Are there many reputable Chinese makers of amplifier?

I have the Jungson JA 88D that I picked up in 2005. Never any problem and sounds great.

 

I believe it. I bet that is a very nice integrated amp. I toyed with the idea of picking up a used 88D around the time I bought my Shengya but the Shengya came up in like new condition on the used market so I grabbed it.

 

Almost any thing and everything that is manufactured in Taiwan is of good to excellent quality. You never see the Chinese "junk" being manufactured in Taiwan.

 

He may work for them as an engineer/designer. The Chinese also own Volvo - I'm fairly sure there are a few Swedes working for them in... Sweden.

 

Plenty of companies use fake parts advertising the real thing - the giveaway will be the price. When the Chinese make a fake copy they charge a fake copy price - when the Americans do it they charge top dollar.

There is a brand called Spark in China that does a lot of the manufacturing for many brands including other Chinese brands - According to my dealer in Hong Kong - Line Magnetic more than a decade ago hired the engineers from Cayin. So Line Magnetic is Cayin - current Cayin is basically 10 year old+ products in new fancier looking casework.

Many Chinese brands and the western brands with their label on top of the Chinese brand often advertise original designs or inventions and top rate parts - but when you look close the parts are often fakes. They work - the case looks FABULOUS - but you are buying from people who really don't understand how sound works or are even audiophiles - they are looking to make a buck on gullible people who like to buy based on looks and a heavy case.

I bought a fake Rolex for $40 in 2009 and guess what - it still works. But it's rusting and it ain't no Rolex.

People get tied up in phrases like "European made" "American know how" "German Engineering" as if these labels will equate to something better - yeah have you read the Lemon Aid Car guide on German cars - there is not a single Mercedes or BMW that gets more than 3 stars out of 5 in that guide - many get 1 star for being overpriced piles of crap. Meanwhile plenty of 4 and 5 star cars from Japan and South Korea.

I think you just have to temper your expectations - if you are buying a $700 integrated amplifier from China advertising that it uses a bunch of caps and resistors alone that would cost $800 - then you are getting fake parts. It may still sound fine and it may not even burn your house down - but know what you are buying.

I would spend the next few hours looking through the amplifiers from China and other countries via Fikus' website - he is the owner of the high end brand Lampizator but before that he repaired and modified numerous Chinese products to turn junk into something half way decent - some Chinese brands do well on his site - some are obvious fake copies - but fake copies from Western brands too like Theta Data!

Amplifiers amplifiers vacuum tube systems hi-fi hihighend 6c33c triode SET OTL's

CD players CD_ALPHABETICAL

I'm not a big fan of buying from companies that have a track records of selling fakes. It's funny to see items claiming to use WIMA and it turns out it's not Wima - or when the Chinese copier writes Rudycon instead of Rubycon - a little dyslexia when copying the brand name I suppose. There is a tube seller here in Hong Kong that is always selling fakes - he buys cheap tubes rubs off the silk screen then stamps on Mullard or other high price tube labels so you pay the $300 for the NOS tube but are really only getting the $10 Chinese or cheap Russian tube. This is the website - been selling tubes for years and years - selling total fakes for years and years. Wi Wi Tubes- for audiophiles

Yup he even pulls apart Audio Note M-zero

 

So who designs Eastern Electric gear? Alex Young? I guess that's it.

 

That old trope? It’s old news and it was never as Chinese as you think it was.

The Americans were ripping off the Europeans, the Europeans were ripping off the Americans, and the Russians were ripping off everybody long before the rise of Chinese industrialism and Chinese consumerism. The first fabulous fakes (wristwatches, jewellery, luxury goods - Rolexes, Tiffany rings, Gucci handbags and you-name-it) were cloned in Italy in the ‘60s and ‘70s! The Indians got into the act in the ‘80s (designer clothing clones). The Japanese dabbled in cloning in the ‘60s, but their desire for innovation overcame the cloning very quickly.

Nowadays, Italian audio products are among the best in the world. The Japanese have been making their mark and maintaining their upper-echelon status (along with everything else) quite well, U.S. makers have obviously long established their pre-eminence and abilities to innovate, and a bvery the European makers have established their individuality over decades of hard work. The Chinese are just going through the exact same succession of copying, learning, discovering, designing and innovating as everybody else. Rejecting or reviling them for it is exactly the same as rejecting or reviling your own country’s history, which just isn’t necessary because this is all a natural course of events.

 

Wouldn't surprise me. I owned a Cayin amp once - looked a LOT like Primaluna.

 

And the Chinese bought Volvo from Ford. I'm sure Vincent is owned by Sintron in Germany...real Germans. Do you also believe in the Deep State? Lol!

...and as Richard has pointed out in other forums, Vincent used fake parts about 10-15 years a go....got busted by Lukasz Fikus as well. And you know what? A buddy that lives around the corner from me has had every LampizatOr DAC that came out. Lukas spends a lot of time in the states.....and he visits his clients as well. He has been to my buddy's house on two different occasions. The first time he came , we had a large gathering at my buddy's home and It was the first time I met the man and we talked about that reverse engineering site some. Doesn't make the current Vincent product bad. Just like Some years ago Krell had a batch of integrated amps catching on fire....doesnt make the current product bad either. Does the rep of the companies take a hit due to the past mistakes ? Of couse! Some may never trust them again....some do...we have that right. But in today's world, it's a global market....and excellent products as well as bad products are made all over this planet, I think its silly to single out only China when poor craftsmanship and theft happens in our little corner of heaven as well.

 

Wait, I didn't single China out for anything - half my gear is built in China. Most by Western brands, some by Chinese ones - all my headphone amps are Chinese. Buying gear made in China is pretty much unavoidable for anyone with budget considerations.

It's Vincent that's suspect to me, because I've read stuff different from what you are telling me. Also because they're sold here mostly by one retailer - AudioAdvisor, because of those paper stickers mentioned here earlier, because of "designed in Germany" I saw with my own eyes, instead of "made in Germany", and the like. And even after all that, I'm not saying Vincent gear isn't good (I've never heard one, anyway) - just saying I, personally, avoid the brand based on a few suspect factors.

I generally prefer gear by Western brands, even if built in China, and will only buy minor things that are genuinely Chinese, like those very headphone amps of mine - they are cheap enough to take the risk. Still won't buy anything major by a genuinely Chinese firm, thus avoid Line Magnetic, for example. Just like I will never buy a Chinese car. I've driven Japanese, American, and German (and Swedish) far too long to be tempted into risky experiments.

 

Looking like Western brands isn't anything new for Chinese gear. I know PrimaLuna stuff is built in China, so, if it's Cayin factory building it - it's not the worst case scenario. The quality of gear is very good.

 

I've enjoyed gear from Audio Space, though I don't own anything currently. I'd not hesitate to give their amps room in my rig.

 

Reading this, I wonder if anyone here has listened to Doge Audio? Their Prima Donna integrated looks like a hell of a deal at 1500. Their monoblocks at 3800 give off 100 watts and look like an amazing value. The designer was I think a chief designer for Jolida?

 

Ok...fair enough. But the reason why mostly sold at AUDIO Advisor, is because they are the importer in the United States and only allow a few retailers in the USA to sell the brand. AA has total control of that product. And they sell a lot of it as well.

 

Hi there! Hugh Nguyen at Angel City Audio has been the North American distributor for Melody since 2009. There are only two authorized dealers working with him - myself and Nhan Hoang of Phenomenhan AV in Texas. There is no brick & mortar presence at all, so you can only really find us at the several shows per year we go to or on forums. I won't weigh in on our products' merit vs. any other, but I wanted to make sure you knew they are still, in fact available.

 

Don't bother. Been there.

 

German or not the Vincent 236mkll is one of the best sounding integrated amps ( after some tube rolling) that I have ever heard and I will keep it till my end. Paired with Definitive Technology BP7000 speakers they sound so smooth. I rolled ecc83's from Telefunken , Mullard long plate mc1 and Amperex Bugles.

The speakers are fairly efficient, 91db at 1 watt and like I said the Vincent with the right tubes with these speakers with Proper Placement sound thousands of dollars better than they should....... John M.

 

I'm not into anything. In fact, I try to stay as far away from everything (in that context), for it makes me sick to my stomach to see the country (and the people) so divided. If I could - I'd crawl into a cave and live a hermit until it was over.

What I believe, though, is based on what I observe, not on what I'm told.

And now let's stick to audio, please. Politics I discuss elsewhere.

 

Bet!

 

I've been into this hobby from the 70's. lots of gear has come and gone. The merry go round years was really fun ....owned and heard lots of gear.....and lost lots of loot. When I decided to get off, it was about finding a core I could live with for years without breaking the bank. Vincent was something that was surprisingly great! I mean, not just good, but in head to head shoot-outs just out performed some well known and popular brand named amps. Some of my audiophile friends where also surprised at the level of performance as well, but just couldn't get over the designed in Germany by German engineers and made in China. OF course my gear was produced after the fake caps where discovered by Lukasz...and I did contact Vincent asking about that and they did reply with a reason why. Another thing I like about my Vincent preamp and amp is that its very resolving. It responds to cable changes, and tube changes, and other gear that's added down chain with ease. I've also had the SV-237 in my home and I know how great of a amp that is. So yes, you have a great one. I have no want to change gear, and if I did...it would probably be to another Vincent amp, like the SA-T7.

 

I agree that there is a difference between a Chinese company masquerading as a German company, and a German company not wishing full disclosure of its product sources. I also agree that the similarities between the components that you have linked to (and others) and the German company's offerings are so close that it raises the age old question of "the chicken and the egg". If if quacks like a duck, and walks like a duck, then it must be an American insurance company representative.

 

EDIT: I've said above that all my headphone amps are Chinese. I correct myself - three of them are. The fourth, Bottlehead Crack, is proudly made in the US as a kit, and was custom-built for me in LA. (and cost more than the other three combined, but is worth it!)

 

My history in audio is very similar, thanks,John M.

 

Check the Kinki Studio EX-M1 integrated amp, solid state 200watts per.
Yes I know, weird name but got an excellent review on 6Moons.