Tangerine Dream - Jive years

Hi,

Just browsing thru Amazon UK's website and noticed the Sanctuary reissues are available at a good price? Any views on these verus the original pressings. I have the Jive pressings of Poland, Livemiles and Green Desert and they're fine but want to complete my collection so am wondering whether to go for original Jive discs or take the remasters.

Also, any views on the mid-90's SBM issues of the Virgin discs. I have most of them on original pressings or vinyl but still am missing a few.

Cheers

 

Anyone?

 

The original 2 disc/"fatboy "Relativity of Poland is the ONLY way to go on that album. No other version is complete! Some versions either eliminate the entire Tangent track or in the case of the remaster they removed several minutes from songs. A crime if you ask me. The original Polcand Relativity in my compares also trumped the remaster which was cold and lifeless. My advice is to dump any other issue and get the Relativity or the Vinyl.

In this thread I noted results from my Green Desert (great album!) compare.
http://www.stevehoffman.tv/forums/showthread.php?t=137682&highlight=

Later on I felt it may not have been pops on the jive but some diginoise. which would mean not a needledrop but still loses out to the 86 Relativity.


Livemiles only one I've ever heard is the original Caroline so I'm not of much help there. I will say this about the 90's SBM remasters - I own a bunch of them and while they are not bad not a single one was ever worth the money I spent on them. Especially EXIT which cost me quite a bit 10 years or so ago as the SBM is a Europe only release.

While the SBM remasters aren't too bad on their own they all have a cold, antiseptic quality to them. Sort of like sitting on stainless steel bench in a cold examination room. Not sure if it's the added compression during mastering or use of some NR... Tangerine Dreams sound is "digital" enough at least the original CDs provide a bit of warmth that is missing from the SBM's. Luckily the old Jive, Relativity, and Virgin CD's are generally inexpensive.

Please note the "Blue Years" era CD's, original Jive/Electro's and Relativity's use different masterings for every album. Green Desert (rec. in 1973) counts as part of the era in terms of record label but not by material to some.

 

That would make more sense to me, as I don't see how it could've been a needle drop to begin with. Green Desert was never released in any form prior to this issue; not even a test pressing was done AFAIK. The version which came out in the mid-80s has obvious additional production which would not have been possible in 1973.

 

The original Relativity did not have the "pops". They are only on the 1st track and not very loud but still there. Who knows maybe a manufacturing defect on my copy? I prefer the Relativity version's sound (and art too) so I won't seek another copy of the Jive/Electro (didn't he fight Spiderman) out. Once again Green Desert is a Great album! One of my all-time fav's by any artist.

P.S. Did the title of this thread change?

 

Are you trying to indicate that Green Desert first came out on CD rather than vinyl? I don't think this is true, but I don't think there was a needle drop either. The first release of Green Desert, AFAIK, was as the 6th disc of the In the Beginning box set on Relativity in 1985 or 1986, that also collected all their Ohr albums for reissue. Months later I saw it on CD and as as a separate vinyl disc. My copy in the box set had a very noticeable loud distorted passage that had what sounded to me like digital artifact noise rather than vinyl damage. So, I figured the pressing was made from a digital master even though the CD wasn't released yet. Strange, but sometimes the timing of releases in different configurations can be odd that way.

 

I believe that is correct. I was very young when that LP box came out and I wanted Green Desert but did not have nearly the money - was it an import in the US? About 6 months to a year later in 1986 I got it (as a gift) when it was available separately on cassette here in the US . The original Jive/Electro CD came out in 1986 according to TD sites, not sure about the Relativity but probably '86 or '87 at the latest.

It's possible that the great track "White Clouds" appeared on CD before the rest of the album. It was on The Collection CD from Castle which IIRC was out sometime in 1986.

 

Yes, Green Desert first came out in that box, but the CD -- first the Jive/Electro, later the Relativity -- followed soon after. It wasn't uncommon at that point for CD versions of new albums to take a bit longer than LP/cassette; Tyger was another another example (and then it was partially remixed, reconfigured, and reissued with a different sleeve not long after that...)

 

Nope, Relativity issued the entire box in the US.

 

Thanks. IIRC the album art in that set was in black and white. I think Green Desert used the Jive cover, not the later and really cool Relativity photo-realistic painted art.

 

Thanks for the reply Rick.

I've got Poland on vinyl so happy with that. Great album, as was pretty much everything of the Johannes Schmoelling era.

I agree Green Desert is superb, I've never understood why it doesn't seem to be that popular with TD fans. That and Logos are probably the two TD discs I listen to most in my collection. I've got the original Jive UK disc (green cover artwork) so may look into picking up a copy of the original Relativity release base on your favourable comments about the improved SQ.

Have you heard any of the other Jive-era albums e.g. Le Parc, Underwater Sunlight in respect of original pressings vs remasters? These are the ones I'm missing.

I've got virtually all of the Virgin years already on original vinyl or CD and based on your comments will look at original pressings to plug the gaps.. I only have one SBM disc, Cyclone, which sounds "OK" but nothing more.

Another question - have any of you guys got "The Keep" soundtrack disc? I've heard a bootleg version (fantastic music but so-so SQ) but I understand the genuine articles are rarer than hens teeth and have different track listings.

 

Hi Simon,

I've got Logos on original Virgin CD and vinyl. Any idea how they stack up against your French/Japan CD pressings? The vinyl sounds good but the side break is a pita on this occasion so I rarely play it!

 

While I prefer the Relativity, It's not a night and day difference. If your a big fan of the album like me it's must but if not the Jive is fine. My only real issue is with the first track after that they are close.

I have the Jive Underwater Sunlight but not the Relativity. Will have to pick one day. I do not have the remaster either, but at this point I won't bother with it.

Le Parc - I have the Jive, Relativity, and Remaster. From a 2 year old post here were my findings:
http://www.stevehoffman.tv/forums/showpost.php?p=3209589&postcount=21

While they are not horrible, if you don't have them save the cash and continue to seek out the Original Jive/Electro's, Relativity's, and Virgin's where applicable is my recommendation.

rick

P.S. Once again the Original Relativity Poland 2 disc set is the only way to go for that great album on CD IMHO

 

I have the Nimbus pressing of CDV-2257. If the Japan disc has better SQ I would try and pick up a copy.

 

Are the masterings the same on all?


My Logos is the MPO France with the 01 matrix as well. Wasn't easy to find but was dirt cheap when I did, smooth case too. IIRC MPO France was one of the first 5 or 6 CD factory's in the world to go online. I've a bunch of discs from them and they all sound nice.

 

I have a copy of that. I got it through the TD website at one point as part of a special promotion/gift after buying a bunch of other stuff in a big bundle. Need the tracklist? I can retreive that for ya.

 

Hi soundQman,

That would be great. Please PM me details.

Cheers

 

From Wikipedia:
"The Keep (1997) is the soundtrack to the movie The Keep (1983) by the German electronic music group Tangerine Dream. A limited run of 150 CDs were sold at a concert by the group in the UK in 1997. Virgin soon announced that the album would be available for general release in early 1998, but legal issues with the film studio stopped the release. In 1999, Tangerine Dream's own record label sold 300 copies of the Millennium Booster album set that included The Keep with a different cover."

I got my copy in the Millenium Booster package mentioned above.

 

Looks as though the Jive/Electro and Relativity mastering are not all different. Although the art is not the same the masterings of Underwater Sunlight are.... I got a copy of the Relativity today - well at least it wasn't too expensive :sigh Maybe I putin classifieds one day as it past the TD era I am a collector (not listener) of...


Tangerine Dream - Underwater Sunlight - Jive Electro.log: Peak level 100.0 %
Tangerine Dream - Underwater Sunlight - Jive Electro.log: Peak level 100.0 %
Tangerine Dream - Underwater Sunlight - Jive Electro.log: Peak level 98.2 %
Tangerine Dream - Underwater Sunlight - Jive Electro.log: Peak level 88.9 %
Tangerine Dream - Underwater Sunlight - Jive Electro.log: Peak level 79.8 %
Tangerine Dream - Underwater Sunlight - Jive Electro.log: Peak level 86.6 %

Tangerine Dream - Underwater Sunlight - Relativity.log: Peak level 100.0 %
Tangerine Dream - Underwater Sunlight - Relativity.log: Peak level 100.0 %
Tangerine Dream - Underwater Sunlight - Relativity.log: Peak level 98.2 %
Tangerine Dream - Underwater Sunlight - Relativity.log: Peak level 88.9 %
Tangerine Dream - Underwater Sunlight - Relativity.log: Peak level 79.8 %
Tangerine Dream - Underwater Sunlight - Relativity.log: Peak level 86.6 %

 

I decided to get the EAC peak values from my Green Desert discs as I had not saved them when doing it a few years ago. I tried using 2 different drives in my main PC and the first track would not rip (in this case test since I only want logs). I then tried on one of my backup PC's with dedicated CD only drive, not CD/DVD, and was able to read the first track. Although it did encounter an error it did achieve "Track quality 99.9 %".

This makes me think even more that the "diginoise"/vinyl type pops I heard on the first track of the Jive disc may only be a defect on my CD? The disc looks Mint- but that doesn't mean everything.

Here are the levels since I have them, quite a difference between the 2:

Tangerine Dream - Green Desert - UK Jive Electro.log: Peak level 97.1 %
Tangerine Dream - Green Desert - UK Jive Electro.log: Peak level 87.4 %
Tangerine Dream - Green Desert - UK Jive Electro.log: Peak level 81.0 %
Tangerine Dream - Green Desert - UK Jive Electro.log: Peak level 80.4 %

Tangerine Dream - Green Desert - UK for US Relativity.log: Peak level 56.1 %
Tangerine Dream - Green Desert - UK for US Relativity.log: Peak level 55.7 %
Tangerine Dream - Green Desert - UK for US Relativity.log: Peak level 49.4 %
Tangerine Dream - Green Desert - UK for US Relativity.log: Peak level 47.6 %

My preferred is the Relativity, but defects(?) on my disc aside the Jive is a nice listen. Anyone else have light pops/crackle/diginoise in the first minute or 2 of the first track on the Jive?

 

I did a few weeks ago for a good price on amazon com.
The first time they sent it to me the package got damaged and was returned to them by mail service.
Fortunately the retailer of that seller had one more copy in stock which now is my own.
And....it sounds nice and is complete.