Widescreen film, but with a 4:3 opening scene?

I watched The Harder They Fall (1956) recently for the first time on Amazon Prime. What an enjoyable movie. Humphrey Bogart in widescreen and HD. What a treat!

I noticed though that opening credits of the movie were in a much narrower aspect ratio, perhaps 1.37 or 1.33:1. After the credits were over it switched to 1:85:1. I've never seen this before.

I first thought that it a mistake from Amazon, but then realized that opening scene didn't seem to be cropped strangely. That is, the spacing looked well balanced with the text, so much so that I think it was meant to be that way. Was this a common thing to do?

I recall the opposite of this happening sometimes when a movie is shown on back before HDTVs were the norm: the opening scene would be in its native widescreen aspect ratio (with black bars on the top and bottom), and then switch to a pan and scanned 4:3 "full screen" version after the credits were done.

 

That’s odd. 1956 was well into the widescreen era, so I don’t know why the credits would have been different.

The title that popped into my head was THIS IS CINERAMA, which I seem to recall, starts out with a narrow “normal” film frame, before expanding out into the Cinerama 3 panel vista.

 

If memory serves The Incredibles starts off with 4:3 'video' interviews before the story proper kicks in (in widescreen)

 

Checking my DVD copy right now, and...it's 1:66 during the credits, and then it switches to 1:85. Artistic choice ? Checking IMDB next...
and nothing.

Googling it just brings up streaming conversations.

Betting @Vidiot can shed some light on this.

Thanks for having me pull this classic out though ! Sincerely.

 

Mad Max 2

I think.

 

Smokey and the Bandit 3

 

Life of Pi had the screen changing all the time if I remember it right. Also the episode of Family Guy where Stewie goes back in time to the first episode is in different screen ratios.

The Girl Can't Help It?

 

Alice Doesn't Live Here Anymore

 

I bet The Aviator has this trait....the whole movie morphs from the appearance of switching from film-stock-to-film-stock, to conjure up the look of cinema formats passing through the eras of the chronological storyline. Rather unique...and geeky!

 

Yup. The prologue describing World War 3, consisting of black-and-white scenes from MAD MAX and public domain footage, is 4:3 and jumps to widescreen as we enter the movie's present.

 

The Grand Budapest Hotel changes aspect ratios throughout the film.

 

Didn't Dr. Strangelove have flip-flopping aspect ratios throughout the film?
1.66 and 1.85

 

Thanks for having a look MYKE!

Here's a screenshot from the Amazon Prime version during the credits:



I measure this to be about 1.45:1 . If you're seeing 1.66:1 during the credits, that's a measurable difference I'd say. Perhaps you have a screen shot? If there are differences between the DVD and Amazon's HD version, who's to say what the director's original intent was? I'm not sure I see any artist benefit in this instance of having the opening credits in a different aspect ratio. It precedes the first real scene buy just a few moments.

 

Beautifully done in Sam Rami's "Oz the Great and Powerful."

 

Sneakers (1992) with Robert Redford and Sidney Poitier (among many others) starts off with a flashback scene from "DECEMBER 1969" in 1.33:1 during the opening credits which ends with snow falling as it cleverly dissolves to a 4:3 TV with static and pans into a "modern day" scene opening up to 1.85:1.

 

In the example given by the OP, it sounds like this was done to protect the opening credit sequence for future television broadcasts. True, it usually works the other way around, i.e. widescreen to 4:3 pan-and-scan, but this was most likely an early-ish (widescreen became popular in 1953) attempt to sidestep the problem of credits being cropped on television screens.

 

"Oz the great and powerful"

 

It's very possible the entire film was meant to be shown in 1.66, but it's a tough call. A lot changed in the 1950s: the decade started with most films being in 1.37, then Cinerama hit with 2.66, then Fox introduced 2.55 CinemaScope (later reduced to 2.35 in 1958), and Paramount's VistaVision nominally stuck with 1.66 or 1.85. By the end of the 1950s and early 1960s, I think most anamorphic films were in 2.35 (later 2.39), and most "flat" films were intended for 1.85, but there are a lot of exceptions. Disney stuck with the kind of odd 1.75 aspect ratio, used for films like Mary Poppins.

B&W movies from this era are traditionally preserved with B&W finegrain prints, and there's always the chance that somebody struck a 1.37 print from the negatives and lost some of the widescreen area. I know this has happened with some TV projects over the years, but it's hard to say without actually looking at the film elements. I'd say it's pretty weird for an early 1950s film to change aspect ratios after the credits (This Is Cinerama notwithstanding).

 

The Girl Han't Help It.

 

Galaxy Quest opens up to widescreen at a pivotal moment early in the film. In the theatre this was very impressive. I’m not sure how the home video release handles it.


Update: “Originally, film started at a 4:3 ratio during the opening scene (footage from an episode of the fictional TV series), then expanded to 1.85:1 for the first 20 minutes, then expanded again to 2.40:1 once the action moved to outer space.”

“[In the] home video versions [the]opening scene remains in 4:3 (windowboxed in the center of the frame with black bars on all four sides), but the picture then expands directly to 2.40:1.”

So, not as impressive on home video.

 

Oliver Stone's JFK opens with actual newsreel 4:3 footage until Kennedy is shot and then it moves to filmed 2:35 from there on.



Say what you want about that film's actual content, but it's a dazzling cinematic tour-de-force on a sheer technical level.

 

Close -- but I think there's some 4x3 stuff here and there throughout the film. I've often said that JFK was the only movie ever made that had 35mm flat (spherical) film, 35mm anamorphic film, 16mm negative, 16mm print, Super 8mm, Regular 8mm, videotape, slides, some recreations and some real material (often intercut), all thrown together. Basically, every visual format you could use in a movie, except maybe for 65mm and Cinerama. It's a wacky film.

 

Is this thread devoted strictly to 1.33:1 opening up to either 1.85:1 or 2.35:1, or is it primarily concerned with shifting aspect ratios?

The Horse Whisperer (1998) doesn't use 1.33:1 but is in 1.85:1 at the beginning in New York (reels 1 and 2) and once the location shifts to Montana it opens up to 2.35:1 (reels 3-9).