I just got "The Association - Greatest Hits" LP from Goodwill and now I am at work. As I was reading the wikipedia article about the album I noticed the following note: Is that right? I mean I have a bunch of records from the 60s that say that they are playable in both mono and stereo, but this is the first time that I hear of Haeco-CSG. I don't remember any of these being particularly bad sounding. If anyone can provide a list of records where this system was used or any other info it would be great. Sorry if this has been discussed before. PS. Like I said I am at work, so I cannot verify whether The Association Greatest Hits LP is indeed the worst sounding LP ever but now I am getting impatient to go home and give it a listen
This is the system that made Neil Young remix his first album when he discovered that it had caused audio problems, right? IIRC, Mason Williams Ear Show (another Reprise release from around the same time) mentions Haeco-CSG on the back cover.
All 45s of "A Beautiful Morning" by The Rascals are CSG processed. My old A&M 45s of "All Right Now" by Free, and "A Song Of Joy" by Miguel Rios were CSG as well. A&M seemed to hang on to the CSG system the longest....some of The Carpenters' 45s are CSG-d too. The stereo mixes of "I've Gotta Be Me" by Sammy Davis, Jr. and "Turn Around, Look At Me" by The Vogues are ruined by CSG too..
The Herbie Mann single 'Memphis underground' b/w 'New Orleans' (Atlantic 2621) states on its labels 'CSG PROCESSED MONO MASTER'. I can't imagine how that would be used in the cutting of mono lacquers beyond the possibility of, say, either doing folddowns of CSG-processed stereo master tapes to make the mono cuts, or, if non-CSG stereo tapes are the sources, use the CSG to doctor the stereo signals, after which, the CSG's left and right outputs could be summed, and the mono cuts made from the result. (I don't have a copy of the MEMPHIS UNDERGROUND LP to know if it's a CSG stereo disc or not.)
Here's a few other records I know of which were mastered with CSG: A&M SP 4227//ORIGINAL SOUNDTRACK, BUTCH CASSIDY AND THE SUNDANCE KID--Burt Bacharach, B J Thomas (1969) A&M SP 4247//GREATEST HITS--Wes Montgomery (1970) A&M SP 4252//GREATEST HITS--Sergio Mendez and Brazil '66 (1970) A&M 1648-S//'Merry Christmas darling' b/w 'Santa Claus is coming to town'--The Carpenters (1974) Atlantic 2492//'L. David Sloane' b/w 'I gotta keep on gwine'--The Atlantic Sounds (1968) ('Raindrops keep fallin' on my head' from BUTCH CASSIDY.... can be found in non-CSG stereo on the BJ Thomas album RAINDROPS KEEP FALLIN' ON MY HEAD, Scepter SPS 580.)
"Fool On The Hill" & "Ye Me Le"-Sergio Mendes & Brasil '66. Great albums ruined because of that wonky processing used on them.
Thanks guys and wow, I did not know that so many great albums were "infected" by the Haeco-CSG system. Cream's Wheels of Fire!!! That's a shame....
Yes. Take a stereo mix, feed it through the CSG box, then sum to mono. Fortunately (to my knowledge) it just affects the *relationship* of the two channels, and is simple to undo with software. In fact, I'm pretty sure you could undo CSG simply by feeding the signal through the box again with the channels reversed. If you had an actual CSG box, of course. The DCC Wheels of Fire sounds very nice de-CSG'd...
Would it be possible to upload a couple of samples for comparison? I know Wheels Of Fire sounds wonky and I'd love to hear what it sounds like without the phase shift
Hopefully MP3s will suffice. CSG phase shift undone and channels properly aligned. I didn't touch the balance (which is arguably off a bit). FWIW, the left channel was not touched. The right channel was shifted 90 degrees. White Room Politician Those Were the Days Deserted Cities of the Heart Anyone For Tennis Also CSG were Passing the Time (both mixes), Born Under a Bad Sign and the 45 mix of Pressed Rat and Warthog. Not sure if that was a unique mix or simply the LP mix run through the CSG box. Not sure why they bothered with CSG at all during mixing and didn't leave it until mastering instead.
Thanks for those Luke! I still can't for the life of me figure out how to use that "Stereo Tool" winamp plugin that you used to make those, it's about as un-intuitive as ClickRepair in manual mode
I have a handful of albums (mostly on the Reprise label) which mention Haeco/CSG on the back cover, e.g. Frank Sinatra's "Cycles" album and Sammy Davis, Jr's "I Gotta Be Me". Arne
When using it in plug-in mode: 1) Click RESET to make sure everything is off/at its default 2) Click ON under Stereo Image/Flat Stereo 3) Adjust the angle slider to either 90 degrees or -90 degrees, depending on the recording. At this point you're just listening to any changes without writing them to a file. To write to a file: 4) Change the Output plug-in from Nullsoft WaveOut Output to Nullsoft Disk Writer 5) Click Configure to setup where you want files written to. 6) Quit Winamp. 7) Open Winamp and play the file you want to convert. 8) Repeat 6 & 7. 9) Switch back to Nullsoft WaveOut Output when done. There seems to be a bug in Winamp when playing multiple files; when using Disk Writer you may get a short burst of the previous file at the start of the file you are writing. Quitting Winamp and doing the write right away gets around that. I believe there's also a stand-alone version which probably doesn't have any of those problems
CSG Numerous A&M albums from the late 60s used H-CSG. My Neil Young (1st album with The Loner) says CSG also. Scott
Percy Sledge's "Take Time to Know Her" LP proudly announces its CSG processing on the front and back covers.
My U.S. 45 of Cream's "Badge" mentions it's CSG'ed on the label, but I think it sounds very good -- as good as my copies of that song on a German LP and a Canadian LP.
"Home to the Sea" by the San Sebastian Strings says that it employs the Haeco-CSG system on the back cover.
I searched and found some threads describing HAECO CSG, but could find no list of all the music that was subjected to the CSG process. So far I know these three albums had it: Cream - Wheels of Fire Association - Greatest Hits Sergio Mendes - Fool On the Hill What other CSG processed albums and singles do you know of?
