things came along to distract me... and I went on to spend a small fortune on imported Dolby Digital LaserDiscs (PAL UK discs couldn't hack it.. and those LDs now sit taking up loads of room I can't afford to use up in my tiny place, gathering dust.. I guess they're totally worthless now.. ha.. to think at one point they were among my most cherished items!) then I picked up a couple of DTS CDs not long after I got my first DVD player which had DTS built in (Venus & Mars and Band On The Run) I got them since out of the few that I could find they were the most familiar of the DTS CDs available when I was starting out all those years ago (I remember playing Band On The Run DTS for my mate Dave who is a mega Macca fan and he just had the biggest smile on his face through the whole thing, saying "ooh I've never heard that before!" etc.. that was fun! anyway I digress (I do a lot of that.. I'm conscious we are digressing here.. yikes! I better get back on topic after this trip down memory lane!) then there was another gap of a few years where I was on that real 5.1-only trip (I was still in surround kindergarten, with a lot to learn, remember ) and then I got to hear Quads of other artists I knew and particularly liked including Cat Stevens Hits, Aretha Best Of, Simon & Garfunkel/BOTW, a couple of the Paul Simon's, Art Garfunkel's Breakaway, Eagles' One Of These Nights, 360 Degrees Of Billy Paul, Average White Band/AWB.. some didn't do it for me at all but the Paul Simon's and Art G's Breakaway were excellent and I loved the AWB Quad.. so I was hooked and then started trying to find more Quads, I remember experiencing the Ohio Players Fire and Honey albums in Quad and being absolutely knocked out, the fidelity on those Quads kicked the Stereo masterings butts I had at the time.. then I got Steve Miller's Fly Like An Eagle, another surround favourite to this day (I do enjoy the more recent 5.1 remix too, mainly for fidelity but it is an excellent surround mix too).. and then I started working my way backwards through the rest of the DTS CD rock/pop/easy Quads in earnest, gradually picking them all up (the first time I put on Clapton's "There's One In Every Crowd" the Quad was a revelation, the Stereo was soooo boring but Quad totally brought it all to life for me somehow!) oh and Edgar Winter's "Jasmine Nightdreams" DTS was a genuine epiphany, up until that point I was kinda "meh" about flashy surround unless it was an action movie or something but that old Edgar Winter Quad really made those spectacular 360 degree thrills seem legitimate and to this day the suite of 3 instrumentals - All Out, Sky Train, Solar Strut - at the end of that album is one of my absolute Quad treasures, its sensational.. and somewhere along the way (before Jasmine Edgar DTS) I grabbed the Sony SACDs of The Isleys' 3+3 and O'Jays Ship Ahoy (both for a fraction of what they go for now, sadly for any surround heads who want them they're now often an arm and a leg, I do wish AF or someone would reissue them so more folk could hear them, they're fabulous.. I really lucked out and got Isleys for like £9 and O'Jays for £13 when Virgin was going bust... those two are still among my all-time favourites I play a lot!) and so to wrap up if you fast forward to the present day my Quad love affair has gone totally bonkers now, I've every digital and modern-day reissue of rock/pop/easy Quad I can lay my hands on, whatever the format.. and just as an example of how outta control (ha!) its got I'm well on the way to my 300th matrix Quad LP (mixture of SQ and QS, almost all are SQ) and I'm starting to get the odd Q8 and CD-4 as and when I find them ultra cheap (no way to play either of them yet but hey.. "One Day Tomorrow" as Edgar would say/sing! ) So there you go.. back to the scheduled Quadio programming, yes? Yes!
Oh yeah man, that Spectrum Quad AF SACD is terrific! It knocks the 5.1 on the DVD-A into a cocked hat!
Thank you for sharing. That is great how you started out listening to quad 8 tracks in stereo. O' Jays Ship Ahoy and the "Jasmine Nightdreams" DTS brings back my memories of the first multichannel stuff that just killed anything I had heard from those bands and the mixes are impossible not to leave a lasting impression. ...and fly like an eagle...
I had never heard this album before, and when I got into surround I saw it was cheap so picked it up. It really does have some good songs on it <and some clunkers> but the quad mix is fantastic. Still available cheap on Amazon last time I looked...
You're most welcome, himey You asked so kindly, I had to give you a fulsome response.. plus you have impeccable taste in MultiCh Music! Right, now I'm gonna fly like an eagle and have jasmine nightdreams, its getting late! Fun chattin wiv ya!
"Musical" as in focused on conveying musical emotion and intentions, not solely audio system wizardry. Most quad mixes (and more than a few 5.1 mixes too) to me don't seem in sync at all with the musical intentions and emotions. They just seem almost like "let's put some stuff in all the speakers because we can" without any cohesive thought whatsoever to the music itself. When I listen to, say, most Steven Wilson or the Talking Heads surround mixes, they make complete sense with the music...take it somewhere that stereo can't -- and I find myself absorbed in the music rather than the individual instruments coming out of the 4 corners of the room. As I said before, I've only had a chance to give a cursory listen to the CTA 4.0 mix so far. I haven't listened to anything else in the box, so I have no comment on the remaining 4.0 mixes in the boxes. I hope they're great and even though I'm finding the recently resurrected 4.0 mixes to be mostly disappointing -- especially in relation to the hyperbolic praise they gotten over the years -- I hope they continue to be released and I will continue to give them a try because I do enjoy surround sound. I haven't listened to the II & V 5.1 mixes in quite some time, but I seem to recall enjoying them a lot more than the CTA 4.0 mix (which admittedly is apples and oranges). It'll be interesting to give those quad mixes a go this weekend (hopefully...).
To me, mixing is an unfortunate necessity. I love being in the midst of a group of musicians. Me on my twelve string - others on flute, violin, saxophone, viola, more guitars, maybe a keyboard - depending on who is present. Everything is discrete, combined to a degree by room acoustics, but the brain is more than capable of "mixing" everything into a wonderful (or dreadful!) 3 dimensional sound picture. Discrete quadraphonic and discrete 50s and 60s stereo come somewhere near to replicating that experience, albeit only in 2 or 1 dimensions (mono is a pin prick, zero dimensions, right smack dab in the middle up front). Sure, I can handle other peoples' mixing - it can often give a wonderful effect. But I don't listen to my hi-fi. I listen to the music coming out of it.
Some old "Musical" Quads.. Annie, A Chorus Line, Company, Fiddler On The Roof, Funny Girl, Man Of La Mancha, My Fair Lady, Sound Of Music... (sorry, I couldn't resist!)
Really? So why on earth was the Sound Of Music SACD stereo only? I would be VERY interested in hearing that lot in quad. Even more so Thoroughly Modern Millie.
