Cheap phono stages—how good are they?*

It does when I click on it.Another Super High End Phono Stage! No expense spared...

 

thus one works but they are talking about building some kind of a kit.

 

thanks Gramps Tom , i'll take a look at it.

 

thanks RONENRAY , i'll take a look at it.

 

Hagerman is great. Nothing fancy, but the design can not be beat.

 

First link shows PCB ready to go.

 

Maybe you could pay someone a nominal fee to build one for you? Just a suggestion. It should certainly be less expensive than most of the options mentioned here.

 

Don't see the Emotiva XPS-1 mentioned here. It's $199 now but still a great value. Adjustable loading for MC, 40/60db of gain and a beautifully made little black brick! I've enjoyed mine immensely. Product that ships is the Generation 2 model FYI.
XPS-1

 

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I'll put one together for the person interested. Have the pieces drop shipped here ay my place.

 

FWIW, if i only had $150 to spend on a pre, the Mani is a no brainer. I tried it out and put it up against much more expensive amps, and it held its own exceptionally. While you don’t get the air and detail of a pricier amp, for what it is it is awesome. I did have some RFI noise, so I am assuming it was fixed with the new iteration. RFI noise drives me nuts, and it was why I didn’t hang onto it.

I used it with an SS MIMC star and a Denon DL-103R LOMC carts, no issues to my ears

 

This guy reviews lots of cheap phono amps and cartridges. Differences are not huge...can you hear a difference. I think his favorite is the Mani
Audiorpheus

 

It's all relative. All the components of a system should ideally be at the same level.

 

My new Schiit Mani sounds more enjoyable than my older NAD phono preamp. The NAD sounded too bright with rock recordings. Ordered my Mani through Amazon with their 30 day return policy and so far I am very happy with its neutral warm sound. It is a keeper with my limited budget.

 

The cheapest phono stage I'd ever consider buying for a LOMC cart is a Tom Evans Microgroove Plus Mk II. I saw a used one sold recently on Audiogon for $500. Anything else below this price simply is barely functional IMO.

 

I just tried to hack my Cambridge Audio CP2's MC input from 100 ohms to 470 ohms and discovered that it is already is 470 ohms. Seems they published the spec wrong, unless I'm missing something. There is a 470 ohm fixed resistor in hard wired (via printed circuit board) across each of the MC inputs.

 

Since I originally posted in this thread, I have had a chance to try a couple of the phono stages mentioned here: the Schiit Mani (current version) and the DIY CNC Phono Stage. I have also compared them to a much more expensive phono stage: the Parasound JC3 Jr. I've posted comments about my experiences in a few different threads, but thought I'd collect them here, in one spot, as this thread seems to get periodically bumped, as it's a popular topic.

General Comments:

One thing I've had time to do during recent months is try a few stand alone phono stages for the first time. First up was the DIY CNC Phono Stage that's popular over on the AudioKarma forums. As with most DIY ventures, this one performs well above pre-assembled units of comparable cost. For anyone on a modest budget, with basic DIY skills, this is a great option for a really good sounding phono stage. It has loading options that are set via DIP switches and you can customize it with low noise resistors and boutique caps in the signal path. Depending on the enclosure chosen, you can build one of these for less than the cost of the Schiit Mani. Even my customized "deluxe" version was only about $150.

Next up, was the Schiit Mani. Overall, the CNC beats the Mani. The CNC has far less noise, is more detailed and has a flatter frequency response than the Mani. Yes, I have the current Mani that has the RFI fix. The noise I'm hearing is not RFI, it's hiss. It's not unbearable. In fact, it's very similar to the hiss from the internal phono stage in my 35-year old vintage Yamaha A-1000 integrated amplifier. In that case, I think the hiss can be reduced by recapping the Yamaha (both the power supply and the phono stage). For the Mani, I think the hiss is what it is, and is the result of an inexpensive product. Again, it's not awful, just noticeably worse than the CNC. Regarding the frequency response of the Mani. Yes, it does have a bit of a smiley face EQ curve to it (slight boost to the lower and upper frequencies). So, that could be a problem in some systems, but it can also benefit others. For example, many vintage JBL speakers have a very forward sounding midrange (for this reason many have built-in L-pads for dialing back the midrange), and many vintage Shure carts have rolled off highs. So, using a Mani in a vintage system can counteract these issues and result in a very pleasing end result. Also, the Mani isn't quite as detailed as the other two phono stages I have been testing, which means it also tends to mask surface noise on used, thrift store vinyl. All-in-all, for $129, it's a pretty good phono stage, if you understand it's limitations and keep your expectations realistic.

The third phono stage I've been using is a Parasound JC3 Jr. Obviously, this is a MUCH more expensive option. I got a very good deal on a slightly used sample, but even at that price, it was considerably more than the cost of the CNC and Mani combined. New, it's 5x the cost of the other two combined. But, it is worth it. For me, the JC3 Jr is a game changer and likely an end game phono stage. I'm sure there are even better sound stages available, but not in my price range. It is dead quiet and honestly the single biggest improvement I've ever made in my system. Sure, other carts and speakers made a bigger difference in way my system sounds, but sounding different isn't the same as sounding better. With the JC3 Jr, everything sounds flat out better - every MM/MI cartridge I've tried and all my albums sound better when played through the JC3 Jr. To me, that makes it worth the price I paid.

Summary:

The Mani is a decent performer in the budget price category, but if you're willing to spend 3 - 4x more, or build your own (for comparable cost), you can do significantly better. If you have DIY skills, the DIY CNC Phono Stage offers great performance at a very modest cost. I think the best praise I can give the CNC is it's performance is closer to the JC3 Jr. than the Mani is to the CNC. That doesn't mean it's as good as the JC3 Jr. It's not, but its still a very nice sounding phono stage at a bargain basement price. I think you'd need to spend a lot more on a pre-assembled unit to match the CNC's performance.

On Building the CNC Phono Stage:

A couple sources: the Muffsy kit that is being promoted by PS Audio comes unassembled. You'll need the main PCB kit, plus the power supply kit and back panel from the Muffsy store and an enclosure and wall wart. It will run you around $200 + shipping for all the bits and pieces. Nothing comes soldered, just the PCBs and a bag of parts, but the advantage is it all fits in a small, inexpensive enclosure and the back panel is pre-drilled and labeled. So, you need soldering skills, but mechanical assembly is easy. The main PCB is pretty tightly packed. So, customization is difficult.

The other source is user sachu88 over on AudioKarma. He sells both blank PCBs or assembled and soldered PCBs (at a VERY reasonable price). His PCBs are easily modified, but don't directly fit any off-the-shelf enclosure I am aware of. This is the route I went, as I am comfortable with both soldering and mechanical assembly and wanted to customize mine. Plus it was the cheapest route and I'm a notorious cheapskate. Here's the ridiculously long thread on this phono stage on AudioKarma. I recommend you start on the last page of the thread and work your way backwards for the most current info. I also recommend you contact sachu88 via private message through the AudioKarma forum if you have any questions and want to order bare, or assembled PCBs. He is very responsive and helpful.

 

How good are cheap phono stages? Not very good. At all.

If you're on a budget there is no reason whatsoever to not go used.

 

Did you measure the input? Looking at a picture online, I'm guessing the resistor shown below in about the middle marked R77 is one of the MC input resistors, and can't say for sure, but it could be brown-black-brown for 100 ohms ...

 

A used McCormack Micro Phono Drive would be at a pretty good price for what it does. And you could upgrade it if you felt like it.

 

Agreed on buying used. The problem is supply and demand. I spend quite a while looking for several different used phono stages before I finally found the Parasound JC3 Jr. I got a great deal, but still not what the OP of this thread would consider a cheap (or budget) phono stage. In the interim, I built the CNC. Glad I did as I now run it with my secondary table. So, I'd add DIY to your suggestion of buying used for anyone looking to get the best price/performance in a phono stage.

 

If those specs are to be believed (and the company has a great reputation), that is the one to beat.

 

You usually get what you pay for.

 

The description sounds very similar to the CNC Phono stage design - two gain stages with passive RIAA equalization and a 15V AC wall wart driving an onboard linear regulated supply. It doesn't specifically mention the use of opamps for the gain stages, but in that form factor and price, it pretty much has to be. Still, a potentially attractive option for those not comfortable with DIY. You get one ready-built in an attractive case.

 

I was talking to the rather good S/N #'s and generous headroom. Do you know whether anyone has measured the CNC Phono design and published specs?

 

I recall that one of the designers on AudioKarma did some measurements and posted the results, but they were so good his test methodology was challenged. I believe he redid the measurements with input form the forum and still got outstanding numbers, but not as good as his original measurements. I'll see if I can dig up the details and post a link.

If you're impatient, try contacting member sachu88 over on AudioKarma. He's very knowledgeable about the CNC and extremely helpful.