Velvet Underground's S/T Third LP - Best Pressing?

Howdy all,

I was wondering if anyone could compare between different original pressings of this fantastic album.

• Were either the "ASCAP" editions or "BMI" editions pressed from a dupe tape, sent to opposite ends of the country, or? Why do these variants exist?
• Does one sound better than the other? How so? It is also my understanding that both variants contain Reed's "Closet" mix.
• The yellow-label or white-label promo original pressings - How do they compare sonically? Same closet mix?
• It's also my understanding that all repressings after the 1960s releases are digitally mastered, and no stereo repressings have been made that were not made from a CD source. The '85 black-label was mastered from the then-new digital transfers, correct? And the Sundazed mono copy (from the box) is sourced from a high-resolution digital transfer?
  
• UK original pressings - were these sourced from a tape copy of the Valentin mix sent overseas, or the first generation master reel? I generally don't like buying UK copies of music recorded in the US because of the tape-dupe factor, but seeing as it's the only way to get an all-analog Valentin ...

I feel like there's a significant lack of information on the best pressing of this LP because of the difficult task of obtaining copies. Truly a tragedy.

I REALLY hope we see these Velvet Underground remasters/reissues/reboxings continue, with a decent reissue of the third album mixes on vinyl!

For reference:
http://olivier.landemaine.free.fr/vu/discog/lps/usa/lpsusa.html
http://www.discogs.com/Velvet-Underground-The-Velvet-Underground/release/1491938

 

Bumpity Bump.

 

Hm. I wonder about that, and I doubt it, but I'm not sure.

I remember a bunch of "budget reissues" of VU stuff in the early 80s. They had a sticker or printing that said something like "special low price." Is that the '85 pressing you are talking about? I seem to recall that my copy of the third album was a different mix than the one that showed up soon afterwards on the first 3rd album CD, and this confused me. I'd also be inclined to say that my copy was from a little earlier....maybe 1984.

Is it possible that there were 80s reissues that used old pressing plates?

And is it possible that there were also re-pressings in the 70s that used these plates? Or were the records out of print?

 

Another factor to consider is that the original LP version of the compilation "VU" has a few seconds of music at the start of "Foggy Notion" that are not on the CD. Whether or not it is digitally sourced, it's not an identical master.

 

Re: the above question.

http://forums.stevehoffman.tv/threa...-vinyl-re-issue-question.123438/#post-2807111

You aren't going to get closer to the source than that answer right there.

Sidenote: I'd love to get a definitive answer on what Sundazed's mono mix of this album is all about. I've searched and come up with nothing but marketing doublespeak.

 

By the way.....It bears repeating that NOT all individual CDs of the 3rd album are solely the Valetin mix (Wikipedia has this wrong today). This old thread gives details.

http://forums.stevehoffman.tv/threa...-3rd-lp-closet-mix-or-val-valentin-mix.46524/

 

My problem is - "sourced from analog tapes" and "cut directly from original analog tapes with no digital processing whatsoever" are two different things. Every reissue of this band will be technically sourced from analog tapes. (Or an LP, I guess, which is also sourced from the analog tapes.) That doesn't mean that it's an all-analog release. I don't know if Mr. Levenson was inferring all-analog or not.

 

My error - I contacted Mr. Levenson via PM in order to clarify and confirm, and here was his response:

"The 1984/85 vinyl reissues - analog cuts for sure. A digital step would've been too cumbersome then!

The vinyl LPs came out before we prepared CD masters. The CDs were an afterthought.

Also the Sterling NY transfers that we made for the CDs were sent to Germany for CD manufacture, and it is there that they made a mess of the VU 3rd CD.
After reviewing the transfers that we sent them someone replaced some tracks with sources from the German vault, thinking they sounded better.
That's how the first CD issue of the 3rd album ended up being part Valentin mix and part Closet mix.

Regards,

Bill"

I was wrong about the '80s pressings being digitally pressed/sourced, they are all-analog. Score! Sorry about the confusion.

Too bad we don't have an all-analog repressing of the Closet Mix, too ... those originals in nice condition are pricey. Anyone yet have any comparison information on the first pressing variations?

 

I have always thought that the 80's VU vinyl sounded really nice. Good to hear some more details on how they were produced.

 

I found this on goldminemag.com ( http://www.goldminemag.com/article/is-digital-remastering-delightful-or-dreadful-for-vinyl-reissues )

Sundazed recently gifted us with a five-LP box full of mono Velvet Underground and Nico vinyl.
"Each and every song on each and every LP was sourced from the appropriate, vintage analog master,” producer Bob Irwin tells us. “Certain things, because of the physical location of the master, had to be transferred to a hi-res file. But, rest assured that in every case, the original analogs were the source for our vinyl.”
And it shows.

I wonder what those "certain things" were.

 

Yup. That's exactly what I'm talking about.

But to my question, here's what gets me: I read an interview somewhere with Irwin I think (real definitive sourcing here, I know, sorry) where he said they had to use the lousy mid-80s mixes of the 1969 album's material due to a standing order from the band that their stuff not be futzed with in anyway. Ok, lots of bands have that in place. However, that doesn't explain the mono VU album where I've read it's not a vintage mix, but it's not just a fold down either. So, what is it?

 

I usually just go for the closet mix in the cd box.

 

It's hard to believe that this is still a secret.

The British 1971 pressing of the third Velvet Underground album is not only Lou Reed's mix, it sounds terrific, as though it's been let out of the closet. If I could have only one version this would be it.

 

you mean the MGM version?

 

MGM 2353 022 SELECT

Marketed by Polydor

 

Huh. I was under the impression that all vintage European copies of this LP had the Valentin mix, and were of course sourced from tape dupes.

 

I seem to recall reading (and this could be completely wrong) that it is an unreleased fold-down of the Closet mix which had some mastering/EQ moves in the process to make it "pop" on the radio.

Personally, I wish they would have just used the stereo Closet mix. '1969' is stereo anyways as well.

 

Yeah, I heard something like that too. Probably as close to the truth as we'll ever get.

Seems kind of pointless to me. That was an album definitely recorded to be heard in stereo. I'd much rather have had a quality stereo pressing than a fake mono one.

 

It is my understanding that the '85 black label vinyl pressings are all-analog . . . I could be wrong. In any case, the s/t is the Valentin mix and easily the best I have heard this album sound . . . highly recommended.

 

Stands to reason that it was sourced from a copy tape, but it lacks the roll-off that makes the U.S. pressing sound like it was recorded in a closet.

The British first pressing was indeed the Valentin mix (as was the Canadian) but the second pressing was the Lou Reed mix.

Actually, I think most if not all of the European Polydors pressed between 1971 and the early 1980s were Lou Reed's mix and those that I've heard have sounded nice - so you don't have to pay for an expensive British 1971 issue to get that sound.

 

You're correct, I was mistaken at my assumption. (See post #8)

How can you tell all these different pressings from each other? I can't seem to find any source of information about any pressings between 1969 and 1984/5.

 

A useful site on the Velvet Underground:

http://olivier.landemaine.free.fr/vu/

 

Oh, I actually linked to that site in my first post, but I didn't know there were more pages of information. Cool, thanks.

 

An excellent site. Been running as long as I've known the internet (20 years+). The gig and LP/CD/Bootleg guide is essential. Unfortunately (knowing this forum ), it doesn't rate pressings.

 

after reading this thread bid and won on one of the 1984 re-issues sounds AMAZING. the vocals are front and center.lou even sounds like he has a head cold on "some kinda love" however this is remastered by greg calbi not bill levenson.now i am confused!