Unhappy with Ortofon OM 20

I've had this cartridge on a project debut from the get-go. It is detailed, it has a lot of presence and a very nice soundstage. I found the bass to be a bit on the thin side. The thing is that,to me, it sounds bright, specially on the top end and high frequencies. I checked gear and setup with my regular dealer and everything seems to be ok. He said that I should look for a warmer sound. I was thinking of a NAGAOKA MP 110. Can you chime in with your opinions? Thanks in advance

 

change to higher spec OM 30/40 stylus might improve sound

 

The OM series has a quite linear response which differs from many other cartridges. Loading should be around 200 pF and 38-42 kOhm, 47 kOhm makes them a bit brighter than they need to be.

 

Have not heard the OM-20. The Nagaoka MP-110 is certainly sweet-sounding, so is the Audio-Technica AT7V. Both budget carts under $200.

 

Here are some needle drops links. OM10, OM40 and Shure V15Vx/Jico SAS, also more in the thread. That said, it is possible to tune the Shure/SAS and OM10 sound quite similar in terms of tonal balance by adjusting loading. Not exactly the same of course, but rather close if you do listening tests.

Budget Cartridge Shootout - Page 4 - Vinyl Engine

 

I got back into vinyl with a Project-Debut and Ortofon cartridge. Lots of surface on used and new vinyl. I got a Denon DL-160 which is not made anymore, sadly. Have a look at the Denon DL-110 or something in the Audio-Technica line. I run two TT's, one with an AT-150MLX and the other with at Denon DL-103r. Both brands track well and seem to pick up much less surface noise than my Ortofon Concorde with a 40 stylus.

 

The OM40 is noisier than the OM10/OM20 especially HF noise. Perhaps it is due to to the stylus shape and/or that it extends higher up in frequency. I had an OM30 once, I think that one actually sounds better than the 40.

 

This is a measurement with fixed frequencies of my OM40. It is a bit high loaded - it would probably show a +/-1 or better dB 20-20000 Hz with slightly less loading resistance.

 

Agreed on the 40 being a bit noisier - It's insanely detaild, but not so smooth. I've hear folks say that the best compromise is the 30, sort of like the Black vs. the Bronze for their newer carts.

With respect to the OP's issue - what kind of cart body do you have- the regular OM body, or the OM Super? That can make a difference...

 

According to forum members, Audio Technica cartridges have a reputation to be even brighter than Ortofons. Let's put it this way: I'm mainly looking for a warm sweet sound even it means losing top-end
or high frequencies or even details. I've tried the shure m97 but i find it a bit dull and boring. I feel at a crossroads now and I don't want to give up on vinyl. Good tracking would come in handy. Ortofon 0m 20 is
not the best tracker in the world, so to speak...

 

The Om 20, not the super om 20.

 

make sure you are loading the cart well - the Ortofons need a stupid amount of capacitance - like 300-500pf to be happy. That *might* improve things a little bit for you, but I'm not sure.

 

There is some difference in the highs between OM vs super OM given the same load, but I cannot recall which one that was brightest. Again the top end can be tamed with loading in both versions. The ATs and the Nagaoka have a bit of a dip in the 3-8 kHz range followed by a bit peaky region between 10-20 kHz. The peak can again be reduced by lowering the resistance. Usually the dip around 0.5-2 dB in the 3-7 kHz range makes the sound more smooth.

 

Not heard of that high loading for the Super OMs. To get +/-1 dB or better between 20-20,000 Hz the optimal load is 195 pF and 42 kOhm.

 

The Shure/SAS has a bit of a dip 3-8 kHz followed by a peak, quite different from the OM using the same load.

 

Also this link is informative

New Lamps for Old

The Ortofon black is very linear up to the HF, and should thus have a lower resistance to tame the peak and become linear, also lower capacitance than the 280 shown. The REGA Exact has quite som dip in the smooth range and must be loaded with quite much higher capacitance, perhaps around 600-800 pF.

 

True for many AT carts, but here's a description of the AT7V:

"Best of the Lot. Only the righteous few will hear the beautiful sound that is the AT7V. It comes directly from Japan through a direct purchase from LP Gear, but this is no new design. It has been a favourite of the Japanese for decades. It has the body from the 150 series, but not the micro-line stylus. Even so, the nude diamond has a very narrow shape of .2 x .7 mil. I takes what the 440MLa creates and smooths out the sound significantly. It's still there, but a violin should never attack your ears, and with this cartridge they never will. The highs are complete without the exaggeration that so many carts tend to have (some reviewers like that attack). I want to hear the sound as it was played, not something artificially bright. Should you desire you want the exaggerated sound, the 150MLX stylus will fit properly."

It's very musical, offers a full range of sound without being bright, and is pleasantly warm without feeling rolled off like the M97xE.

I'm spinning mine right now, as I'm typing this. The vinyl I'm playing I bought used, and just unpacked it. It is not cleaned by anything but a carbon brush, with plenty of gunk in the grooves, still, I'm sure, plus I'm listening through cans, for added clarity. The verdict - it's picking up almost no surface noise, so, it's also very forgiving. At $159, it may be precisely the bargain gem you're looking for.

 

I was off on the low end - it's 200-400pf for the super OM body, but some of the OM series (5E for example) have recommended ranges that go all the way up to 600pf per Ortofon's site.
Point being, you certainly can't hurt anything by upping the capacitance, though it may not help either.

 

What He Said!

 

Shure m97xe would get you warmth and plenty of smooth bass, with stylus upgrades available down the line, all for 100 clams.

 

Are you tail up or tail down on the stylus rake? Makes a difference with bass response.

 

I use the OM series on two turntables - first the OM 20, then 30 and then 40. Each step provided more detail and 'air', with the 40 the most detailed and the most 'air'.

Tonally I found them similar, though as it has been pointed out, by changing the loading the HF response changes. As the higher quality stylii provide more HF detail, then it makes sense that there might need to be more adjustment to the loading to balance the sound. Both my amplifiers have adjustable cartridge loadings.

I remember thinking that they seemed 'light on' in the bass area at first - though when a record contained a lot of bass, and low bass, it was reproduced. I don't think the OMs have a 'warm sound'.

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I found that the more advanced the stylus profile, the cleaner the record needed to be - each sound became more separated, distinct and defined, which had a positive effect for the instruments and a negative effect for any 'ticks' and 'pops'. Cleaning a record removed any 'extras' to the sound that could be removed.

 

This, 100%. When I ran a Super OM40, immaculate, pristine vinyl sounded sublime, but anything less and every little flaw was brought to the forefront.

 

I would try more tracking force. At least 1.75 grams or even a little more.

 

Sounds really promising. Thank you