Sordel Listens To Dylan

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by Sordel, Jan 22, 2014.

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  1. Sordel

    Sordel Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Switzerland
    At Budokan

    What time do you call this? It has been a while, hasn’t it?

    Why This One? Mainly to get my ear in again with what is overwhelmingly familiar material.

    So we're back on track now, right? Probably not, since I made these notes back in October last year ...

    Preconceptions. None really, except for the fact that I get the impression that this one is not very highly rated. When I got to the end of my first listen-through and read how badly this album had been savaged by the first US critics I was frankly flabbergasted.
    1. “Mr. Tambourine Man”. This upbeat version of the song does the lyric no favours, and the piccolo is certainly rather grating, but I suppose you have to give it some credit as an opening number to get the crowd going.
    2. “Shelter From The Storm”. The only other version of this song I’ve considered so far is the one from Hard Rain, and this version seems to work better with the lyrics thanks to the female vocals, although it’s difficult to deny that it isn’t rather thrown away here due to the lack of emotional commitment in the performance.
    3. “Love Minus Zero/ No Limit”. The fuller arrangement here is pleasant, on a song that is still some way off from persuading me. The violin/piccolo combination is not too bad here, but it will take more than competent musical direction to win me over.
    4. “Ballad Of The Thin Man”. Dylan seems to get his head in the game with this song, putting some effort into the vocal even though he seems always rather at odds with the backing vocals. Sure, the song has less edge here than on the original, but this version still works quite well.
    5. “Don’t Think Twice, It’s All Right”. This “I Shot The Sheriff” version is certainly not “all right” with me, though there’s something admirable about the way that the original has been so thoroughly reworked. The wit & acerbity seem to have gone out of the window, unfortunately.
    6. “Maggie’s Farm”. The less one likes the original, the more one is likely to tolerate in the reworking, and in this case I think that this particular live version with it’s heavy beat and propulsive arrangement is much more to my taste than the original.
    7. “One More Cup Of Coffee (Valley Below)”. Since Desire is still some way off in this process, I thought that this was going to be a brand new song for me … before realising that I have known and liked the White Stripes version for years without realising that it was a Bob Dylan song! Until I find out whether the studio original is much better, this version will do fine.
    8. “Like A Rolling Stone”. The prominent organ in this version signals that is basically faithful to the original, although (for reasons that I haven’t quite put my finger on) this version drags.
    9. “I Shall Be Released”. I’m not fond of “Lay Lady Lay” and this version of “I Shall Released” reminds me of it, which is a shame.
    10. “Is Your Love For Vain?”. This, of course, is one of the six songs I picked as my favourites from this process at the half-way point point. The Budokan version is faithful to that, although the rather plodding emphasis that Dylan puts on the vocals means that it’s clearly inferior.
    11. “Going Going Gone”. I liked this song back on Planet Waves. The reading here is distinguished by the double-time section which is more jarring than in the original, and the too-strident backing vocals towards the end.
    12. “Blowin’ In The Wind”. There’s a marked vocal concentration to Dylan’s performance on this song which reminds me of the “crooning” phase as represented on Another Self-Portrait. The softness of the arrangement is a relief after the (predominantly) loud first disc and it’s interesting that the refrain of the song becomes wistful in this reading of the lyrics.
    13. “Just Like A Woman”. The first appearance of this song in this process, although of course I do know it. Had I been at the concert rather than hearing it on disc I think I might have been rather pleased to hear Dylan take a harmonica break here and the conventional version of such a well-known song shows how well paced this live performance really is.
    14. “Oh Sister”. What with the saxophone and groaning vocalists, there’s something somewhat sleazy about this version of such a spiritual song but it all works reasonably well.
    15. “Simple Twist Of Fate”. Another newcomer to the thread. Again, I know the studio version (somewhat) and have other versions: too many by Jerry Garcia and one rather good one by Bryan Ferry. This version is okay but not the best argument for the song.
    16. “All Along The Watchtower”. Good, fun version of this classic thanks to the violin’s massive contribution. The ending, with that ugly Picardy third at the end, is not to my taste, but that’s kind of a picky complaint!
    17. “I Want You”. Again, you can hear in Dylan’s voice that he is really focused here on this rather Country-inflected version of this short song from Blonde On Blonde. Brief though it is, this is rather a tour de force.
    18. “All I Really Want To Do”. The original’s cheeky air of flirtation is here transformed into a stomping invitation to clap along towards the close of the concert. Dylan doesn’t have much of a reputation as a crowd-pleaser, but again I’m struck by how well this concert is paced for the audience in the hall, but it’s not really something I’d want to hear outside the live album flow.
    19. “Knockin’ On Heaven’s Door”. Excruciating throwaway version with all the worst aspects of the original plus that piccolo.
    20. “It’s Alright, Ma (I’m Only Bleeding)”. This is an unexpectedly exciting version thanks to the brass and rather aggressive delivery.
    21. “Forever Young”. This scarf-waving finale is rather over-the-top, creating a sense that you really “had to be there” to appreciate it.
    22. “The Times They Are Changin’”. It takes the band a while to settle into Dylan’s rhythm here, resulting in a ragged version with rather pedestrian drumming. Dispensable.

    Overall. At Budokan is a pretty great live document. Given that Dylan is never unerring on his arrangement choices, having so many classic songs in versions that are for the most part either interesting or good is something of an achievement. I can imagine that - in a time before YouTube and iTunes playlists - this album could well have been an attractive purchase as a rather triumphalist “greatest hits live”.

    I understand why people at the time, with far more investment in the image of Dylan as a “serial rebel” than I have, might have felt disappointed by the slickness of the album, but with the perspective of time and our altered sense of what it means for a Dylan album to be slick, I think the album works very well. How well would those same critics have coped with Christmas In The Heart, for example? For me, coming from the opposite direction, it makes perfect sense that Dylan would have experimented with different touring configurations & orchestrations.

    “Ballad Of A Thin Man”, “Maggie’s Farm”, “All Along The Watchtower”, “I Want You” & “It’s Alright, Ma (I’m Only Bleeding)” all transfer to my playlist: the last two songs getting into that list for the first time.
     
  2. NumberEight

    NumberEight Came too late and stayed too long

    Good to see you back. I was wondering what happened to you and this thread!
     
  3. Zeki

    Zeki Forum Resident

    I was wondering where you disappeared to. Would see your name in other threads and think....nah, it must be another Sordel!
     
  4. alchemy

    alchemy Forum Resident

    Location:
    Sterling, VA
    I have fond memories of this LP. I bought this as a Japanese Import LP in Des Moines, IA in September 1978. Has never seen it or even heard rumors of before I saw that one copy in People's Music (I think it was). The LP as an import was expensive for the time, maybe three to fours times what a domestic LP sold for at that time. As a big Dylan fan it was an instance purchase.

    All my Dylan buddies at the University Of Iowa would come by to hear it. The party goodies they brought made the expensive purchase worth while. While playing the LP, we would flash slides from Dylan 1974 Chicago and some Dylan slides a buddy had from the Rolling Thunder Revue concert he took. I had a betamax tape ( reminder them?) I recorded off TV of the Hard Rain special. Later in November 1978, I saw Dylan in Kansas City, MO and the next night in Omaha, NB. Two great shows both different from each other in intenstive.

    While, maybe not in my favorite live Dylan recordings, this holds a special place in my heart.

    Thanks for the original post.
     
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  5. Sordel

    Sordel Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Switzerland
    Love And Theft

    Why This One? While my Dylan ears are still comparatively “rested” let’s take another from the more recent end of the catalogue.

    Preconceptions. None
    1. “Tweedle Dee & Tweedle Dum”. This a slick little song that sounds as though it should have been written (or at the very least used) for a road movie. The title, and the rather picaresque story, calls to mind “The Ballad of Frankie Lee and Judas Priest”, though - given my dislike for that song - I actually prefer this one.
    2. “Mississippi”. I didn’t realise when I started listening to it that this is a song that I actually know reasonably well (& like) thanks to the version on Sheryl Crow’s Globe Sessions album. Dylan’s version appeals to me less because he doesn’t have those same high notes, which is rather the hook of Crow’s version. Still, Crow’s version is a pop song whereas Dylan’s is another one of those late career retrospective ballads. The lyric has a real sting that the music doesn’t quite pull off: ‘Well the emptiness is endless, cold as the clay / You can always comes back, but you can’t come back all the way” is positively Nebraska dark.
    3. “Summer Days”. Dylan’s later pastiches are welcome throwaways and the band on this album seem to be having plenty of fun here. I suppose the pregnant line here is when Dylan contradicts the girl who tells him that he can’t repeat the past. That said, some of the lyrics in this song feel like scraps from his notebook rather than coherent elements .
    4. “Bye & Bye”. Reminds me of “Night and Day” at the start and this is clearly an homage to Jazz standards. Can’t say that it made a big impression on me though, other than sounding pleasant.
    5. “Lonesome Day Blues”. Third pastiche in a row is pushing it a bit, although I suppose you could argue that this is just a straight blues rather than a copy of the style. Either way, it drags, which is a shame because the lyric might have done really well in a completely different setting.
    6. “Floater”. Again, a dull song musically. Though the lyric is suggestive, with its hints of social history & observation, there are too many lines here that don’t fit, such as the Romeo & Juliet verse.
    7. “High Water.” Not so much a good Dylan song as a dramatic piece of modern Americana. Even Dylan struggle to get as many syllables into a line as he has to with “conceivable”.
    8. “Moonlight.” Musically: a sleepy harbinger of Shadows In The Night. Lyrically: something either valedictory or sinister, it’s difficult to tell. Again, though, there are some downright trite lyrics that get in the way of the song, such as the following: “Doctor, lawyer, indian chief / It takes a thief to catch a thief / For whom does the bell toll for, love? It tolls for you and me.”
    9. “Honest With Me.” Sounds like classic Dylan but outstays its welcome.
    10. “Po’ Boy.” Has a feel of Randy Newman or maybe early Tom Waits but the melody is rather saccharine and the song doesn’t go anywhere.
    11. “Cry A While”. Better of the two Blues songs on the album thanks to the nice gear-shift rhythm.
    12. “Sugar Baby”. I guess that this is the emotional heart of the album but it’s not a song that I care for and as a personal statement it is more equivocal than, for example, “Not Dark Yet”.
    Overall. I was very surprised to learn that Love And Theft was heralded on release as one of the best albums of Dylan’s career since I didn’t hear that at all. In fact on first listening I thought that this album was downright weak, using the incredibly slick band work to cover up some glaring problems with the actual songs. Moreover, the reason that the critics liked this album (it’s supposed engagement with the African-American music tradition) seemed to me to be thin. I wonder whether Dylan doesn’t sometimes get too much benefit of the doubt on this sort of thing.

    As I listened more I began to relate this album with one that I do like very much: The Swimming Hour by Andrew Bird’s Bowl Of Fire. That album is basically all clever pastiche: musically, it’s more to my taste than Love And Theft, but of course it’s nowhere near as rich on the lyrical side. Moreover, as I dug into them a bit more the lyrics did seem to have more in them than other late albums I’ve heard: as though Dylan was underwriting in a really interesting way. But ultimately for every good line on this album there seems to be one that should not have been spared the editor's blue pencil.

    This was an album that made me work harder than I like to. Even coming back to it several months after first hearing it, I find it unconvincing, and with so much Dylan to listen to I can't foresee coming back to it in the future. I transfer “Mississippi” & “High Water” to my playlist rather grudgingly.
     
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  6. alchemy

    alchemy Forum Resident

    Location:
    Sterling, VA
    Nice review.
    I recall first hearing this LP when 9/11 happened. The line in HighWater "they want him dead ot alive" seemed to echo what President Bush said at that time in a speech about the perpetrators of that event.

    I would love to see your keepers on your Dylan playlist from these listening sessions.
     
  7. Sordel

    Sordel Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Switzerland
    That playlist is already close to six and a half hours from 24 albums. I hope to revisit it if/when I get to the end of this process, especially narrowing down the good to the best. That's a long way off though ...
     
    Zeki and highway like this.
  8. Fender Relic

    Fender Relic Forum Resident

    Location:
    PennsylBama
    To OP....I read the first page and can't stick with you because you seemed to have an issue/dislike with Van Morrison and pedal steel guitar,two of the most beautiful musical things I can think of. I'm out.
     
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  9. Sordel

    Sordel Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Switzerland
    Well, that's your prerogative! :cheers:

    I don't really have an issue with Van ... I've barely heard any. I just use his name as shorthand for a soul sound that doesn't speak to me. I do something similar with Clapton and '70s classic rock. I don't know enough about either of themq to offend one of their fans.
     
  10. Fender Relic

    Fender Relic Forum Resident

    Location:
    PennsylBama
    I sure can't separate Dylan and Van. They speak some kind of universal musical language. Clapton knows this as well and he's far more than 70's Rock. More listening...less talking.
     
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  11. alchemy

    alchemy Forum Resident

    Location:
    Sterling, VA
    So no peak into see how the sausage is made, of a work in progress?
     
  12. Sordel

    Sordel Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Switzerland
    Either I do the work or you do by adding up all the songs I've mentioned transferring: I prefer that you do the work! ;) There are some other songs from boxed sets such as the Bootleg series and the Mono box ... but if I told you in advance what those were then it would kind of ruin the surprise when we got there. :p
     
  13. Richard--W

    Richard--W Forum Resident

    Sordel, forgive me, I don't wish to hurt your feelings, but after 11 pages of obtuse posts I have to ask myself why I've stuck with this thread as long as I have. Obviously, Dylan is not for you.
     
  14. Sordel

    Sordel Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Switzerland
    That's fine, no hurt feelings ... I've always accepted that many long-standing Dylan fans would be frustrated by a complete novice. On the subject of whether Dylan's for me, though, I listen to a fair amount of it for pleasure, and I certainly wouldn't if I didn't put the hours in, so I'll stick at it.
     
  15. Gabe Walters

    Gabe Walters Forum Resident

    I get a kick out of the Dylan fanatics attacking your motivations and biases, which I think you've made perfectly plain. I love Dylan, though I'm not of his generation and I haven't heard everything in his catalog, so I find this thread very enjoyable and refreshing.
     
  16. alchemy

    alchemy Forum Resident

    Location:
    Sterling, VA
    First I don't mind doing the work. Not at all. I wasn't aware your playlist for shadowed songs that you have yet to discuss. I understand you wanting to keep those under wraps.

    I just thought it would be an easier for you, who has already made the list, to just copy and paste your list into a post.

    Many of us are really enjoing your Dylan Journey, and some of us are tuning in and of the thread. The playlist is a quick way to peruse your journey.

    Enjoy!
     
    duggan likes this.
  17. Sordel

    Sordel Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Switzerland
    Shot Of Love

    Why This One? I spaced the Christian trilogy evenly over the three quarters, so this one is more or less due.

    Preconceptions. I liked Saved and Slow Train Coming so I suppose there’s an expectation that I’d like this one as well.
    1. “Shot Of Love”. Coming directly off Love And Theft the impact of the way this song starts was in marked contrast. It’s a great-sounding song, full of life and I like the strong vein of negative emotion in the song that rather undercuts the seeming optimism of its title.
    2. “Heart Of Mine”. But for the very unfinished studio sound this one sounds could be an Easy Listening song: musically, for example, the start of the verse reminds me of "When You're In Love With A Beautiful Woman” by Dr. Hook. Moreover, while you could argue that the subject of the song is sin, it really seems to be a straight love song. The “arhythmia” in the drumming is very odd indeed, though I sort of get what was intended; I don’t think I would be keen on this song anyway but that effect doesn’t make it any easier.
    3. “Property of Jesus”. The sentiment here seems rather one-sided for Dylan, but musically the song works well and could be a grower.
    4. “Lenny Bruce”. Of course we still know who Lenny Bruce was, so this song automatically has a pathos & candour that the same song would not have if written to some nameless figure. The casting of Bruce as an outlaw also makes the song an interesting fit to Dylan’s other outlaw narratives, and the pleasing hymn tune adds further value.
    5. “Watered-Down Love”. This song feels kind of half-baked: like a demo for a single. The odd drumming is again evident; I laughed when I later discovered that Ringo was drumming on this album but I still don’t know whether he’s the problem. I can’t say that the drumming actually spoils the track in any case because I don’t like in the first place.
    6. “The Groom’s Still Waiting At The Altar”. If you can forgive Dylan the considerable lyrical crime of rhyming altar with Gibraltar this is a real barn-burner of a mid-tempo blues.
    7. “Dead Man”. Not sure whether this is technically Reggae or Ska but it’s a cool little number either way. It’s nice to hear Dylan sing out fully in the chorus: he often writes too many lyrics to give himself this sort of space.
    8. “In The Summertime”. This song has the ambiguity that is missed from some other songs here (and particularly from “Property of Jesus”). The melody feels weak, but Dylan’s vocal has real emotional commitment and that’s probably reflected in the harmonica solo. [By the way, that’s a brutal fade at the end .., surprised that they couldn’t manage that better.]
    9. “Trouble”. At the start this sounds so much like Bone Machine-era Tom Waits that it’s almost surprising to hear Dylan’s voice on it. The song’s rather throwaway though.
    10. “Every Grain Of Sand”. A very interesting hymn, sung with evident conviction & sincerity, notable for the unusual sweetness of its harmonica solo.
    Overall. Shot Of Love is an exceptionally raw and “live-sounding” album to find in the 1980s; in fact it sounds closer to current fashion than many of Dylan’s more recent albums, nailing the rough ’n’ ready production that many artists seem to crave today. For all that, though, the mix is downright odd, with drums way higher than I would want. (I wrote the last sentence before reading up on the album and discovering that the mixing process had been troubled.)

    It’s easy to pick songs for my playlist from this album: “Every Grain Of Sand”, “The Groom’s Still Waiting At The Altar”, “Dead Man, Dead Man”, “Lenny Bruce” & the title track. Even the weaker tracks are unobjectionable. I’m sorry that we’ve actually reached the end of the Christian trilogy since it was clearly a fertile period of his career and rather to my taste.
     
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  18. alchemy

    alchemy Forum Resident

    Location:
    Sterling, VA
    Shot Of Love the fall of 1981 album. Never been a big fan of the Jesus songs / jesus period. I like it a lot where Bob is more ambiguous in speaking / singing of faith. I feel the Christian Period was good for Bob in that he got fresh blood for the gist of his songs. Almost all of the concert tapes of this period I'd full of gusto and energy. This period of his career deserves a Bootleg Series Box Treatment.

    Like I said never a fan of the Jesus songs, don't enjoy the parsing of the lyrics of those songs. That said, I'm very fond of The Property Of Jesus. I just love how Bob sings:

    Resent him to the bone,
    You got something better
    You got a heart of stone.

    Also love Groom Still Waiting At The Alter. There are great lines in there. Too bad it didn't come out with the Original Vinyl Album. We had to find it on the back of the Heart Of Mine single. Leave to Dylan to make the collecting of his music a parlor game.

    Lenny Bruce is dead, GE is the friend you never had, Yea! I wonder hoe many Bob has never had.

    Every Grain Of Sand, before this LP came out, a very close friend, did himself in. This song was great for me trying to figure it all out.

    This LP might not be in heavy rotation at my house, but it was a keeper.
     
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  19. jeddy

    jeddy Forum Resident

    The trouble with opinion
    is that everybody has one.
     
  20. alchemy

    alchemy Forum Resident

    Location:
    Sterling, VA
    And what is yours?
     
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  21. lschwart

    lschwart Senior Member

    Location:
    Richmond, VA
    Enjoying your posts, again, Sordel!

    One question: why do you think the rhyme of "altar" with "Gibraltar" is such a crime?

    L.
     
  22. Sordel

    Sordel Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Switzerland
    I guess: for two reasons. For it to be a satisfying rhyme to the ear you really need strong contrasting stems, so Dylan would have been better to my ear to have gone East of Malta, because the way one says the place name is almost "Gibr'altar" which sounds weak, like rime riche which evidently sounds good to the French but is always a bit 'off' in English. The other problem is that it sounds to me like the only reason for mentioning Gibraltar at all is to get the rhyme: geographically it would be the Mediterranean Sea or more likely North Africa but I think that Dylan had in mind the geographical area of Jesus' ministry, which (it's true) is East of the Rock of Gibraltar but quite a bit East but just West of Jordan.

    I don't doubt that Dylan has worse rhymes but he doesn't usually predicate a chorus on them!

    (Good song though, let's not miss the forest for the trees. ;))
     
    Dave Hoos likes this.
  23. Crispy Rob

    Crispy Rob Cat Juggler

    Location:
    Oakland, CA
    I don't really mean offense by this, and I am actually enjoying this thread quite a bit, but at times I think it might as well be titled "Karl Pilkington listens to Dylan".
     
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  24. streetlegal

    streetlegal Forum Resident

    Wow, you're holding Mr D to pretty darn high standards there! If that's what's bugging you, I would love to find out your normal standard of music artists (the ones you like) so I can go out and get me some--who do you recommend?
     
    Last edited: May 25, 2017
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  25. Dave Gilmour's Cat

    Dave Gilmour's Cat Forum Resident

    I personally love the Gibraltar/altar lyric.
     
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