The Telarc 1812 test...

Discussion in 'Audio Hardware' started by dharmabumstead, Nov 6, 2015.

  1. dharmabumstead

    dharmabumstead Well-Known Member Thread Starter

    Location:
    Snohomish, WA
    Got a copy of this notorious record (beautiful pressing and packaging!) to test my system.

    My system failed. I think.

    It didn't blow the stylus right off the record, but there's a distinct pop sound during the cannon shots. I was playing this on a VPI Classic 2 with an Ortofon 2M Black cartridge set to 1.8g tracking.

    Is my system set up incorrectly, or is this just a ridiculously demanding pressing that requires far more expensive gear than I have?
     
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  2. Not too many can track it all. I'm sure a Shure V15 would and any of the other super trackers, but it blew my dad's Dynavector d17 in a Linn Ottok out of the groove, whereas an old Kiseki Blue in the same arm did pretty well.
    Loved the "Warning: Digital Cannons".
     
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  3. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff

    Location:
    Marysville, WA
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  4. MrRom92

    MrRom92 Forum Supermodel

    Location:
    Long Island, NY

    Even though there was a claim of no processing on the cd, there had to be SOME processing. There was a super early cd with a DIDZ code which was visibly clipped, as shown in the waveform on that site. There was a cd that came out pretty much immediately later, this time with a DIDX code, and it wasn't clipped. This happened around 1984/1985 I think. I figured this out when I had two copies of the cd in front of me and realized they sounded very different and one was horribly distorted.


    If I'm not mistaken, these were recorded on 50khz recorders and downsampled to 44.1, so some processing had to occur to get it on disc, but much less than other CDs at the time which often went through multiple analog stages. I think what they were implying by "no processing" is that there was no analog stages in the mastering as was typical of releases at the time. The two CDs did digitally synchronize but of course the waveforms were pretty different, in terms of overall level.


    Not sure if that DIDX cd was valuable or anything but I'm pretty sure I tossed it, considering I'd never play it again.
     
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  5. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff

    Location:
    Marysville, WA
    Lo and behold, that DIDZ-10015 disc is the one I have, manufactured by Matsushita in Japan. (I bought this new at Best, formerly Jafco, back in the old days.)
     
  6. MrRom92

    MrRom92 Forum Supermodel

    Location:
    Long Island, NY
    Ouch... that's unlucky hahah. The downside of being an early adopter! In any case, I'm assuming the 50khz master was played back for the lacquer cut. While I don't own the LP, I have seen it - I would definitely describe the groove modulations as sharp and well defined, but the peaks definitely do not appear to have been clipped. I guess the distortion in that CD was a one off fluke that was corrected as soon as they caught it. The disc and packaging look pretty much identical, not until you look closely do you see the slight change from Z to X, and I think the barcode slightly moved as well IIRC.
     
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  7. GyrodecMan

    GyrodecMan Active Member


    Your system failed . There is only one system that can handle it . That system belongs to billionaire Yuki Sakamoto. He lives on top of mountain at a secret location in Japan!
     
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  8. Jack Flannery

    Jack Flannery Forum Resident

    Location:
    Houston, TX
    I had a HK St7 in the 70's that could not track it. Had a Thorens that almost could. That canon shot cut quite a groove.
     
  9. Erik Tracy

    Erik Tracy Forum Resident

    Location:
    San Diego, CA, USA
    I have this set as well and my current setup (Technics SL1200mkII/Denon DL-160, VTF 1.9g) can't track all the shots either.

    Although, when I first had the Denon mounted I was running it at 1.6g and it popped and skipped early on this test section. Going up to 1.9 improved the tracking for a couple more shots.

    All part of the pot - stir well, adjust for taste.:p
     
  10. Pete Norman

    Pete Norman Active Member

    it's over modulated, with triangular wave forms, not something you would get away with today..
     
  11. gingerly

    gingerly Forum Resident

    I've always thought it was funny that there was an LP of this - it's a demo of dynamic range and digital recording! It's been a long time since I've heard this one. It IS (or was) very impressive. My dad has the non-distortion CD somewhere or another... I'll have to see if I can borrow it.
     
  12. Drew769

    Drew769 Forum Resident

    Location:
    NJ
    My VPI Prime with Ortofon Cadenza Black cannot track the UHQR version of this album. Ridiculous!!
     
  13. Sheik Yerbouti

    Sheik Yerbouti Forum Resident

    Location:
    Germany
    There are three different masterings of the Telarc "1812". Stan Ricker once talked about them in an interview. The cannon blasts and their trackability differ quite a bit.
     
  14. george2210

    george2210 Active Member

    The 2m black needs a tracking force of 1,5 g not 1,8 g.
     
  15. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff

    Location:
    Marysville, WA
    From here:
     
  16. Mike from NYC

    Mike from NYC Forum Resident

    Location:
    Surprise, AZ
    When I first bought it in the early 80s not long after it was released I tried to play it and the needle skidded, shook and shacked. Still does the same thing today with a much better cart and TT. Oh well.
     
  17. dharmabumstead

    dharmabumstead Well-Known Member Thread Starter

    Location:
    Snohomish, WA
    The one I have is the First Impression Music pressing - FIM LP 005-LE. Pressed by QRP, and impressively packaged in a nice box. Pristine quiet pressing; I didn't even bother running it through any cleaning.

    Credits on the album list the mastering engineers as Doug Sax and Sangwook "Sunny" Nam at The Mastering Lab, with Michael Bishop of Five/Four Productions as "consulting audio engineer". Mastering date listed is May 2012.
     
    Last edited: Nov 6, 2015
  18. dharmabumstead

    dharmabumstead Well-Known Member Thread Starter

    Location:
    Snohomish, WA
    VPI recommends setting the tracking force a bit heavier on the Classic tables. Per Mr. Harry Weisfeld himself: "I track all 2m cartridges at 1.8 grams, sounds best like that."
     
    Last edited: Nov 6, 2015
  19. The FRiNgE

    The FRiNgE Forum Resident

    hmmm,
    Gotta find the 1812 among my 8,000 LP's in storage. I remember playing it on a Dual 1218 with a V15-RS (beryllium cantilever) and it tracked perfectly. I wonder which pressing I have?
     
  20. The FRiNgE

    The FRiNgE Forum Resident

    Just checked the CD I sold earlier this year, a DIDZ version. The cannons did not sound good at all. I may seek a DIDX disc to check it out, plus the one on vinyl I still have.
     
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  21. dharmabumstead

    dharmabumstead Well-Known Member Thread Starter

    Location:
    Snohomish, WA
    Just played it again. It tracked it! There was a slightly clicking noise at the first cannon shot (that sounded like digital clipping), but it didn't skip. Cool!
     
  22. dharmabumstead

    dharmabumstead Well-Known Member Thread Starter

    Location:
    Snohomish, WA
    Now playing.[​IMG]
     
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  23. dharmabumstead

    dharmabumstead Well-Known Member Thread Starter

    Location:
    Snohomish, WA
    Gotta love a record that comes with a damage disclaimer!

    [​IMG]
     
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  24. dharmabumstead

    dharmabumstead Well-Known Member Thread Starter

    Location:
    Snohomish, WA
    The grooves with the infamous cannon shots...

    [​IMG]
     
  25. OcdMan

    OcdMan Forum Resident

    Location:
    Maryland
    Really? That's interesting. That's 0.1g passed the top end of the range for the Black. I was just wondering earlier today if there is anyone that runs their cartridge in excess of the specified VTF range.
     

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