Any MM/High Output MC Cartridge Recommendations for Clearaudio Concept turntable?

I have a Clearaudio Concept turntable, and have been using a Shelter 201 cartridge with it. I'd been considering a Soundsmith cartridge but the the output of .06mV is not enough for the Rogue Audio Cronus Magnum's built in preamp. Rogue recommends a minimum of 1.5mV output.

Before talking to dealers of the respective lines, I thought it would be useful to get some feedback from other forum members as to their experiences with cartridges on the Clearaudio Concept, whether from owners, past owners, or those who have friends with them.

Does anyone have any experience with any of the following cartridges or any other recommendations?

Dynavector 10X5 $450 2.5mV
Dynavector 20X2 $850 2.8mV
Ortofon 2M Bronze $400 5mV
Ortofon 2M Black $700 5mV
Clearaudio Aurum Alpha Wood $400 3.6mV
Clearaudio Aurum Beta Wood $600 3.6mV
Clearaudio Aurum Beta S $750 3.6mV
Clearaudio Virtuoso $950 3.6mV
Clearaudio Maestro $1,200 3.6mV

There is a lot of owner feedback around on the Dynavector, Ortofon, and Clearaudio Virtuoso and Wood cartridges, but very little for the Clearaudio Aurum series of cartridges.

I would like to spend around $500, but am willing to spend more if it'd be worth it. The main limiting factor is that I would prefer to use the built in phonostage, and not have to spend more on an outboard unit.

I guess another question is "How much cartridge can I put in front of the Rogue's built in phonostage before I'm throwing away money?"

Any feedback would be appreciated. Thanks!

 

How about the Sumiko Blue Point Special or The Blackbird. I have had both, loved the Blackbird.

 

Clearaudio Maestro $1,200 3.6mV

That'll allow you to get the most out of that wonderful 'table.

 

Thanks, guys! All indications are pointing to the Maestro..fortunately for my ears and unfortunately for my wallet.

Nice as the Blackbird may be, if I'm going to drop $1100, I'll drop another $100 and go for the Maestro. I already know two Clearaudio dealers, whereas I'd have to look for a Sumiko dealer. And I understand the setup of the Blackbird to be a bit tricky.

Do either of you guys have any thoughts on the use of a $1200 cart with the equivalent of a $200 phonostage?

 

The Cartridge Man Music Maker III has an output of 4 mv, and is at the top end of what you're wiling to pay. Good sounding cartridge.

 

I've only heard wonderful things about those but the only distributor seems to be Audiofeil International in NY, and I would like to buy through a local dealer. Maybe down the road on another table...

 

Thank you for using the term "cartridge" and not "cart".

 

Musical Surroundings recommended a Benz Micro Ace or the Maestro for the Concept.

 

I try to be sensitive to the sensibilities of others when it's possible.

There's always one more option, isn't there? Thank you!

 

have you looked at the Graham Slee Gram Amp 2 SE?

 

Nope. I'm sticking with the onboard phonostage until I make a more significant upgrade in my analog front end.

 

I have a Clearaudio Maestro Wood in a TT-3 straight line tracking arm on an Innovation Compact Wood TT and just love it.

 

Now that would be a significant upgrade to my analog front end!

 

Wow. Is the Maestro $1200? that must be the top of the MM line, I assume? I had a Virtuoso Ebony Wood, and it was wonderful. I am a little surprised at those prices, though. I assume that you can get good discounts?

 

I was surprised, too. The Maestros had been $1000 when I last looked into them. Oh well. If it keeps me from having to look into a new phonostage, I can live with it. We'll see about discounts.

 

I may be in the minority here, but IMO the phono stage is just as important (if not more important) than the cartridge when it comes to sound quality. A $1200 cart would be a waste of money with a $200 (if that figure is correct) phono stage.

If you plan on upgrading the phono stage within the life of the cart, then it starts to make more sense. I would rather use a $1000 phono stage with a $200 cart than the other way around. Carts will come and go but a good phono stage will most likely stay with you for a long time.

 

Re: the $200 figure for the phonostage. The Atlas Magnum amp is $2000. The Cronus Magnum integrated is $2200. It's not exact, but given that there is only $200 difference and the integrated adds a linestage, phono preamp, and headphone amp, that is probably a fair ballpark number.

I don't know that you're in the minority, so much as the question hasn't been addressed in this thread. I think it's a valid point you're making. But, I have PM'd with a member whose opinion I respect and trust and he thought I'd be fine with the Maestro/Rogue combo. On another board where I asked the question, a member shared his experience of running the Maestro through his Rega Brio R with fantastic results. I've heard both and found them to be in the same ballpark, despite their differences.

But, on that other board, a fellow who owns the Rogue Metis, which has the same phonostage, advised against spending too much on a cartridge because of its limitations.

 

I just went from the Virtuoso ebony wood to the Maestro wood. The Maestro only has about 6 hours on it so I can't really assess it yet but the Virtuoso is very nice; mine will be going to Soundsmith next month to be re-tipped. Both should match well your table but I'm not sure that I'd go with the Maestro for your set up unless you plan to upgrade to an external phono stage down the road due to the extra $250 it costs.

I got 10% off from Music Direct by asking them if they could do anything. YMMV.

 

the best tracker and fastest cartrdige I have ever heard. its
a real "seat of the pants ride" terribly exciting.

 

Thanks for the heads up and addressing the phonostage question. Much appreciated. I'm on hold until I get two pairs of speakers sold, so I've got plenty of time to consider what to do, discuss it with my dealer, and potentially get a test run. We'll see.

 

Are the $300-600 Grado moving-iron cartridges out of the question? They would be good match for your preamp, and there's no crazy treble boost like some moving-coil cartridges.

 

Nothing is out of the question.

I've considered them, but all I hear about hum issues with Grados makes me wary. I've only used Grado Black before, and don't recall having that issue. I've checked the Grado Hum sticky on AK, but my TT is not listed:

http://www.audiokarma.org/forums/showthread.php?t=209233

We'll see. I'm still considering selling the Concept and buying a Rega RP6 with an Exact cartridge.

 

I haven't heard the RP6 but I have heard the RP3 with the Exact II and the new PSU. That's certainly a good option to avoid much of the hoo-ha in dealing with cartridge issues. Although some of the recommendations given in this thread suggest cartridges I think are better sounding than the Exact, you won't have any worries with turntable matching. The Exact is a very decent sounding pickup, IMHO.

 

I don't doubt that any number of the cartridges listed sound better than the Exact, but at a certain level, I don't care. I've heard the Exact on an RP3 into a Rega Brio R/RS5's and found it very satisfying. I've already got other Rega components and had planned to assemble a full Rega system, so it fits in with my overall game plan.

I was just trying to stretch my Concept ownership another year, but I think it makes more sense to sell it and use the proceeds to buy the RP6/Exact rather than upgrade the Concept's cartridge. I'll look into the $1000+ cartridges down the road, when I go further upmarket on my turntable and phonstage. But, for the immediate future, The RP6/Exact should work well with my Rogue Cronus and then with the Brio R.

Thanks Googlymoogly, and everyone else who provided input, for the helpful suggestions.

 

Sounds like a sensible plan. Rega makes it pretty easy to own low-fuss, good-sounding analog and digital sources. I'm a fan, that's for sure. There are certainly better things to do than screw around with constantly adjusting a tonearm and cartridge for that final tiny increment of performance.