Rare UK Led Zeppelin Four ?

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by George Blair, May 22, 2010.

  1. George Blair

    George Blair Forum Resident

    Location:
    Portland, OR
    Anyone have one of these? Porky/Pecko A-3/B-3 Bottom sticker covers both original printed Led Zeppelin and Produced by Peter Grant. Sticker reads Kinney Music Inc. Superhype Music Inc. Produced by Jimmy Page. Top sticker replaces missing Led Zeppelin.

    [​IMG]
  2. MikeyH

    MikeyH Stamper King

    Location:
    Berkeley, CA
    I don't have one, but I've seen those and similar. The changeover to Kinney Group was 'amicable' and they transferred all the parts and stock as well as the rights. So someone got stickering!

    Stickers on the covers too.
  3. George Blair

    George Blair Forum Resident

    Location:
    Portland, OR
    There's no sticker on the cover - there's no text on the cover... Anyone know if this is the first stamper? It is amazingly hot; fantastic sound on this one.
  4. MikeyH

    MikeyH Stamper King

    Location:
    Berkeley, CA
    There are three tiny numbers in the dead wax on each side, other than the 2401 012 lacquer numbers. Negative, mother, stamper. Typically 1 12 15 or some such. If you're really lucky, 1 1 3. This would be a later, 1972 copy from the changeover.

    The Porky/Pecko lacquers are one of the most common sets; that doesn't stop it being great though. My WLP Atlantic has these.

    LZ4 has stamper sets, it's a big volume title. Amongst the first. Go by your ears.
    tlmusic likes this.
  5. tlmusic

    tlmusic Forum Resident

    In the UK record collecting world, there appears to be a bit of contention regarding the correct earliest matrices for Led Zep IV. The lowest "plum" matrices are A//3 B//3.

    But, according to my most reliable seller source, the earliest pressings actually were A//3 B//4.

    That said, as MikeyH pointed out, if you're looking for sound, it's best to trust your ear.
  6. tlmusic

    tlmusic Forum Resident

    Polydor Stamper Codes


    Thanks:wave:

    This is the first time I've ever seen an explanation of the "Polydor" stamper codes. I've been trying to find this information ever since I joined SH. Sure, there's tons of online explanations of the "GRAMOPHLTD" codes, but none on the Polydor codes.


    So, I know what a mother and stamper are, but what is a "negative"


    And why do we want "1 1 3" instead of "1 1 1"?
  7. Shawn1968

    Shawn1968 Forum Resident

    Location:
    West Hollywood, CA
    I pulled this from a UK LZ IV auction. I can't comment on its accuracy but it at least identifies known variants:

    1) "UNDER LICENCE FROM ATLANTIC RECORDING CORPN., U.S.A" TEXT ABOVE THE WHITE LINE IN THE RED PART OF THE LABEL (LATER LABELS HAVE THIS TEXT INSIDE THE WHITE STRIPE) - EXACTLY THE SAME AS ALL EARLIER ATLANTIC LPS (LIKE LED ZEPPELIN III FOR EXAMPLE),

    2) PUBLISHING CREDITS WERE ACCIDENTALLY OMITTED ON THESE EARLIEST 1ST PRESS LABELS!!!! IF YOU LOOK BELOW THE SONG LISTING ON EITHER SIDE IT SAYS 'KINNEY MUSIC LTD' ONLY. ON ALL LATER RED/PLUM LABELS (INCLUDING THE MUCH LATER GREEN/ORANGE RE-ISSUES) THE CREDITS WERE CHANGED TO - 'KINNEY MUSIC/SUPERHYPE MUSIC INC'.

    3) ON THESE MEGA RARE 'EARLIEST' 1ST PRESS LABELS THE TEXT 'LED ZEPPELIN' IS POSITIONED TOWARDS THE BOTTOM OF EACH LABEL (BELOW THE WHITE LINE) AND IS QUITE SMALL. ON ALL LATER LABELS THE 'LED ZEPPELIN' TEXT IS SLIGHTLY LARGER & POSITIONED TOWARDS THE TOP (ABOVE THE WHITE LINE!) - JUST BELOW THE FOUR SYMBOLS!!!!

    4) THESE EARLIEST 1ST PRESS LABELS ALSO HAVE A 'PETER GRANT' PRODUCTION CREDIT AT THE BOTTOM OF EACH LABEL - THIS WAS REMOVED ON ALL LATER LABELS APPARENTLY AT THE INSISTANCE OF JIMMY PAGE!!!!

    5) FINALLY, THESE EARLIEST LABELS “MISTY MOUNTAIN HOP” ACTUALLY IS SPELT CORRECTLY !! IT SEEMS IT WAS ONLY DURING THE CORRECTION PROCESS THAT HOP WAS MIS-SPELT AS “TOP” AND IT HAS BECOME A COMMON MIS-CONCEPTION THAT THE MISSPELT TOP LABELS ARE THE RAREST, IT IS IRONICALLY THESE FIRST TWO VARIAINTS WITH THE CORRECTLY SPELT “HOP” LABELS THAT ARE BY FAR THE RAREST,


    THE SECOND VARIANT IS EXACTLY THE SAME AS THIS ONE BUT WHEN ATLANTIC REALISED THE ERRORS IN AN ABORTIVE ATTEMPT TO CORRECT WHAT FEW DISCS WERE ALREADY PRESSED THEY PRINTED CORRECTIVE STICKERS TO GO OVER THE LABELS. THOSE COPIES ARE ACTUALLY IDENTICAL TO THIS ONE UNDERNEATH THEIR STICKERS, BOTH VARIANTS ARE HARDLY EVER SEEN TODAY

    THE THIRD VARIANT LABELS ARE THE FIRST ATTEMPT AT A FULL CORRECTION AND WE NOW HAVE WHAT IS GENEARLLY REGARDED AS THE MORE STANDARD LOOKING RED PLUM LABEL, THE LED ZEPPELIN IS MOVED FROM THE TOP HALF OF THE LABEL TO THE BOTTOM, THE ATLANTIC CREDIT IS MOVED TO THE CENTRAL WHITE BAND, AND THE PETER GRANT CREDIT IS REMOVED. HOWEVER DURING THIS PROCESS IT IS BELIEVED THAT IS WHERE THE “HOP” WAS FIRST MISPRESSED AS “TOP”

    FINALLY THE FOURTH VARIANT PLUM RED LABEL IS THE CORRECTED VARIANT WITH THE “ TOP “ MISTYPE RESTORED TO “ HOP “ ALTHOUGH INTERESTINGLY THE “TOP “ MISTYPE MAKES A FURTHER RE-APPEARANCE ON SOME EARLY GREEN/ORANGE KINNEY PRESSINGS
    Giorgio likes this.
  8. tlmusic

    tlmusic Forum Resident

    ^^^I almost posted a link to that exact same auction, but I'm not so sure that particular seller is a 100% credible source.
  9. MikeyH

    MikeyH Stamper King

    Location:
    Berkeley, CA
    This is a little 'guesswork' but it sort of makes sense.

    The negative or metal master is the plating of the lacquer. It has bumps instead of grooves. A mother, or number of mothers, positives, are plated from that. I don't know why Polygram numbered this part where everyone else didn't. There are the three numbers on each pressed disc. Mostly. That's what I've taken them to mean. If you look carefully with a microscope or loupe you can see which numbers are impressed and which are raised, so you can guess which metal part they were stamped into. Then compare several copies. etc.

    Yes, you would like 1 1 1. For some reason, they seldom exist in the wild. I also see fairly high numbers on early pressings.. more so than on EMI or Decca. Clearly low numbers are good here.
  10. tlmusic

    tlmusic Forum Resident

    Thank you greatly for this information!



    I have a particular UK plum copy of The Yes Album. It has the earliest "Connely & Co." label variation.

    Side one has 1 1 19, so I had figured it was the 19th stamper
    Side two has 1 1 1, then followed by an "o" (or zero) in a different font quite a distance further along. So that might be the very 1st stamper? The record is a bit rough, but Jon Anderson's voice on "Your Move" has an in the room presence I've not heard on other copies. Probably why I've held onto that particular record...

    ...sorry to get off the subject of LZ IV
  11. George Blair

    George Blair Forum Resident

    Location:
    Portland, OR
    Lucky I guess - stamped 1 1 3 on both sides. Anyone know the value of one of these? - Cover and Vinyl are NM. It would be hard to part with tho... it's almost a religious experience. :)
  12. eddiel

    eddiel Forum Resident

    Location:
    Toronto, Canada
    On ebay I've seen these go for over £100.

    Eddie
  13. motorcitydave

    motorcitydave Enlightened Rogue

    Location:
    Las Vegas, NV, USA
    Nice! Where's that drool smiley? haha. :cool:
  14. tlmusic

    tlmusic Forum Resident

    NM????

    Sweet!!!!!!!!!

    Here ya go...
    [​IMG]
  15. MikeyH

    MikeyH Stamper King

    Location:
    Berkeley, CA
    I'd think you'll want to enjoy it until it reaches a sillier price; which of course it might not. Very nice. Practice your eBay hyperbole for the next few years in preparation.
    Aftermath likes this.
  16. RTurner

    RTurner Forum Resident

    Location:
    Los Angeles, CA
    I don't know about that! I still have my original red Japan target cd and even $1200.00 doesn't make me want to sell. :cool:
  17. George Blair

    George Blair Forum Resident

    Location:
    Portland, OR
    Thanks for all the info. This is about the sweetest vinyl I have ever found - just another day checking the local shops... Never give up the hunt!!
  18. motorcitydave

    motorcitydave Enlightened Rogue

    Location:
    Las Vegas, NV, USA
    Thanks! :cool:
  19. James Glennon

    James Glennon Well-Known Member

    Location:
    Dublin, Ireland
    My plum label matrix info

    2401012 A//3 1 3 3 pecko duck
    2401012 B//3 1 2 2 porky

    JG
  20. Giorgio

    Giorgio Forum Resident

    Location:
    Varese Italy
    This make sense.
    The true first UK pressing, the earliest ones, are the first two variants here above described. The one with "Peter Grant" credits and the one with the stickers.
    Here the pics as example.
    Led_4_label1.JPG Led_4_label2_stickered.JPG
    pscreed likes this.
  21. Bill Cormier

    Bill Cormier Well-Known Member

    Location:
    Malta, New York
    Me want real bad !! :love:
    motorcitydave likes this.
  22. Mad shadows

    Mad shadows Well-Known Member

    Location:
    Karlskrona- Sweden
    My plum label matrix info

    2401012 A//3 1 1 1 pecko duck, between 2401012 and the A//3 there is two crossed over letters or digits
    2401012 B//3 1 11 porky

    But it has no the Peter Grant credit.
  23. Giorgio

    Giorgio Forum Resident

    Location:
    Varese Italy
    Does it have on side 2 the first song titled "MISTY MOUNTAIN HOP" or "MISTY MOUNTAIN TOP"?
  24. tlmusic

    tlmusic Forum Resident

    Don't forget there is a rare variant with an inverted feather on side two. Meaning the feather in the circle is mistakenly printed upside down. This is found on some early copies. I've got one, my copy does not have the Peter Grant credit. I wonder where that fits in?
  25. Giorgio

    Giorgio Forum Resident

    Location:
    Varese Italy
    My stickered copy has the inverted feather on side two. It is also present in my third variant copy, the one with the "TOP" mistake on side 2. Here below the pics.
    Anyway I have evidence that this mistake is present on all the four variants, so not in the early copies only.

    Led_4_label2b_stickered.JPG Led_4_label3b.JPG
    tlmusic likes this.