DCC Archive Rumours DVD-A

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by joelee, Sep 13, 2001.

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  1. joelee

    joelee Senior Member Thread Starter

    Location:
    Houston
    Picked this up just for the remaster. I don't have a DVD audio player, just two speakers a tube amp ect..
    Well.... I don't like this remix. Sure it's clean but it's just crappy. Cymbals up front etc... There's even more guitar parts mixed in on "Never goin back again"
    Kinda reminds me of the Sixpack cd set from ZZ Top. Yuch!

    Gives me the two channel original mix from the master or nothing at all. My opinion of course!
     
  2. Unknown

    Unknown Guest

    Of course, if you have a DVD-Audio compatible player, you'd be able to listen to the original mix. The Rumours DVD-A contains a 5.1 mix as well as the original stereo mix (although there's some issue as to whether all the fades match the original LP). I just wanted to clear that up, because your post gives the impression that the DVD-A does not contain the original mix.

     
    impalaboy likes this.
  3. Sckott

    Sckott Hand Tighten Only.

    Location:
    Hyannis Ma
    I like the DVD-A of Rumours very much. You realize that issue is not the only different mix ever released, the US stock issue has a few minor (but noticeable) differences to the original LP. Listen to the end to "Second Hand News" and "Dreams". It hasn't been right since 1988. WB put out a few RE-1, RE-2 issues since then (look at the hub matrix on your US Rumours CD), and although the sound is tighter, there's mistakes in em, and it's a much more sterile sound.

    Listening to the DVD-A is just more revealing then the regular CD in some respects, and is not supposed to be the replacement for the LP or CD, whatever issue you know or have fallen in love with. I really have fallen in love with some Moody Blues DTS CDs, but that doesn't make them replace the stereo mixes. Rumours is great, not to be missed, but is not the best DVD-A ever released.
     
    impalaboy likes this.
  4. ruyeno

    ruyeno New Member

    Location:
    Honolulu, HI
    So, if I understand this correctly, if I purchase this DVD-A and play it on my regular DVD player (non-DVD-A), I can listen only to a new stereo version derived from the 5.1 mix. But, if I had a DVD-A player, I could listen to the original stereo mix.

    Seems kinda odd to me. Or am I misunderstanding this?

     
  5. Sckott

    Sckott Hand Tighten Only.

    Location:
    Hyannis Ma
    If you have a regular DVD player, it's gonna sound weird, because on this DVD-A, the Dolby Digital stream (5.1) sends some instruments in discreet channels. Just to mention one, "Second Hand News" puts the "dojo"(?) intro sound only in the back channels.

    No. You NEED to have at least 4 channels set up to enjoy this DVD-A at all. What comes in the front 2 channels isn't enough to hear even most of the mix. There's a lot of business in the back channel, even in the center.

    So, buy it for later use maybe if you plan on having a true 4 to 5.1 channel playback capability.
    Otherwize, stick to the CD you already own.
     
  6. Unknown

    Unknown Guest

     
  7. Uncle Al

    Uncle Al Senior Member

    Location:
    Long Island, NY
    Yeah this is repetitive, but basically:

    DVD-Video Player: You can play a DD 5.1 remix, lower resolution than the DVD-A tracks. Because of the the DD specifications, if you only have a 2 channel system, you will hear a downmix of this version from 5.1 to 2 channel stereo.

    DVD-A player: You can listen to the same mix as above - either in 5.1 or (downmixed) 2 channel. You can listen to a high resolution DVD-A version of the same 5.1 channel mix as above, or you can listen to a high resolution DVD-A version of the original 2 channel mix - remastered.

    [ September 14, 2001: Message edited by: Uncle Al ]
     
  8. Sckott

    Sckott Hand Tighten Only.

    Location:
    Hyannis Ma
     
  9. lukpac

    lukpac Senior Member

    Location:
    Milwaukee, WI
    Sckott, your missing something - the 5.1 DD mix can be downconverted to stereo by the DVD player. That's what David is talking about. So you get *everything* out of the front two channels. If you set your DVD player to 5.1 output (and only have 2 speakers) you'll only get the front information, but if you set it to stereo output you'll get everything.
     
  10. Uncle Al

    Uncle Al Senior Member

    Location:
    Long Island, NY
    Luke is correct - the specifications for DD allow for the player to downmix the 5.1 channel mix to stereo. This can be done by either setting the DVD player to 2 channel output, or if you have connected your DVD player to your amp via digital cable - your amplifier will do the downmix (provided it has a DD decoder and is set up in 2 channel mode).

    After all, many DVD videos do not have a separate stereo mix . They rely on the players ability to downmix the 5.1 mix for people who do not have surround systems.
     
  11. Unknown

    Unknown Guest

    Luke -- That's not what I was getting at, although you are correct that the 5.1 Dolby Digital mix can be downmixed to stereo. I'm not sure that every processor is able to do this -- the Bryston SP1, for instance, is able to create both stereo and mono downmixes of 5.1 Dolby Digital mixes. Obviously, ever player ought to have this feature, but I suspect that some do not.

    What I was saying was that IF you have a DVD-Audio player, you do not need anything more than a stereo (i.e., two-channel) set up to enjoy the DVD-A, because the DVD-A does contain a separate hi-res stereo mix -- not a downmix, mind you, but an honest to goodness stereo mix. And it's not a stereo remix created specifically for the DVD-A (unlike the 5.1 mix, which WAS created specifically for the DVD-A). I don't have the original LP, so I can't say for sure that the hi-res stereo mix is the original album mix. The packaging, however, says it is, and my ears certainly tell me its a vintage, all-analog mix. Sckott says that the stock CD contains a different mix than the original LP, but I believe the differences relate entirely to fades (certain songs that either fade in or fade out on the original LP have cold starts or endings on the CD) or a repeated chorus. Now this is just a guess on my part, but perhaps there were fades and edits added at the LP mastering stage which exist only on the LP production master and not on the original stereo mixdown master. It is well-known that the original CD reissues was mastered from a high generation LP production master, so naturally this would match the LP mix exactly. But when the CD was remastered, somebody must have pulled the original two-track midown masters and forgot to match the fades and edits to the original LP. Again, this is just a guess.

    Sckott - Yes, I do have this DVD-A, and I even have a DVD-A player. The fact that you repeatedly fail to mention that the DVD-A contains a separate stereo mix suggests that perhaps you've never listened to this particular title on a DVD-A player. If you have listened to it on a DVD-A player, why would you tell Russ that he needed at least four channels to enjoy the DVD-A at all -- even on a DVD-A player -- when you only need two channels to listen to the stereo mix? Perhaps you simply think the stereo mix on the DVD-A sucks, and that the only thing worth listening to on the DVD-A is the 5.1 mix. Or maybe you don't think the stereo mix sounds any better than the stock CD. I would argue strenuously that you are wrong on both counts. But this is simply a matter of opinion. What I object to is you repeatedly giving the impression that the DVD-A does not contain a stereo mix. This is false -- demonstrably false. And I think it's wrong to post misinformation on this board.
     
  12. lukpac

    lukpac Senior Member

    Location:
    Milwaukee, WI
    Quoth David
    Actually, I'm pretty sure they all do. There are a *lot* of people that don't have 5.1 inputs on their stereo systems, and DVD players reflect that.

    I don't think anyone ever questioned that. The issue was listening on a DVD-Video player, since most people don't have DVD-A players. Scott thought that listening on a DVD-V player would only get you the front 2 channels of the 5.1 mix, while I pointed out that DVD-V players will downmix the 5.1 info to stereo if you ask them to.
     
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