Beatles "Please Please Me" (The Song, Not the Album)*

Is there any official CD release of this tune that does not have the extra echo and compression tacked on (meaning of course a CD issued NOT using the LP master). I have the single CD and the EP CD. There must be one I am missing. Anyone?

 

What exactly are you talking about? Dexterized? Non-Dexterized? Mono? Stereo?

 

I'm unconvinced that there is any significant difference between the original mono single and the LP master (apart from the former being left slightly untrimmed at the end). The B-side ('Ask Me Why'), however, is different. The single uses the original mix made in November 1962, whereas the LP uses a remix (in mono and stereo) done in February 1963 at the LP mixing sessions. The original mix of AMW is not available on CD, and has less echo on the mix. 'Please Please Me' was not remixed for the mono LP, but a stereo mix (from a different take) was cobbled together for the stereo LP.

Available versions of PPM on CD are:

Mono mix - PPM (1987), CD single, CD EP, Red Album CD (1993 & 2010), PPM (2009 mono), Early Beatles (2014)

Stereo mix - Early Beatles (2006 & 2014), PPM (2009 stereo)

Mono folddown of stereo mix - Early Beatles (2006)

Demo from 11th Sept 1962 - Anthology 1

 

If I missed something in your post sorry in advance...but I assume you are aware that the vocal take on the mono version is completely different from the stereo version?? If you listen to the last verse, there is no mistake on John's part in the lyrics (in the mono version). As far as the echo mentioned in the OP, again, I'm assuming you mean as the song comes to its' end and the "whoa yea's" are, indeed, echoed..?? If this IS what you mean, that has always been of a part of the original releases of the song; it's not something that was added during the remastering.

Again, sorry if I misinterpreted anything.

 

The only CD releases of "Please Please Me" have the 1 mono and 1 stereo version. The mono track was apparently EQ'd for the album. I have a reissued vinyl single with the original single EQ. I think I can hear the difference from the LP track.
As stated by slane, the b-side sounds noticeably different.

 

I have tried, but I can't even hear the difference on "Ask Me Why". I will go back again and try to hear it tonight. I have an original first cut of that 45 too.

 

Yes, I'm well aware that the mono and stereo versions use different takes. The OP was asking about the supposedly 'drier' version of the mono mix that was on the original single (compared to the version on the mono album).

I think the belief that it was 'enhanced' for the album comes from the fact that the B-side is different. Probably some people thought 'Ask Me Why' was 'wetter' because of additional compression etc, and therefore the A-side was subjected to that too. But AMW is actually a new mix on the album, which better explains why that song has noticeably more echo.

 

Some people (well, one person on here) also thinks that Ask Me Why on the single has Pete Best on drums and is a different take than the album version.

I know, go figure.

 

Yeah, beyond belief. I guess he just never bothered to compare them!
It reminds me of that 'there's a Hammond organ on I Want to Hold Your Hand' thread that bent everyone's brain a few years back.

 

Now the tracks are out of copyright in the EU, surely there'd be nothing to stop anyone doing a good vinyl transfer of the original PPM 45, cleaning it up and releasing it, even as just a digital download. Or has it already been done? Come on - come on...

Also, on PPM:
Comprehensive Beatles: 1962, November 26: Sources: PLEASE PLEASE ME »
End of Song. UPDATE February 2, 2011. The fade is the same for all sources, but some are faded more quickly in order to avoid a clicking sound (console switch?) after the song proper. For example, the CD EP contains the entirety (about 5.35 seconds long) while the CD 45 is short one-half second (about 4.85 seconds long). This click can also be heard, at various fade volumes, on the 2009 Remaster and Introducing the Beatles.

 

But the PPM 45 is not out of copyright - that only pertains to official material released up until the end of 1962 (PPM was released January 1963).

Unreleased outtakes of the two songs are theoretically out of copyright, but none are circulating if they exist anyway.

The article you quote would seem to suggest that the only mono master of PPM was simply faded out differently on different masterings.

 

I always thought it was to do with recording rather than release date, and the tracks were recorded 26 November 1962. I think that's the basis public domain companies operate on.

Open Music Archive - FAQ »

I imagine Universal wouldn't care if you tested that with any other artist, but they'd get shirty if you did it with the Beatles.

Shame they missed this one...

 

Release date for officially released tracks, recording date for unreleased tracks.

 

Have all Beatles threads arrived at this "WTF"/"WhyTF"/"Huh?" juncture on this forum?

 

I never knew there was that difference. It does look like there are a few PD downloads of PPM but maybe that's a different take.

 

There shouldn't be any PD issues of a studio PPM - the master (or masters, the mono and stereo are different takes) was released in 1963, the earlier demo was released in 1995. No other takes have surfaced.

Anything before 1963 is PD, released or unreleased. The law was then amended. From 1963 onwards, released tracks stay in copyright for 70 years after release, unreleased tracks go out of copyright 50 years after they were recorded.

 

I'm not sure major record companies are actually that bothered about checking though, since you can easily buy those tracks. I've worked for several PD companies, and have always been lead to believe they referred to the recording date.

 

No, released recordings are now covered for 70 years after release date (and only become PD at the end of that year - i.e. the mono and stereo master takes of PPM will go out of copyright after 31st December 2033). Unreleased recordings are still only covered for 50 years from the recording date, however.

 

To back up slightly, the prevailing theory had been that the 45 mix had been dubbed again with added echo:

However, that's not the case. I just did a sync-up of the 45 mix and the mono LP mix, and while the *level* of echo differs, there isn't any *additional* echo on the LP. It's the same echo as the 45, just louder. Here's a clip:

Ask Me Why mono sync

That's the first 25 seconds of the song. 45 mix left, mono LP mix right. The levels have been adjusted so the echo is at approximately the same volume. Note there's no additional echo on the LP mix (right channel).

As far as the how/why goes, let's look at how the song was recorded and mixed:

26 November, 1962
Please Please Me and Ask Me Why are recorded to twin-track and (delta) mono simultaneously.

30 November, 1962
Please Please Me is remixed to mono from twin-track.

25 February, 1963
Stereo and (delta) mono mixes are made simultaneously from the twin-track session tapes for most of the Please Please Me album, including Ask Me Why.

Unfortunately, the 26/11/62 session tape no longer exists, but some tapes from early 1963 do exist and have been bootlegged. We know that in those cases, the echo was printed live on the session tapes; it wasn't added during mixing. It seems safe to assume the same was true for Please Please Me/Ask Me Why.

What does all of this mean? Well, it seems reasonably safe to say that the 45 comes from the live delta mono recording/mix done on 26/11/62, while the LP comes from the delta mono mix of the twin-track on 25/2/63. The difference in echo level is due to both a difference in levels between the live delta mono mix and the twin-track, and the fact that since the echo is in both channels of the twin-track, it builds up slightly when (re)mixed to mono. This also explains why John Barrett doesn't note a mono mix of Ask Me Why on 30/11/62; a separate mono mix was never performed. Thus:

45 mix: live delta mono recording/mix from 26/11/62
LP mix: twin-track recording from 26/11/62 -> delta mono mix from 25/2/63

This is similar to From Me To You, where the mono mix also came from the delta mono recording; doing a mono mix from the twin-track results in the (centered) overdubs being too loud.

 

Wouldn't the "delta" mono only be the "live" mono and the mono mix made from the twin track not be called "delta"?

 

They both utilized the delta mono facility on the REDD desk. The former live during the recording and the latter during simultaneous mono and stereo mixing from the twin track.

 

I have the original Vee Jay single of PPM (mono) and it seems to be a different mix from the mono mix on the Mono Masters. I heard they really had 2 mono mixes - one with echo and one without. Is the mix on the Mono Masters the mix with the echo or without? Are both mono mixes available on CD?

 

Ask Me Why was mixed live to mono and then to mono from twin track later. PPM was only mixed live to mono, however.