I think the differences become apparent very fast, so you just have to listen to a couple of songs to tell the differences.
Alright, I can say a few words about the first impression. Mind you, this is my first time listening to 300B tubes or a 300B amp. I picked up the FEZZ Audio Mira Ceti today. The first impression was as follows: Voices? Hm, that could well be something. More body or space than with my Simply Italy. So as far as voices are concerned, more corpus/space. Moreover: This amp plays very relaxed. emphasis is on the mids. What stood out negatively? The bass. It was almost wiped out in my chain compared to the Unison Simply Italy. This one has a fast, impulsive, contoured and also dry bass. With the 300B the bass firstly is really subdued, secondly it is rather broad than to the point. Second negative aspect: The 300B amp doesn’t have the dynamic, the speed, the liveliness of a Simply Italy in terms of the instruments etc. It really is hardly comparable with the Simply Italy (this has two EL34 and two ECC82 plugged in ) in this regard. Everything is very relaxed. After a few songs I thought, okay, voices yes, but the rest no. Especially as someone who has bought all the jazz records from the Tone Poets and Blue Note Classics series so far, which are so great, it probably won't work with the two of us. So after an hour I was just about to stop this experiment. Songs I listend to (sometimes in direct comparison to the Simply Italy): You And Your Friend (Dire Straits) => well, there was something missing in various aspects; Oh Death (Rhiannon Giddens) => here the percussions sounded almost like dead/absent to me in comparison to what the Italy delivers); And I Love Her (Al Di Meola); A Thousand Kisses Deep (Till Bröner) => Bass lacking punch; saxophone sharpness); Nothing To Fear (Chris Rea) => Guitar not really roaring); Prodigal Son (The Petersens) => Even though this one focuses on voices, they didn’t really catch me as they do on the Italy => more dynamic); Take Me Home, Country Roads (Mountain Man) => okay, that really wasn’t bad…; Ich sah mich als Star (Charles Aznavour) => okay, hm… that was actually quite good Short pause. Then I started listening again since the last two or three songs weren’t that bad… Next piece “Air On The G String” (Kathia Buniatishvili) => just piano… WOW!!!! This totally got me. What a resonant body of the piano that suddenly became audible here. The piano became perceptible, seeming to be in the room. Not just the tones. Speaking of tones: They (the more I then heard of this album - and I heard the entire album "Labyrinth" by Buniatishvili) really had a great fullness without being obtrusive. Still light and transparent, but beautifully present. And good sounding. But again, that depth! The piece "Pari intervallo for four hands" was simply art! I heard it three times in a row. When I was through with the album, I knew that I had never heard music like this before. I've had the album in my favorites for a while, but only saved two or three favorites from it in playlists. I didn't really enjoy listening to the rest. Now I've heard the whole album and I was fascinated. What was also interesting: I could feel a dynamic here. Well, the piano and how the pieces are played also shows great dynamics in some pieces. But at least it came across. With the other songs before that, it just didn't compare to what Simply Italy offers. A friend who owns a 300B amp suggested that I should listen to music with voices quietly tonight (when listening loudly comes at the price of a divorce). So I just went with Joan Baez and simply run the playlist with her best songs via Qobuz. What can I say: simply beautiful. You can feel so much by just listening to her voice. Effortlessly and also quietly. So my kind of conclusion from the first day: I mostly listen to my Tone Poets vinyl records and the like through my speaker system. That means I need dynamics. Today I only listened to digital music. So I don't know yet if this works. But to be honest, you have to assume that the Simply Italy can play this genre/records much better because it offers the dynamics necessary to animate those songs. What now? I have to admit – whether I want it or not – the larger and less flat voices are very intriguing. So I guess I took the first sip of the 300b magic potion and I'm tipsy. Do I want (or better: can I) live without it? Well, once you've enjoyed it, it's hard to give it up voluntarily. But what to do with the jazz? Does a tube replacement bring the punch, the bass and the necessary sharpness into play? I remain skeptical. Alternative question: Is there a 300B amplifier that can do the voices just as well, but can also come up with a dynamic comparable to what I’m used from my Simply Italy? I can't say that for lack of knowledge. But I'm afraid the answer is more in the direction of "no". Maybe that's a good thing, because in the end there might just be a mishmash, an "all-weather tire" so to speak who is no longer really good at anything if one wants to mix the qualities of these two amps. At the moment the 300B seems to me to be an amplifier that can't do some things, but is exceptionally good at one or two things. Unilaterally gifted. So can it replace the Simply? No, it probably can't. Can the Simply replace the 300B. Maybe a little more than the other way around because it can just play multiple genres. But he can't do magic with voices like that (even though voices are still remarkable in a certain way). So now I'm going to do a search. Although I would like to continue listening with my Mira Ceti. He plays very, very beautifully. But then – after a while – clarify the question, whether there is a 300B that is "on the ball" in a similar way to my current 300B. Or do all 300B amps play a little more dreamily (to avoid the word "boring") – apart from vocies of course. The Simply Italy plays very involving. It captivates you with its dynamics. If necessary, it presses you into the listening chair with voices and instruments. A lot of the songs I've been listening to today have the 300B letting me get up and go to the kitchen with ease. It plays more in the background. But if you then hear "the right thing" and in the right way, it becomes very special. Not easy. Or is it?
You can try rolling tubes, but I think the attributes you mention are what the 300b is known for. Drivers make a difference too. I rolled out some Electro Harmonix 2A3s for RCAs and it was like a different amp. I would try some different tubes and see what happens
Sorry to hear. Your speakers seem to need higher power and possibly higher damping factor of the EL-34 amp. This brings to mind why I have advocated for active crossovers for decades - if you did that, you could use the 300B amp for the high frequencies where it seems to shine, and the EL-34 amp for the woofer, where it shines. Literally the best of both worlds with no compromises. Realistically going active is not an option for the vast majority of people here, and is more of a DIY thing since there aren't many ready made commercial options. But if you happen to get a wild hair, and have plenty of time.....
Thanks for your suggestions! I appreciate it! @Amperexed: Not sure about the “higher power”. I still have to find out how many watts the 300B Mira effectively has. But as mentioned, measurements in reviews of my Simply Italy showed that it effectively had about 3 Watts per channel. I have to find out if the 300b offers even less so that this might be the reason for the missing dynamics.
The two amps could have identical power but different internal impedances (damping factors), and this will directly equate to changes in frequency response and woofer control (bloated, indistinct bass).
Single ended EL-34 running UL should have 7-8 watts, so I'm not sure where they got 3 watts from? Same for 300b. jeff
@zeitlos Do you know how low the impedance dips down in your speakers, particularly in the ~100-250hz range? The load they are presenting may be causing an issue with the 300B SET.
I refer you to my post #9. If, at this time, you don't wish to invest in the type of power supply goodness that people like Border Patrol use for their 300B amps (and it is substantial), I'd recommend seeking out a well designed 2A3 amp to try. Bottlehead might suit your needs, using their parafeed designs. Alternatively a parallel SE amp might suit. Have a look at those kits offered by AN Kits in Canada (you can also have them built for you).
IMO you need a better 300b amplifier. A friend has checked the same amp you bought and reported the same problems. He now uses the same Tsakiridsis mono amplifiers as I do and has a much better sound with tighter bass and way better dynamic. I have used my Tsakiridis Achilles with Altec Lansing 604 E Superduplex, a two way design with a 15“coax and can't complain about the things you didn't like.
In many respects, what you report on the sound is somewhat common to 300b SET amps, particularly if they are not a good match. But, of course, another 300b SET could be much better—it is hard to know without hearing your setup. My wild, unsupported guess is that there is not enough transformer in that amp; that is a common issue with SET amps, and the use of a toroidal output transformer may also be an issue (few SET builders use toroidal transformers). If you can get your hands on a different set of tubes, you should try altering the sound that way. I’ve heard flabby, dynamically soft 300b amps sound much tighter and punchy with different tubes. Specifically, I much preferred a Cary 300 SEI with Western Electric 300b’s than what came with the amp.
Thank you all for your comments! I will answer your questions later, am a bit in a hurry right now. I just got these ones from my local dealer to give them a try: And he offered me to try an Air Tight 300B amp (older model). Maybe they can deliver what I am missing (even though he says they are very, very neutral. They don’t add or deduct anything)
Very surprising.. The EL34 and 300B are 2 different amps. Never the less you should be hearing something really glorious on the 300b and just looking at the picture of both amps with single tubes. per channel. The 300b has to have more power atleast 8 watts or more output, more body and syrupy sound. They are suppose to have a monster tone comparing to the EL34 (bigger and more livelier sound)... I'm just using an "OK"300b tubes but the sound of both my SET and Push-Pull 300B is much BIGGER, livelier, more 3D and more power than the EL34 SET amp I have. If you tell your seller what you hear, maybe he can help you atleast try or swap another amp.
Voices definitely are bigger and not as flat. I was fascinated yesterday and I am listening again. Joan Baez. Perfect for it, just the guitar and the voice.
The voices are suppose to be bigger and sounding more in a "pleasing way". When I bought my very first new 300b SET amp. The sound was already obvious that it has a great midrange. However, I notice that the sound of the bass was "flat" and thin all over. I have so much experience with other tube amps and my setup and I know that there was a break in period with NEW amps. Without any adjustment or tube swapping, I notice a drastic change after 3 weeks. The bass started coming out and much-much cleaner, more dynamics.. after few months it just gotten better and better. I was so happy with the amp especially I got a good matching speaker today. After a year, I bought another 300B Push-Pull 14 watts. Upon arriving, the same procedure I did. I made sure that all of the tube are in excellent working order and matched. After the first run.. Again the new amp sound "very flat" and thin. I didn't touch any adjustments nor tube roll. After a month, that's when I started hearing a huge development. and as the months gone by, the amp jus started getting better and better. I have a primaluna EL34 integrated amp. This amp is already monster in sound and has way more wattage than the 300b. But its been almost 3 years now owning the both 300b, I prefer listening to the 300b more. But in the future if I have a rock and roll party, Ill pull out the primaluna.
Good tube amps will fill the listening space and deliver a dense, weighty sound (rich harmonics), in ways not common to solid state. SET’s are very good in this respect, but so too are certain pushpull amps. The difference is more in the way of tight, punchy and deep bass—pushpull tends to be better in this respect. But, this tighter, more punchy pushpull bass can sometimes seem a bit “mechanical” (same sound all the time) while SET bass seems more varied, tuneful, and natural. To quote “Blues Brothers”: “I like both kinds of music.”
The transformers have a lot to do with bandwidth. Big iron rules. Look at some of the choices out there, a lot have puny transformers. Those can not control a woofer like something with great output transformers.
That must be transformers which (after I read in tube litterature for long) could be the most important part in tube amplifiers. I wonder why tube amps are so weighty, but that weight comes from transformers even for modest power amp. The 37kg of this 2x24W Cayin CS 845A, with 300B + 845 afraid me ...to buy/try CS-Series_Integrated Amplifier_CS-845A_Home Audio_Cayin my Jadis Orchestra is enough heavy for me with 20kg
This is where much of the parts $$$ went in my amp. Amp would be nothing without vintage CTC power transformer and Hitachi Fine Met Amorphous Output Transformers
A lot of amps will have the output transformer on the inside and it’s the side of a choke …. All of these 300b like mine use great transformers whether it is the Fine Met like mine or James or similar quality beefy transformers.
I almost bought an 845 amp back 7 years ago. when I was looking at the specs and voltage.... Forget it. I already got zapped with EL34 fixing my marshall amp. That was a lot of fun. I don't think I would survive on a broadcasting tube.
@zeitlos I would take your dealer up on the loan of that Air Tight amp it should be a much better example of a 300B amp and if it's older using excellent Tamura output transformers. I really think, as others, that it's those toroids in the Fezz amp letting the side down.
Another tempting 300B since I bought Vida Prima, I had some datasheets in the box , including PADA 300B PADA-300B English - オーディオ・音響・PCオーディオ・アナログのAurorasound（オーロラサウンド） as hybrid transistor front-end mono, but they explain why this choice
I think I have to say a few words about the FEZZ Audio Mira Ceti, lest it be cast in a light it doesn't deserve. Very important: My impressions were first impressions and of course they are also shaped by what I have been hearing for 3-4 years, namely what the Simply Italy delivers. Overall, I would not have thought that changing the amplifier could bring so many differences. They are anything but marginal. I still think the Mira Ceti is a very good amplifier, especially at the price it is asking for. It actually confirms a lot of what has been said here: It is a showman, i.e. it presents voices that really amaze you. On the other hand, I would like to put the term showman into perspective again, because if you listen quietly, it still brings incredibly beautiful sounds to your ears. Speaking of "beautiful". Yes, the tones are great. Really great. The Simply Italy, on the other hand, sounds more "sterile". Although the Simply Italy never falls below a certain level and is therefore a great all-rounder that can both convey feelings and attack. But of course, the Simply Italy cannot offer the 300B sound which really exists as described (an important finding for me). With the Mira Ceti it's a bit like this: either it's great or it's a bit boring. Of course (!) it depends very much on the recordings. What I want to try again is to switch from 8 ohms to 4 ohms. Maybe that means more dynamics come into play with certain recordings? And then there still remains the tube shown above. I will also listen to it in the next few days when I get to know the Mira Ceti with the original tubes better. But I do think that the Mira Ceti is a really good 300B amp. I still have to find out what others can do better.
By the way: Which is also very interesting. I hear the Mira Ceti 300B at around 8-9 o’clock. in terms of volume. The Simply Italy, on the other hand, requires 9-10. with the same volume. So the FEZZ Audio Mira Ceti seems to have more power.
