If you still have the Oppo 205 try running the Audiolab transport through the DAC. I still don't think it sounds entirely like analog (actually any way like really good analog) using the CXC this way. That would be my benchmark against the ladder Dacs. BTW the next level of Denafrips gives you HDMI input so this could work for SACD with Oppo as transport.
I am kinda new with DACs and I’m looking for an external DAC for my Bluesound Node 2i. How does the A2 compare to the Mytek Liberty? I will mostly stream with Qobuz. Thanks
thanks CR! I thought of that, and I do have the 205, but it looks ugly in the rack with the other stereo gear. Plus, I truly am intrigued with this old technology updated with state of the art implementation. My main library is 44.1 cds, and I’ve gone through so many sigma delta Dac’s that with the 205, I’ve hit the pinnacle in my price range. And since I’m mainly doing only 44.1 I really don’t need anything DSD with the r2r ladder deck. beave
MMM.... Don't find the 205 ugly. Rather smooth understated styling but some of my other components are even larger. Understand if you don't have SACDs.
Into my 6th day now and I am sitting here, eyes closed, big wide grin on my stupid face! I still have the Bel Canto connected as well, but switching back now every once in a while, listening to that Bel Canto almost becomes unbearable, harsh sounding (especially at higher volume) with an enveloping soundstage collapsing (well at least the big, layered center part collapses at the flick of my switch). Never thought I would say this about the Bel Canto actually. And no it's not tame, well recorded accoustic chamber music I am listening to but some really exciting, well recorded, electric blues....and electronic 80's music....and...well the list just goes on . I just have the feeling that it will be MONTHS before I will be spinning some vinyl again. Oh, not very important but I also love the looks with the small and subtle red lights, resembling the 80's look, and almost unnoticed until looked at directly in front of the unit... instead of the blaring and blinding bright leds most seem to carry these days.
Since the Denafrips with the hdmi came out, I've been under the impression the Oppo won't work as a transport with it. I think the Denafrips hdmi input is an I2S input which is not what the Oppo outputs though its hdmi output. I'd love to know I'm wrong about that, though.
Lol! Ugly in the way it doesn’t blend with my other stereo components. by itself it’s a very nice looking unit, but I’m picky with my stereo gear. Beave
they only have one retailer on line to keep grey market units in Check. https://www.vinshineaudio.com/product-page/denafrips-ares-r2r-dac they only also show prices in Singapore dollars, so right now it shows the price at $1028, but in US dollars it comes to $756. And free shipping. And I really haven’t seen anybody getting a defective unit and having to send it back. plus I figure that a comparable U.K. built unit would go for $2500 - $3500. So all things being equal a really good deal. Who would have thought that the Chinese would hatch a real audiophile culture? But it seems to have happened, and their putting out products that the mainstream companies aren’t, hows that for ironic? I would have thought that at the very least Emotiva would be all over a product like this, but they seem to be stuck in home theatre, which has been dying out. Very cool. Beave
I am really interested with the Ares. Is it gonna be an improvement using it with the Bluesound Node 2i streaming only Qobuz?
I don't have any experience with Bluesound, the Node 2i uses a Burr Brown chip apparently. I noticed that you have a nice analog setup. Do you feel that something is missing from your digital listening compared to your vinyl setup? If the answer is yes, maybe you could try an R2R dac one day. You will also find lots of online reviews of the Ares that may help you make a decision.
Never, I think he’s already answered that question by showing interest in the R2R. It’s funny how this hobby is never ending, I thought that when I broke in the OPPO 205 and fell in love with the analog sound of that 9038 chip that I was done. Boy was I wrong! And then reading your experience with the Ares you hit some nerves with me. You description of that depth and 3D like affect hit it. It’s what’s been missing except for the 205. I really wished the Arcam I had was a better designed deck cause it has that chip in there and it sounded just like the 205, but this R2R resurrection has me intrigued and if I get even a little of the sound you describe then I’ll be a very happy man. A friend of mine had a discussion last year about dac’s and the conclusions we came to in agreement was that to a certain extent, dac’s are the digital equivalent to phono cartridges, and for the longest time, because of the money we’ve made most of our life, we always hung around the lower, mid fi arena. Now in our later years we’re able to kick it up a notch and just as dac tech has finally caught up with our wallets, I’m able to finally compare gear sound I couldn’t have even 10 years ago, and also the Chinese getting into the game with quite a few quality products also makes this possible. Without them there is no way an OPPO would have existed. So I look forward to getting the Ares and burning that sucker in and seeing what I end up with. Thanks for starting this thread! I’m having a lot of fun. Beave
The DAC in the Oppo 205 is still one of the best measuring DACs you can buy at any price (114dB SINAD). It meets or exceeds the performance of expensive stand alone units from Chord, Exasound, Auralic, Linn, and Benchmark. On the test bench it has recently been beat by newer DACs from Sabaj, Okto Research, and Matrix Audio. If Oppo was still in business they would likely be beating or matching those newer designs from other companies. What they wouldn't be doing is messing around with regressive, out of date, poor performing technology like R2R.
Well, here's to hoping you will like it ! At the moment I am thinking the same thing of the Ares, being an endgame dac for me, but you know how it goes ... Some time ago, I read a post by @Ham Sandwich where he described a typical Sabre dac behaviour , with the soundstage being a balloon (listening through headphones) Sabre dacs would push the instruments on the outer limits of this balloon, leaving the inside empty. I didn't really understand it at the time,but I guess this is what I am hearing now, only with speakers! I am just wondering if this kind of soundstage reproduction isn't typical of a lot of delta sigma dacs, and not only Sabre dacs? When I switch to the Bel Canto, the center soundstage just gets pushed to the back of the wall (more obvious on albums with good soundstage like JW 'blue raincoat') squashing the instruments together. The Ares instead is filling op that empty center space!
See and here is where Patient_ot has a different view of what the technology should be, and it’s good to have multiple opinions on this or there would be no conversation at all, and that would be boring. The Sabre chip that’s in the OPPO 205 sounds beautiful, unlike even their 9018 chip which you think would be close, but there is something extra, something organic sounding that the 9038 chip has. Btw Patient_ot, I looked up that Okto dac and it looks killer, the 2 channel version, but one of the chip modules they were using is no longer available so it’s not being produced now, bummer because it measures better than the OPPO 205 and that’s saying something! But back to our discussion on this r2r dac. Looking forward to receiving it. How long did you burn it in for? Is 48 hours good? Beave
So this happened, earlier this morning when I was just browsing audiogon. I happened to stumble upon a Denafrips Pontus and got a really good deal. 40% off retail. I was just curious what improvements I can do for my Node 2i since I started subscribing to Qobuz which I do like when I just want to stream and don't want to flip records. At the same listening to what I don't have and finding new music. I am happy that I got a deal with the Pontus as I see the specs that it has a reclock which the Ares doesn't have and the LPS is enclosed too.
Their site states that every unit has had a 100hr burn in, if that's true I don't know if it really needs any further burn in. I should say I am pretty sceptical on burn in. I have let it play for a few hours only after making comparisons (which were allready pretty obvious to me). After 2 days, I switched it into standby for one night, and since then it has been on permanently. Other users on other fora claim that they hear differences after about 100-150hrs ... but I don't know if this factory burn-in is something recent or not.
Oh, I was unaware that THEY burn them in at the factory, very smart on their part! Good to know. That takes care of that! Now, back to our conversation. Anybody know of a good easy to read article explaining the difference between Sigma Delta and r2r dac’s? Beave
Actually, I would give at least as much credit to Oppo's implementation of the 205 than the DAC used.
My cliff's notes understanding of two different methods. High bitrate slower frequency (R2R) versus low bitrate high frequency (Delta Sigma). The R2R method takes the entire 16 or 24 bit word and converts the entire word leaving smaller noise and signal level variations to be dealt with or ignored later. Delta Sigma converts chunks of smaller 5-8 bit words then recombines them while creating a lot of noise and implements a complex reconstitution filter to clean it up. The differences heard between them may be more related to the amount of filtering required to produce the output, where DS will require a lot of filtering to clean up the noises it creates.
