Do We All Hear The Same?

Do we all hear the same? NO WAY!!! Age, Allergies, Earwax Buildup, Experience, Weather, Altitude, Listening Too Loud, Attitude...All makes a difference in the way we hear our music. So How can we all agree? My wife and I always differ in our musical opinions on what sounds good. Everytime I play my music it's TOO LOUD! But it's OK when hers is BLASTING!

 

Correct Michael.

 

That's why there is always conflict on this forum. No two people hear things the same, and no two people percieve things the same.

That is why one's hearing ability, sound system, media preferences, and other things are sometimes called into question by those who may not agree with their views.

Perhaps it is pointless to respond to these thread topics. Perhaps the lurkers and rare posters know better.

You know, Steve Hoffman is sucking in all of what is posted on this forum. He's getting an eyeful of what his fans think, but do you think that any of this will influence the way he masters anything? I doubt it! Actually, I should hope not, because we, who post here, are just a very small fraction of very vocal and opinionated people who buy DCC discs and LPs. What about the other people out there who buy the stuff who may not even know how to use the internet? What do they think? Do they all show a preference to the licorice pizza? Do they own 5000+ CDs or LPs? Do they have high-end systems? We just don't know.

 

Grant,

Your points are very well made! The endless debates are pointless. The sharing of information is priceless!

Bob

 

Objectively speaking, we should all start our listening with perfectly flat frequency response speaker systems and phono cartridges. That is the ideal. Then the differences we report would be more a matter of what is on the CD or record. But as Mr. Hoffman has observed here, there is something about a live performance that is just not captured by the most accurate reproduction systems. No one seems to know what that is. Although I don't comprehend how a different interconnect, speaker wire or burning in the electronics of a CD or SACD player could make any difference I find all such comments interesting and wonder how come most if not all so-called double blind tests fail to support such seemingly credible observations. I continue to soak it all in but in the end find that the entertainment value of what I play greatly outweights the differences between speakers, etc. Still, I love good sound, whatever that is.

 

Beagle - that might be the most profound thing I've read on these forums yet!



HZ

 

Without trying to assume my hearing is spot-on, and throw around specific ideas, I sincerely feel that we "know" how things sound naturally, and if you tend to call yourself an audiophile, you compare those sounds, however you process them, in comparison with what you FEEL sounds natural or "correct".

There's a million and one things as tweeks that people try, some people swear by, but I'm suprised that no one said "Drinking carrot juice makes everything sound better" or that decongestants might help your sinuses, therefore, help your hearing.

When I was a child, I must have had 2 sets of 'ear tubes' (they must have been 12AX7's because they hurt and I suddenly had bionic hearing!) and I had lots of ear infections.

But I don't have a problem hearing the same thing more strongly in one ear than another, really. A lot of people have the Brian Wilson hearing problem. Almost a forced "MONO" hearing capacity. Some people have it slightly that way, and their brain adjusted to this slight disability.

I'm more apt to believe our ability around sensitive hearing is 50% good physical hearing and 50% trained brain. I haven't seen one tweek for the brain, yet. All I keep hearing is carrots help you see better. Well, I don't wear glasses thank heavens, but I ain't no Bugs Bunny.

 

Hi,

Me thinks, the million dollar answer is Chemistry. The energy between the band & the audience cannot be captured on any recording equipment. Many names have been used to define it but the bottomline is ya just hadda be there.

Here's thankin' the Music Gods for the many times I was,
Jeffrey

 

Grant, You may have noticed that I have not been posting as much lately. This is because there seems to be a lot more more debating going on. I think that most people don't like being told that the format, version, stamper etc. of thier favorite album sucks and so they feel a need to defend it. I tend to not join in these arguments because in most cases my opinion is just that "opinion". I don't have 20 copies of any given LP to determine the best stamper, there are pros and cons to both CD's and LPs and no one but you knows whether your copy, played on your equipment in your chosen space sounds good enough to please you but you. That being said, I do enjoy hearing the opinions of the others on the forum who may have the time, money and listening skills to make what they feel are ligitimate observations regarding formats, versions and stampers. When I read something I don't agree with, I simply disregard it. However, many times I find that if I do have, say, the LP and CD of an album, when I listen again with a slightly more critical ear, I do hear a difference like the Poster said. Whether it's enough to make me trash that copy or spend $100.00 on ebay is another story.

I appologize as this was actually longer than I intended it to be but my point is, I actually like reading other people's opinions on these topics, I simply refuse to engage in a debate unless I have a strong opinion or some insight that has been missed. By the way I tend to shy away from the topics of religion and politics too.

 

Grant - I think I understand your point in these discussions. The music is more important than the medium.
I agree but I'm always looking for the best ways to reproduce the music in a way that gets me as close to the original recording (master) as possible. With CD, SACD, DVD-A, Original Vinyl and Reissue vinyl (both standard and audiophile) to compare it's almost impossible to always have the "best" version of every one of your favorites. If I had to choose between old 45's or no music at all there'd be no question which way I'd go but the choices are far more complicated now.

 

Dave, I have to agree with a lot of what you just said. I don't think it's wrong to blurt out your opinion, so if you felt hesitant to let go your feelings about this stuff, don't.

I've been kinda doing more lurking than posting in the past month, although it's not because I feel any differently for this forum. Two things have happened more often: Debates and Being Nitpicky About Vinyl. I'd like to make it clear that I feel there's NOTHING wrong with that, but it raises the bar and alienates a lot of people inadvertantly. That's no ones' fault. If at all, it makes it hard to join in on a discussion unless you feel 100% confident that you're right. It's just the nature of things. I'd rather not call in discussions for religion, politics, sexuality, racial profiling and other beaten-horse topics because it creates a tail-chasing effect and doesn't leave a welcome mat for kinder, gentler discussion. Not fun? Then why play?

Fact also is, for those of you who would rather lurk (like I have) if you do have ideas or concerns, please post them as new threads, fearlessly. Just because heavy debates seem popular, doesn't mean that's the only thing on our collective mind.

 

Thanks Sckott - I guess my only problem with some of the debates that go on here and on other audiophile forums is that ugly tone of superiority that is implied in some responses. This forum is actually pretty good at keeping people in check. I do respond if I have a strong opinion on a recording although in most cases someone usually beats me to it.

 

EXACTLY!!!!!!!! THAT is what I don't like in some of the posts by certain individuals! Unless you have a mega-buck, hi-res system, or play vinyl, or don't listen on Saturday afternoons, you are not worthy to participate ihn this forum. Everything is a contest, a game of one-uppsmanship. He who owns the most of Steve's work wins! Yeeeeee!

If I didn't speak up about this, this forum would have turned into www.stevehoffman.vinyl! You know why Lycos shut down BSN? They looked at this site and decided there wasn't room for two BSNs on the net!

 

Oh Grant. Just do what I do. I just cut through all the ego stuff to pick up a tidbit or two. That's what's interesting to me.

I have about 100 LP's and about 2000 CD's, but I love reading all of the LP posts. Why? SOMEONE in the world is still passionate about music enough to put their stereo on batteries, etc. I have no time to do all those tweaks but I can get behind those who do. When these people vanish from the earth, Hi-Fi will be in really big trouble. The compressed tin can sound will take over. Noooooooo!!!

I don't feel threatened at all by someone with a $50,000.00 stereo. Who cares? I drive a Honda Accord too. When I see a guy driving a BMW 740 I don't try to run him off the road or scowl at him. Even if I had a bundle of money I wouldn't spend that much for a car or a stereo. But it's fun to read about those who do.

When someone prattles on and on about their new $5000.00 tone arm, It doesn't push my buttons at all. I never would spend that money, but since I don't have it, it doesn't seem to make me crazy. I'm happy with my CD's. Friends make me CD-R's from LP's and that's fine too. I would never ask them what phono stage they are using, but I admit I have learned a bunch from the LP lovers here.

It's fun!

 

I agree. It IS fun to read all the posts.

No strings attached.

 

Ditto!

All opinions are interesting to read and think about...

 

I think i'll go play some maximized mp3s through cheap comptuer speakers.

 

Grant,

I am listening to a home recorded CD-R here at work through my Compaq laptop.

The sound is pretty bad with no outboard speakers...so just enjoy the music!

That is all that really counts!

Bob

 

Hey Grant,

Yeah, there are lots of vinyl discussions, but I see lots of talk of cds as well (and even MONO cds!).

As Steve says, just roll with it babe! And as another wise man once said (hmm.. maybe this was Steve as well!): act, don't react. Wanna talk about CDs? Post more about CDs. I can guarantee that lots of people here are more than willing to talk about 'em!

 

John, I think this is excellent advice. In general, I don't think anyone on this forum intends to insult or belittle anyone's musical taste or choices. Unfortunetly, since you can't tell someone's tone from their writing the responses sometimes seem harsher then they are meant to be. Hearing others opinions of records and CD's I don't have but am interested in is a major part of what I enjoy about this forum. I have found some excellent CDs and LPs through these recommendations.

 

First off, I never intended for my contributions to be taken as personal insults. They certainly were not meant to be, not originally anyway. If I can't be honest and truthful about what I hear, then I can't be, period.

Secondly, it's about music. And only music. It's not about equipment or formats. Your choice of formats or gear is only for the betterment of the music reaching your ears.

To quote one of the worlds top recording engineers...

"I don't know what great equipment is, outside of what it does for great music".

Compact Disc means nothing to me, neither does LP. It's what they give to me. I will listen to a song in the manner that provides me with the most musical enjoyment with the least outside interferences (ex. distortion). If I choose to listen to the Mercury re-master of 10cc "The Original Soundtrack" because the version of
"Channel Swimmer" sounds better that the noisy Philips 45 B-side, then that's what it's gonna be. If I choose the original Mercury LP to listen to the actual album, it's because it sounds/feels best for me.

I liked listening to LP's because I feel immersed in the music, the sound washes into me. Most music released in the last 12 years has been exclusively on Compact Disc. That's my source for this music, I have no choice in the matter. Did it stop me from buying and listening? Of course not. A format does not stop me from recognizing good and bad music. A format also does not stop me from recognizing poorly recorded music (and there is more poorly recorded music in the last 5 years than there has ever been).

Can anybody imagine someone being content and happy with a $10 record player with a quarter on the tonearm? Well, I sure was as a kid, I could play records over and over and over for hours and love every minute of it. Somewhere along the way, this ritual turned into equipment evaluation or format evaluation sessions. Too much knowledge or information can be a dangerous thing.

With SACD, it marks the first time that I am basically content two ways of playing records. SACD betters my vinyl versions of the titles I own. If this is what we were offered in 1982, I don't believe we'd ever have had any format wars.

But that's just me. If you are smiling, content and tapping your feet and lost in your music, don't change anything. Go buy more music.