Why no 'USA' Prog bands made the big 5?

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by Rufus rag, Mar 5, 2018.

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  1. jay.dee

    jay.dee Forum Resident

    Location:
    Barcelona, Spain
    Let's convene a Prog synod, dear Bishop, and eradicate all prog heresies once and for all. We have some great traditions and experience in these matters in Spain... ;)
     
  2. stodgers

    stodgers Forum Resident

    Location:
    Montana
    Every band is a sum of their influences, the difference is whether or not they transcend them. Rush unquestionably did. I don't think anyone out there would say either Styx or Kansas did.
     
  3. stodgers

    stodgers Forum Resident

    Location:
    Montana
    And Jimmy Page was neither of those, yet look how much he accomplished by interpreting the music of American black men.
     
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  4. kwadguy

    kwadguy Forum Resident

    Location:
    Cambridge, MA
    I know Kansas is poo-poo'd as mainsteam rock with some progressive leanings, but at their best, they were very good.
     
  5. stax o' wax

    stax o' wax Forum Resident

    Location:
    The West
    They ALL hoped on the bandwagon dude.
    It was a post Sgt. Pepper music world.
     
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  6. grbl

    grbl Just Lurking

    Location:
    new york
    Because none of them were any good.
     
  7. mark winstanley

    mark winstanley Pick up a fast car, burn my name in the road

    oh i understand, i wasn't hacking at you. i am not big on labels anyhow. how do you label frank for example, lso is not sheik yerbouti is not grand wazoo is not just another band from l.a etc etc.
    we like to put things in boxes. boxes hide a lot
     
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  8. stodgers

    stodgers Forum Resident

    Location:
    Montana
    I've always chalked this up to a difference in actual genres:
    • Progressive: music that evolves, grows and changes with each subsequent release
    • Prog: music that fits a formula of time, tempo and stylistic changes within an album that repeats on each successive release.
    The best example I find to demonstrate this is Dream Theater. Up through Scenes From a Memory, the band was evolving and changing their sound and maturing as artists. From Metropolis II onward, they locked into a formula that was designed to please their fan base and did not markedly change from one album to the next. You can interchange songs from any of those albums and they all would work on another album just as well.

    Contrast that with Rush. You can follow Rush from one album to the next and there doesn't seem to be any great leaps. But skip an album? And whoa, there is a huge difference in their approach. To me, they were the most progressive of all bands because until T4E, they were in a constant evolution.
     
  9. Chris DeVoe

    Chris DeVoe Forum Resident

    Was anyone expecting that?
     
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  10. Say It Right

    Say It Right Forum Resident

    Location:
    Niagara Falls
    Must be some sort of record here to go out 9 whole pages before making a thread about The Beatles.
     
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  11. Not sure what the point of diminishing Kansas and Styx’s stature. There are actual fans of both bands that will not agree with you on this point.
     
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  12. mark winstanley

    mark winstanley Pick up a fast car, burn my name in the road

    if you love music you will listen to all sorts of stuff. if you love music you will not be overly worried about a label associated with some apparent particular form of music. labels and boxes cause problems and lock bands into cages
     
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  13. Chris DeVoe

    Chris DeVoe Forum Resident

    "Interpreting" is being generous - he frequently flat-out stole songs.
     
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  14. stax o' wax

    stax o' wax Forum Resident

    Location:
    The West
    What will we discuss then?? ;)
     
  15. Say It Right

    Say It Right Forum Resident

    Location:
    Niagara Falls
    Yeah, put a Minimoog in the hands of Styx and they suddenly think they're ELP.
     
  16. jay.dee

    jay.dee Forum Resident

    Location:
    Barcelona, Spain
    Definitely nobody, because our chief weapon is surprise... Also fear... Plus ruthless efficiency and almost fanatical devotion to Prog! :D
     
  17. mark winstanley

    mark winstanley Pick up a fast car, burn my name in the road

    wait! our four main weapons are surprise ..... nooooooobody expects
     
  18. Purple Jim

    Purple Jim Forum Resident

    Location:
    Little Britain
    Because USA had the good sense to keep away from the horrendous genre of prog.
     
  19. Chris DeVoe

    Chris DeVoe Forum Resident

    Hush, or you'll be put in the comfy chair!
     
  20. bizmopeen

    bizmopeen Forum Resident

    Location:
    Oswego, IL
    I think it's because, as noted earlier, prog was born in and informed by UK/European sensibilites. The same reason we generally don't talk about Legendary Performers in British Jazz, French Rock'n'Roll, Canadian Hip-Hop and Japanese Funk.
     
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  21. gd0

    gd0 Looney Tunes and Merrie Melodies

    Location:
    Golden Gate
    I like Rush well enough, and despite Geddy's songs and vocals, I guess I can grudgingly assess them as "distinctive" and progressive.

    Styx always struck me as AOR. Sorry.

    Kansas really is the wild card. It is very easy to dismiss them, because they got noticed, once and for all, on the heels of Dust In The Wind. Thereafter, they were every bit as MOR as Styx, even similar-sounding. I think their first four albums got lost in the shuffle, and imo, are very serious-business prog, even with unavoidable US flavor.

    FZ is my favorite artist, all-time. I put him squarely in his own category. There was prog in there, along with a buncha other things. My assessment is his: American Music Composer.

    If that is The Definition, then to me the conversation begins and ends with King Crimson.
    Consider me inquisited. :laugh:
     
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  22. stodgers

    stodgers Forum Resident

    Location:
    Montana
    I am an 'actual fan' of Kansas. They had a brief run of excellent albums, then the rather pedestrian Morse years, then... nothing. Kansas peaked early, and while it was an excellent peak, it wasn't anywhere near the run of 30+ years that Rush had.

    Styx... well, I'll leave that one alone.
     
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  23. stodgers

    stodgers Forum Resident

    Location:
    Montana
    That is my definition, and while I can understand the desire to include King Crimson, I always thought of them as just a rotating group of musicians around Fripp. King Crimson's music didn't change, the band did.

    Then again, I am nowhere near a big enough fan of them to make a qualified opinion.
     
  24. Chris DeVoe

    Chris DeVoe Forum Resident

    My favorite review of Kate Bush's album The Dreaming was in Musician magazine where they said it was "...what Progressive Rock would have sounded like had it actually progressed."
     
  25. mark winstanley

    mark winstanley Pick up a fast car, burn my name in the road

    FZ is my favorite artist, all-time. I put him squarely in his own category. There was prog in there, along with a buncha other things. My assessment is his: American Music Composer.

    Zappa is brilliant and one of my many favourites. He certainly created his own category, a rare thing. He was very american and a composer, so i reckon that's a fair assessment.

    i like styx and kansas fine ... but i think for the most part in the seventies it seemed that any band with a keyboard player would just about be called "prog"
     
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