FLEETWOOD MAC Rumours -- New WB vinyl, "Gold Dust Woman" mix variation question...

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by Steve Hoffman, Jun 6, 2007.

  1. Wilkie

    Wilkie New Member

    Location:
    Richmond, VA, USA
    Yes...like the song "Tusk". 24 seconds shorter and a different mix from the 45 and the LP, but the booklet just says "From the album Tusk". I think there were others as well. All 12 listed as edited or alt-mix were as such though.
     
  2. bru87tr

    bru87tr 80’s rule

    Location:
    MA
    time to pull out my mutli copies of Rumors...etc

    cool thread Steve!!!
     
  3. rockclassics

    rockclassics Senior Member

    Location:
    Mainline Florida
    I would tend to agree with Lindsey....."she was under duress". :laugh: Or as a friend of mine (who does not like Stevie's singing) "she sounds liked a bleeting sheep".

    I remember seeing this episode of Classic Albums and really enjoyed it. Thanks for posting the clip.
     
  4. bru87tr

    bru87tr 80’s rule

    Location:
    MA
    My....

    Holland white vinyl has the screaming/howl.

    RL FM test pressing has it.

    Canada Ciniram (late 80's?) pressed CD has it, I only listened once but it sounds like there is more of it on this cd than the two other vinyl pressings I mentioned. seems longer.
     
  5. Steve Hoffman

    Steve Hoffman Your host Your Host Thread Starter

    Location:
    Los Angeles

    Jeffrey,

    Thank you. Nice to see the records going around.:)

    So, you have two different end mixes for GOLD DUST WOMAN there.

    First, that white vinyl has the big howl and is missing the sound of a breaking glass on the "Medium howl" version.

    The song in reality goes on longer and ends cold but this is very interesting.

    The Nautilus version uses the MIDDLE VOLUME HOWL mix. Note the breaking glass after she sings "widow" and the more subdued howl?

    I think Ken Perry must have cut this album over 50 times at Capitol. Each cut is a little different because Ken did the fades by hand. When you factor in the different lengths of some of the songs and the alternate mix pieces edited in and out it's pretty overwhelming for a silly slob mastering engineer like me. I'll get it right though!
     
  6. quicksrt

    quicksrt Senior Member

    Location:
    Los Angeles
    So ideally, we'd be best given the "big howl" version with full cold ending?

    Anyway, all versions do show off a beautifully composed basic track with Mick keeping a very simple but rock solid time.
     
    Former Lee Warmer likes this.
  7. -=Rudy=-

    -=Rudy=- ♪♫♪♫♫♪♪♫♪♪ Staff

    Location:
    US
    Fake? More like slop! Talk about a sloppy edit on that fake extended ending! I always thought it should go on a little longer, but not by way of an extension that does not fit.

    The stereo program on the DVD-A version has the original ending, just like my "palm tree" label LP. Thank goodness. I think my CD version has the extended ending; it was a "WTF" moment the first time I heard it.
     
  8. Steve Hoffman

    Steve Hoffman Your host Your Host Thread Starter

    Location:
    Los Angeles
    Ken Perry knew how to cut vinyl!

    Big Howl with Cold Ending. Sounds like a plan.
     
  9. CardinalFang

    CardinalFang New Member

    Location:
    ....
    Well, since that issue has been settled, here's a version of Gold Dust Woman from Tokyo in 1977:

    http://youtube.com/watch?v=uLra0cdJbpk

    :thumbsup:
     
  10. Metoo

    Metoo Forum Hall Of Fame

    Location:
    Spain (EU)
    Might be, but the full fade out on it happens at 2:40. Wasn't this the length of the extended version? :confused:
     
  11. :agree: :righton: :wave:
     
  12. bru87tr

    bru87tr 80’s rule

    Location:
    MA
    listened to the DVD-A and its even longer.
     
  13. Gary

    Gary Nauga Gort! Staff

    Location:
    Toronto
    When I read posts like this, I think I should buy two copies - play one and frame one! Because it'll be absolutely perfect.... :love:
     
  14. RemarkablyInsincere

    RemarkablyInsincere Active Member

    I'm definitely gonna buy this one.... and seeing those records spin while listening to the clips was really cool. Can we make that the standard from now on? :righton:
     
  15. Steve Hoffman

    Steve Hoffman Your host Your Host Thread Starter

    Location:
    Los Angeles
    So, those of you who care, a possible reason for the ending switch of GOLD DUST WOMAN.

    It seems that the FIRST version was the big howl mix without the breaking glass sound effect.

    As you will hear when you get our new Warner Bros. LP vinyl mastering, the end builds to a tremendous crescendo which was living hell to cut for us; we did it but they probably were not so lucky in 1977. So, a manufacturing decree came down in '77 to Warner Bros. Records stating that the song was too hot at the end and was causing metal mother/master and stamper problems.

    The answer was to substitute a new end part for the song which featured an end that did NOT increase in volume. This was spliced on and used for most recuts: The medium howl version with the breaking glass. This was probably an alternate ending that was done at the same time as the rest of the album mixes.

    The rub is that the loud howl version was spliced on the end of the duplicate OTHER master reel for side two, the one that was "not to be used for record cutting" from the second tape machine. When the actual side two masters started to wear out they substituted the loud version from the other reel without even realizing it was different.

    Once they did (probably 20 cuts later, heh), Ken Perry put the medium howl version ending back on and just rode the gain DOWN when it started to get louder.

    After that, depending on God knows what, both versions were used.

    Phew. Confusing but I tell ya, it's a challenge!
     
    Paul P., PBo, supermd and 1 other person like this.
  16. DaveN

    DaveN Music Glutton

    Location:
    Apex, NC
    Steve,

    I've said it many times since you announced the Warner Bros./Reprise/Rhino vinyl LP reissue program, but I cannot wait to buy this record! The fact that you would sweat these details gives me great hope toward having a religious experience. My money is already reserved.
     
  17. Steve Hoffman

    Steve Hoffman Your host Your Host Thread Starter

    Location:
    Los Angeles
    David,

    Glad you are looking forward to this. I treat all mastering with great care; being careful not to tamper with history but also trying to give the listener the most exciting bang for the buck.

    People, please remember, Fleetwood Mac RUMOURS is a very mellow, warm sounding album. I know the songs rock as well but in general the mixes are quite warm and yummy sounding. I DID NOT TAMPER WITH THAT SOUND! The EQ notes for older versions call for +15 db at 10k,-15 db at 100 cycles, etc. for all songs. Urggh, this is supreme overkill. This is one of the most famous albums of all time; please don't think I've forgotten that for one minute... We will let the music speak for itself and let your turntable capture the true sound of the master tapes, possibly for the first time ever.
     
    ivor likes this.
  18. Tony Caldwell

    Tony Caldwell Senior Member

    Location:
    Arkansas



    Reading threads like this makes life worth living.:thumbsup:

    It sure beats watching another episode of "Sportscenter"
    duh-duh-duh ... duh-duh-duh

    I can't wait to hear these LPs!!

    Thanks Steve.
     
  19. macready

    macready New Member

    Location:
    Oregon, USA
    :yikes:
     
  20. MMM

    MMM Forum Hall Of Fame

    Location:
    Lodi, New Jersey
    Steve, I'm glad you decided on version 1 - I like it much better than the others. I have version 1 on an F19 cut, and version 3 on an F44. The deluxe CD issue has version 1. The common CD (post "Target", pre-deluxe) has version 2, which I like the least, but part of that may be the wonky mastering. The screams sound halfhearted and lame on version 2.

    I have the 8 track here somewhere - isn't that supposed to have another version?
     
  21. JoelDF

    JoelDF Senior Member

    Location:
    Prairieville, LA
    Eww. They didn't do that to the old target CD too, did they? It seems mellower than that.
     
  22. MMM

    MMM Forum Hall Of Fame

    Location:
    Lodi, New Jersey

    Is that for the "common" CD? It's pretty thin and trebly, and I never liked it. Did they cut any lacquers with "moves" like that?
     
  23. Chris M

    Chris M Senior Member In Memoriam

    So what do you guys think of the mastering on the 2CD edition from a few years back?
     
  24. John Carsell

    John Carsell Forum Resident

    Location:
    Northwest Illinois
    Too bright but listenable.
     
  25. Duophonic

    Duophonic Beatles

    Location:
    BEATLES LOVE SONGS
    I just listened to all these samples and I'm very spooked. What a spooky ending. In Paul's words "a suitable ending I think" heh heh...
     

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