Frank Sinatra's Capitol and Reprise recordings now under one roof

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by Bob F, Oct 30, 2013.

  1. Hamhead

    Hamhead The Bear From Delaware

    Other than the alternate takes on the blue box, none. The book is incredible.
    If/when Sony gets around to doing another pass for the blue box, they should invest in one of these to play the damaged discs.

     
  2. MMM

    MMM Forum Hall Of Fame

    Location:
    Lodi, New Jersey
    What is that supposed to help with - if something is unplayable with something more conventional?
     
  3. Smartin62

    Smartin62 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Cleburne, Tx USA
    No physical contact between needle and record supposedly reduces noise and makes it possible to transfer damaged records (as shown).

    I read a long article somewhere on the interweb debunking it (wish I could remember where). Something about (and I'm synopsising from imperfect memory) "while that may be true, it still picks up debris and deformaties and translates them back into clicks and pops, anyway". Something to that effect.

    I also remember (I think) over on the SFF reading a response by Chuck Granata in the Blue Box thread, perhaps indirectly, to a post from an unruly poster (who wouldn't shut up about getting alternate takes instead of original ones) that he and his team felt that some of the original parts were too worn or damaged to transfer (presumably with a needle) hence the alternate takes that were in better shape got used (if I remember any of that correctly).

    True or not, this might be worth a shot on those older worn/damaged parts that might not take well to physical contact with a needle (imho). I can live with a little noise. It's history!
     
  4. Bob F

    Bob F Senior Member Thread Starter

    You remember correctly: LINK
     
  5. paulmock

    paulmock Forum Resident

    Location:
    Hollywood, CA
    I've said it before, the book in the Blue Box is beautifully produced. However, I could have done without some of Friedwald's self-amusing comments. He can REALLY get under my skin...the wrong way!
     
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  6. MMM

    MMM Forum Hall Of Fame

    Location:
    Lodi, New Jersey
    Thanks. When they were playing The Beatles, it didn't sound so great, so I figured this might be most useful for something physically damaged beyond groove wear and light-moderate scratches.

    As Chuck has noted, since the "blue box" was produced, not only has the turntable and arm been upgraded significantly, they have many more styli to try and get the best out of the groove - above/below previous wear as much as possible, etc. I got to hear a transfer being done in the studio a couple of years ago of a radio performance acetate, and a few different styli were tested until it was obvious a particular tip was "the one". The sound really came to life using it. Even then, there was a spot on the disc that was repeating. It played through the bad spot for the transfer by gently adding a touch of force at that point to the top of the arm/cartridge with a cotton swab on a long stick.

    Without hearing a direct transfer of what the Optical Fibre can do to say for sure, I get the impression from the demo that this won't yield better results from a fidelity standpoint, but can be helpful in "saving" something otherwise thought beyond hope.
     
  7. kennyluc1

    kennyluc1 Frank Sinatra collector

    CBS/Sony has, so far, always given me my money's worth. I look forward to Will Friedwald doing a great job on the liner note's with each release.
     
  8. colormesinatra

    colormesinatra Forum Resident

    Location:
    Malverne, NY
    Regardless of what is in good or bad shape (when it comes to the Columbia material), is there any money at all in that music for FSE? I can't see it selling well these days.

    -Robert
     
  9. Bob F

    Bob F Senior Member Thread Starter

    There's no money at all in Columbia material for FSE. Sony owns the rights.
     
  10. Simon A

    Simon A Arrr!

    Without wanting to threadcrap, I noticed that Amazon has two versions of that set. A black one they say was released in 2007 and grey one with the release year of 2011. Is one superior to the other? Have changes been made to the sound itself or simply the packaging. I don't have any Columbia recordings except the Christmas Dreaming LP so I thought this could be a nice introduction for me. Any thoughts? Thank you!
     
  11. Bob F

    Bob F Senior Member Thread Starter

    The release year of 2011 (at Amazon Canada) is an error. The box was released in 2007 in two different form factors. The black image is for the "cube" clamshell case, which was the original deluxe factory design. The "grey" image was for a 5 x 10 book-style case in "long box" for certain retailers like Costco. Music is the same, but photos are cropped differently in the two books. I recommend the cube (black image at Amazon). This is a great intro to the early Sinatra years, with best remastering to date for some of the tracks. Much more detail at the SFF.
    __________________
    ~ Frank's Albums
     
    Last edited: Nov 18, 2013
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  12. Simon A

    Simon A Arrr!

    Thanks Bob! :righton:
     
  13. colormesinatra

    colormesinatra Forum Resident

    Location:
    Malverne, NY
    What I should have said then was: In 2013 or 2014 is there any money in it for Sony if they re-release Sinatra's Columbia material?

    I can't imagine it selling well these days. I'm 24 and a HUGE Frank fan but the Columbia material doesn't interest me much.

    -Robert
     
  14. Simon A

    Simon A Arrr!

    Robert, revisit Frank's Columbia catalog in, let's say, fifteen years and you might change your mind. I used to believe that his Capitol material was the only one that was worthwhile. I'm not yet ready for the Reprise mid to late 60's stuff, but I've slowly started appreciating the Columbia years.

    This is the beauty of music. It's a time machine. Somewhere in the future, you may want to visit that period of the past. The person you will be then might discover things that the person you are now is not interested in.
     
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  15. colormesinatra

    colormesinatra Forum Resident

    Location:
    Malverne, NY
    Simon,

    I understand what you're saying. I probably will rediscover it one day. I must note that I know the Columbia material is gorgeous stuff and of fine quality but it is very much the same temperature. All those ballads blend into each other. Did I mention all those ballads? I've also never been a fan of the use of choirs in ANY recording, let alone Sinatra's. I listen for Frank, not his backup. I listen to the Sinatra/Dorsey AND the Harry James material all the time and that material is older than the Columbia material. As you know.

    -Robert
     
  16. Bob F

    Bob F Senior Member Thread Starter

    [Duplicate post: This came up in the MFSL thread, but it belongs more properly here.]

    It's escaped much attention, but the first "Signature Sinatra" collaboration between UMe and FSE (not counting the DUETS 20th Anniversary ballyhoo) was released yesterday. (See: this post.)

    [​IMG]

    So far, I've examined only the first disc in the box (A SWINGIN' AFFAIR!). It's the Norberg mastering, a digital clone of the disc in the 2004 Capitol "mini" concept albums box set.
     
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2013
  17. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff

    I hope Universal doesn't sue itself over having such similar album titles released so close together.
     
  18. bluesbro

    bluesbro Forum Hall of Shame

    Location:
    DC
    Crap, this is so depressing...
     
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  19. Bob F

    Bob F Senior Member Thread Starter

    In all fairness, the new box is a real budget affair: Five CDs in mini LP-style cardboard sleeves (poorly assembled and glued, but reasonably accurate replications of the original LPs front and back), in a flimsy slip case. No additional notes or credits. Disc labels are in the style used for the UMG EU issues, with a Reprise era smiling Frank (even on the Capitol titles). For less than $20, I wasn't expecting much more.
     
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2013
  20. Bob F

    Bob F Senior Member Thread Starter

    5-Classic-Swingin'-Albums.jpg
     
  21. bozburn

    bozburn Forum Resident

    Location:
    Rome, GA, US
    Those are definitely 5 of my favorite FS albums. Should make a great Christmas gift to non-audiophile friends.
     
  22. MarkusGermany

    MarkusGermany WINNING

    Location:
    Rheinberg, Germany
    I don't need these.
     
  23. Bob F

    Bob F Senior Member Thread Starter

    I meant to mention above that there are no bonus tracks either. I've now examined one of the Reprise titles (SWING ALONG WITH ME), and it's a digital clone of the 2009 UMG issue (which in turn is identical to the 1999 Reprise EOTC remaster).
     
  24. MarkusGermany

    MarkusGermany WINNING

    Location:
    Rheinberg, Germany
    Surprise surprise.... Only bad news today
     
  25. Bob F

    Bob F Senior Member Thread Starter

    :shrug: Well, for $17, I can't see why people are complaining. It's not an audiophile treatment, but they're keeping the Sinatra catalog in print. It's the first time in a good long while that the two Reprise albums have been available in the USA.
     
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