Bob Dylan's Basement Tapes - Where We're Currrently At (Part 7)

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by Mark, Nov 18, 2014.

  1. Train

    Train Active Member

    I mostly agree with your list -- "Open the Door Homer" is the only superior first take, although I am squarely in the "Tears of Rage" 3rd-take camp. The others you name that I would never get rid of are "The Auld Triangle", "Goin' Down the Road", the first take of "Ain't No More Cane" (to me the two takes form an inseparable whole), and, maybe above all, the noisy one-minute scrap of "900 Miles", which I think is one of the greatest things on the entire set.

    The more I listen to the stuff we've never had on boots before, the track that is running deepest for me is "Down by the Station". Unfortunately, it's also the one with the very worst sound, but what a beautiful haunting melody!
     
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  2. lou

    lou Fast 'n Bulbous

    Location:
    Louisiana
    That US flag backdrop was from the Paris Olympia concert - I don't believe it was used in the UK. It did not get a good reception in Paris.
     
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  3. revolution_vanderbilt

    revolution_vanderbilt Forum Resident

    Location:
    New York
    that sounds like such a rough existence. I wouldn't wish that on anyone. At that point, how can you ever finish a song, ever perfect it, ever manage to actually work on it and make an album? I think a lot can be said for the folks around Dylan for reigning him in so that true brilliance could be displayed. Even his failed sessions at the end of '65 left in their wake a few titles that he would not return too. I bet it was some relief when the songs stopped flowing out, or when he learned to stop it. At first, it might seem like an awful curse for a writer to lose the inspiration, but seeing how he was, it seems more like a cure for his ailment.
    Compare that to the Bob Dylan of today, who probably writes little more than what he releases, and who produces his own albums. He has a healthy balance, that I think can be traced back to 1968 or so, I believe when he practically stopped writing.
     
  4. RayS

    RayS A Little Bit Older and a Little Bit Slower

    Location:
    Out of My Element
    This observation is part of the reason why I like "Nothing To It" from the "Lost on the River" album so much. I think it is the most autobiographical song from the entirety of the Basement period. Dylan left songs as great as "She's Your Lover Now" sitting at the diner table while he walked off to the parking lot without a second look. Only a man who "knew (he) was young enough" and "knew there was nothing to it" could act in a such a manner. He was ultra-confident that another great song would be waiting on his doorstep the next morning.
     
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  5. Thelonious_Cube

    Thelonious_Cube Epistrophe of Light

    Location:
    Oakland, CA
    Great response to Griffin's essay - I, too, found the "elves & fairies" bit to be a bizarre characterization of the music from that period. It seems clear to me that Griffin has his own agenda (and, yes, there does seem to be a crypto-conservative side to that)

    And what, for god's sake, is wrong with (or 'psychedelic') about using a string quartet? (Is that a jab at The Beatles?)

    The line I quoted above is a particularly pithy summation of the situation. Extremely well said, sir.

    I recall an interview with some guitar player years ago (Clapton? Gilmour? Garcia?) who said something like, "I don't listen to my peers for inspiration, if I need inspiration I go back to the guys we all learned from like B.B King or (insert guitar player here)" and I think this is likely true of Dylan in 1967, too - why would he even care about "Incense & Peppermints"?
     
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  6. DeeThomaz

    DeeThomaz Senior Member

    Location:
    In The Felony Room
    That said, the existence of a Dylan cover of "Incense & Peppermints" would explode the internet. Particularly if there wasn't a circulating tape.
     
  7. RayS

    RayS A Little Bit Older and a Little Bit Slower

    Location:
    Out of My Element
    You mean EVERYONE doesn't have that tape?
     
  8. Wright

    Wright Forum Resident

    Thanks! Good point on the string quartet bit - that's absurd too. I mean, hadn't strings been a prominent feature of pop and country music since at least the early 1950s?
     
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  9. Wright

    Wright Forum Resident

    Ok, so I think Griffin must have had a short deadline for the essay - that's the only thing that can account for its awkwardness. I mean, consider also the following passage, unrelated to my previous rant:

    "...for most of the year, it was out with the new, and in with the old as they focused their thinking and playing on a warmer, gentler era. The roadhouse warriors dialed back the volume on their amplifiers, knowing the summer of '67 was certainly not all Peace & Love, for it was also the "long hot summer" where a whopping 159 race riots burst into flames across the United States with particularly tragic disturbances in Newark and Detroit."

    First of all, how do we know that Dylan and the Band were aware of the race riots? There's certainly nothing in the material that suggests this. Second, what Griffin writes is basically unflattering to Dylan and the Band: they knew about the race riots, but they chose to withdraw themselves from the world, rather than to help mend its problems. Put differently, they consciously buried themselves in a warm and cozy past, so as to not have to confront the tumultuous present. But surely Griffin cannot be taking a dig a Dylan here, so what is his point? Why mention the race riots at all?

    Oh, and regardless of what point Griffin is trying to make, Dylan's own commitment to social justice and contribution to the civil rights movement is of course unassailable... which makes the passage all the more puzzling.
     
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  10. cc--

    cc-- Forum Resident

    Location:
    brooklyn
    I haven't even opened the "book" yet, and now am not sure when I will -- this thread is a fine proxy :thumbsup:.
     
  11. Moth

    Moth fluttering by

    Location:
    UCI
    I've always wanted to hear an actual gospel version of "I Shall Be Released", but could never find one.
    That is, until I remembered about the 1969 record Dylan's Gospel.

    This is a really great rendition of it, and it's remarkable how the whole thing sounds so natural in this setting. This song sounds like it's 1,000 years old.
     
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  12. My theory is that Bob was goin' to Acapulco to see SOCCER.
     
  13. Dflow

    Dflow Listening in the time of Dylan

    Sounds like it would be "fun" to me
     
  14. Cozzie

    Cozzie Forum Resident

    Location:
    Australia
    I have been reading this thread daily for months and I must thank you all for providing such an informative and entertaining discussion. I would have liked to join in prior but work commitments have prevented it.

    I bought the box on release day and have been slowly working my way through it, spending 4-5 days on each disc. Overall, I am absolutely delighted with it. I would have loved the track-by-track liner notes to have actually been included in the box, and the omission of some 'Basement scraps' that we're familiar with is frustrating, but they're pretty much my only gripes.

    Over the past couple of days, I've been working on creating a double album compilation of Basement Tapes highlights. I have chosen to omit all of the songs from the 1975 album and also a couple of the other really well-known tracks from the sessions (Quinn, I Shall Be Released). I also limited it to roughly one hundred minutes total running order, so that I can consume everything in one sitting.

    Basement Tapes Highlights (Disc One)
    1. Edge of the Ocean
    2. Mr. Blue
    3. That's the Breaks
    4. I'm Guilty of Loving You
    5. Ol' Roisin the Beau
    6. Big River (Take Two)
    7. Johnny Todd
    8. She's On My Mind Again
    9. I'm Your Teenage Prayer
    10. Rock, Salt and Nails
    11. Song For Canada
    12. Four Strong Winds
    13. A Fool Such As I
    14. People Get Ready
    15. I Don't Hurt Anymore
    16. Joshua Gone Barbados
    17. I'm a Fool For You (Take Two)

    Basement Tapes Highlights (Disc Two)
    1. One Man's Loss
    2. Baby Won't You Be My Baby
    3. Down on Me
    4. I'm Alright
    5. I'm Not There
    6. Sign on the Cross
    7. A Satisfied Mind
    8. Ain't No More Cane (Take One) (Yeah, I know, this one is on the '75 release, but it's totally different with Dylan's vocals)
    9. 900 Miles From My Home (the first version)
    10. Santa-Fe
    11. Dress It Up, Better Have It All
    12. Mary Lou, I Love You Too
    13. It's the Flight of the Bumblebee
    14. Wild Wolf
    15. Confidential (the second version)
    16. If I Were a Carpenter
    17. All You Have to Do Is Dream (Take Two)
     
    Last edited: Nov 28, 2014
  15. Feat21

    Feat21 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Boston, MA, USA
    I think you're right. "Dress It Up" has Levon on drums, and "900 Miles" v2 likely does too. You can hear the light Levon brushes style that he seemed to use right when he returned, perhaps to drumming after a long absence.

    LEVON HELM TRACKS

    01. Nothing Was Delivered (take 3)
    02. Ain't No More Cane (take 2) ????
    03. Blowin' In The Wind
    04. If I Were A Carpenter
    05. It Ain't Me, Babe
    06. Mary Lou, I Love You Too
    07. Minstrel Boy
    08. My Woman She's A Leavin'
    09. One Too Many Mornings
    10. A Satisfied Mind
    11. What's It Gonna Be When It Comes Up
    12. Wild Wolf
    13. Wildwood Flower
    14. One Kind Favor
    15. She'll Be Coming 'Round The Mountain
    16. It's The Flight Of The Bumblebee
    17. Silent Weekend
    18. All You Have To Do Is Dream (take 1)
    19. All You Have To Do Is Dream (take 2)

    + Dress It Up, Better Have It All
    + 900 Miles From My Home
     
  16. fangedesire

    fangedesire Well-Known Member

    If you've seen his book Million Dollar Bash, you know awkward writing, puzzling conclusions & silly statements are just part of Griffin's style - the essay's a pretty fair sample. I wouldn't try reading too closely into anything he says, since probably not much thought went into it.

    That said, Dylan did comment in his recent interview that he was aware of the race riots, and even wrote 'Too Much of Nothing' in response.... Probably pulling our legs, but still, he evidently did keep up with the news at least (he also mentioned a couple other incidents in '67 that struck him). It's not like he was a hermit utterly cut off from the world.
     
  17. fangedesire

    fangedesire Well-Known Member

    A classic instance, not just of Dylan's sometimes cavalier attitude toward his own songs, but also of his frequent impatience in the studio. 'Oops, we messed up the last verse. Oh well, forget that one. I'll just write a new song.'
    On the other hand, there were some songs he worked on quite a while in the studio ('Visions of Johanna' for instance), so he didn't always give up & abandon promising songs. And he was often willing to do more takes in the studio than his one-take-only reputation suggests.
     
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  18. fangedesire

    fangedesire Well-Known Member

    That was Garcia, though Clapton's had similar sentiments. And you're right, it's no doubt true of Dylan too. Though he's been known to do some "contemporary" covers - like on the Basement Tapes: 'People Get Ready,' 'The French Girl,' 'Baby Ain't That Fine,' 'If I Were A Carpenter,' were all less than two years old. So he did care about some new songs, just not necessarily what was on the pop charts...
     
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  19. HominyRhodes

    HominyRhodes Forum Resident

    Location:
    Chicago


    I would add at least one track to your list: Gonna Get You Now sounds like Levon to me (although its supposed companion track, Goin' To Acapulco, seems to feature only a light snare and high-hat, making it difficult to tell exactly who's at the drums.)

    And as for Nothing Was Delivered (Take 3) -- this incomplete, :33 second take was, I believe, recorded between the first and second takes of Odds and Ends, which were both done before Levon arrived on the scene, IIRC. I think that it was a quick take to adjust the recording level of the drums, which were being played by Richard Manuel during that session. The fact that Take 3 of NWD appeared on the Safety Tape just before Take 2 of Odds and Ends, and was sandwiched between the two takes of that same song on the Robertson-Fraboni reels in 1975 leads me to believe that's where it resided on the reels, even though it wasn't listed on the tape box for Reel #13.
     
  20. Wright

    Wright Forum Resident

    Thanks - I just saw that interview, actually. Yeah, from what he says there, it seems like they were directly responding to what was going on in the world, which would then contradict what is said in the essay. But like you say, Dylan isn't always the most reliable person...

    Here's the relevant part, of interest to others perhaps:

    "When China first exploded that hydrogen bomb, it just flashed across the headlines in newspapers, so, you know, we just go in and write 'Tears Of Rage.' Things were just happening, there was riots in the street, they were rioting in Rochester in New York, it wasn't that far away, so we write 'Too Much Of Nothing.' And just one thing lead to another, you know. The human heart, the first time that anybody every heard of a human heart being transplanted, that was incredible. It was a real breakthrough, so we came up with a song, and then after we got the lyrics down, we took the song to the basement."

     
  21. fangedesire

    fangedesire Well-Known Member

    I see it differently... Aside from the staying-up-on-speed-for-days aspect (which characterized that whole '66 tour), I think he was writing songs for fun, not out of some compulsion. Staying in his room coming up with new melodies with Robertson was probably a lot more relaxing than dealing with interviewers & random nutcases on the road. And since much of Blonde on Blonde was apparently also speed-written on the spot during the album sessions, you can't say the results suffer. I don't think anybody "reined in" Dylan - he did have enough discipline to pick out the songs he wanted on an album and finish them, sometimes after quite a lot of studio time. And apparently nobody else had any say in what he recorded, other than the musicians coming up with arrangements.
    What's lacking in a lot of the Basement Tapes is the discipline to finish, because he doesn't have to - he's not recording an album, not even intending to, and when he does decide to do some publishing demos, many of those songs are still pretty near throwaways that probably took just a few minutes to write. Otherwise, a lot of his ideas were probably things like we see on disc 6 of the set, or some of the '65 studio outtakes - a riff, a few lyrics, some ad-libbing, and that's as far as he gets before losing interest. But I don't hear this as an unhealthy ailment, just someone on a creative streak. Many writers go through a similar process. If he had the same habit of writing lots of fast half-finished songs in the comfort of the basement as he did in touring hotel rooms, was that really the sign of a rough existence, a mind out of control and possessed by an unrelenting muse? When he did decide to record a "real" album, the songs on John Wesley Harding are clearly a lot more thought-out, worked-on, and complete than many of the basement tryouts. That wasn't due to anyone around him, just his own sense of purpose.

    It's true he did just about stop writing songs in 1968, as far as we know. (At least, the tapes stopped rolling.) A mysterious development, and there were probably a variety of reasons...
     
  22. fangedesire

    fangedesire Well-Known Member

    Yeah, right! How one led to the other, only Dylan could invent. But I'm sure some Dylanologist in future years will be writing a dissertation on how the daughter in 'Tears of Rage' is really an allegory for the hydrogen bomb!
    Now if he'd said 'This Wheel's On Fire,' there I could see a connection...
     
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  23. Thelonious_Cube

    Thelonious_Cube Epistrophe of Light

    Location:
    Oakland, CA
    Well, you might be right. I have no difficulty believing that he's remembering real events but pulling song titles more-or-less at random.

    I still want to know which song is the heart-transplant song....I Can't Come In On A Broken Heart? Jelly Bean?
     
  24. Bemagnus

    Bemagnus Music is fun

    I am not a dylanogist, the quest here to bring order and understanding of the Basement tapes impresses me and also gives me more insight in these amazing recordings.
    However I am-since more than 40 years a great admirer of Dylan. Have all his official albums and more. The Basement tapes have been in my head in some incarnation or another since 1970 when I first heard the bootleg.Imo no presentation of the Basement tapes so far comes close to the new boxed set.
    Imo Dylans way of writing and delivering songs during this period are something unique -both in his and any others legacacy. Guess one part is that the recordings-with some exeptions-never was meant to be released.The uniqye part is that many of the songs seems ancient but also modern or even postmodern . I clearly remember that many of those songs for me seemed familiar even the first time I heard them. Don t think there are much rational planning or explanation behind all this, Just streams of consiousnesss passing through Dylans rather unique mind. This combined with the musical talent of the-soon to be-the Band, the comraderie, freewheelin , comraderie and assorted subatances.
    Dylan wouldn t be Dylan if he didn t add to the confusion when he in interwiews dismissed the tapes as some demos never meant for release and that he doesn t understand the importance of these tapes. You s bet he does.
    So I guess I will-for the rest of my life-treasure those recordings as some of Dylans best-but also weirdest.
    A handful of young talented men having a musical ball without much pressure. Could that be all?
     
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  25. slane

    slane Forum Resident

    Location:
    Merrie England
    My guess:

    I'm presuming that 'Acapulco' and 'Gonna Get You Now' are from the same session (it sounds that way).

    The former has no piano, so I'd say Richard is on drums there.
    Whereas the latter has no electric guitar, so I'd say Robbie is on drums.

    I agree that take 3 of NWD has Richard on drums, not Levon.
     

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