History of CBS Records 30th Street Studio NYC (many pictures)

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by DMortensen, Oct 21, 2014.

  1. DMortensen

    DMortensen Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Seattle, WA USA
    Not sure about that. It's taken a lot to make me want to share it online at all, and I'm not yet sure about having it available for the ages, as it's taken me a fair amount of time and money to be able to come up with what I have, and I have resisted the idea of just giving it all away. Although it is fun to share it with like-minded people.

    Call me weird but I'm weird so am not bothered.
     
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  2. DMortensen

    DMortensen Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Seattle, WA USA
    What was the name of his management company?

    Regarding the smaller room in 30th St., Studio D, we've been unable to fix exactly when it was used as a studio and when it was used as a storeroom or something else.

    Looking at my Studio Usage spreadsheet, which is where I've put random information about the timeline of each studio, what I show is that it was a studio from the time of the new larger control room, 1962, through the end of the building, 1981.

    So maybe he did record in there. I'll look further into November later, not now, maybe not today.
     
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  3. lukpac

    lukpac Senior Member

    Location:
    Milwaukee, WI
    I think we've discussed this before, but...exactly how are the various studios designated over time? Because at least at one point there was a Studio D at 799 Seventh Ave, and I want to say that was possibly in use until CBS vacated 799 in the fall of 1966, but I'm not certain. That is to say, "Studio D" in 1964 could *possibly* refer to either 799 Seventh Ave or 30th Street.
     
  4. GLouie

    GLouie Forum Resident

    Location:
    Seattle
    No need to be an AES member for this Zoom. No guarantees about being able to post the video. It can be a lot of work for little return to edit a 4 hour video and post it, and sometimes we have little copyright snags we would want to attend to. DanM would be the one who has to do the work, although a few get posted to his YouTube.

    (posted before seeing Dan's reply)
     
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  5. DMortensen

    DMortensen Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Seattle, WA USA
    Yes.

    The one clincher to knowing that there was a smaller studio in 30th St. is that there are a few pictures of it in use, or more accurately, being ready for use. There are pics in this thread showing Moog synthesizer(s?) in it, and a window which came and maybe went between the large control room and the hallway between it and the smaller studio, which also had a window there so you could look clear through. Unclear to me about when the window in the big control room was there and when it wasn't there, possibly both before and after it was there.
     
  6. WMTC

    WMTC Forum Resident

    Location:
    Pittsburgh
    Thank you so much! I really appreciate it!
     
  7. DMortensen

    DMortensen Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Seattle, WA USA
    Something else that came up:

    When looking in December 1964, there was a listing for "Audition: Waiting For The Man", with Goddard being the person listed. No other names.

    I just finished a biography of Andy Warhol ("POP", by Tony Scherman and David Dalton) which talked at length about the Velvet Underground and his connection to them. It said that they and he really wanted to get them into Columbia's famous Studio B to record their first album but after realizing they couldn't afford to rent that studio, they made a deal with Scepter Records to record in that studio, at 254 W. 54th St (later home to Studio 54, according to the book) with staff engineer John Licata. They recorded from April 19-22, 1966, with Norman Dolph "former Columbia sales executive turned live deejay" as producer. The studio was still under construction the first few days, and they cut 10 songs including "Heroin", "Venus In Furs", and "I"m Waiting for The Man". Those three were recut the following month with Tom Wilson producing, and they recorded one more song "Sunday Morning". Those four songs plus the seven from the earlier session were released a year later on Scepter, I assume, as The Velvet Underground and Nico, which is a legendary album.

    After the recording was finished, according to the book, "Norman Dolph sent the tapes to his artist-development friends at Columbia Records and got back a memo: 'It was corporately worded', he recalled but between the lines you could hear someone saying 'What the **** is this?!?!'"

    My question: These things happened two years apart (Dec. 1964 and April/May 1966). Was there any connection between them, or was that phrase a common one at that time and there were other musical works containing it?
     
  8. lukpac

    lukpac Senior Member

    Location:
    Milwaukee, WI
    I did find this:

    However, Cale's debut was 1970. And while I'm no VU expert, I don't believe they ever went by "Waiting For The Man", despite that song of Reed's.

    My money is on coincidence, although I have no idea what the Goddard session refers to.

    I also wonder if they wanted to get into Studio A, not Studio B. I think B was barely open by that point, so I can't imagine it was considered famous, unless it's being referred to in later terms.
     
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  9. inperson

    inperson Senior Member

    Location:
    Ohio
    A friend of mine has a pair of JBL C35 speakers. There are no tweeters inside the cabinet. They are in metal stands on top. There is no proof but he says they were in Capitol Records studios. Would these be worth getting, that is, if I can? They are beautiful and I think I would have to give him a pretty good trade for them.
     
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  10. GLouie

    GLouie Forum Resident

    Location:
    Seattle
    I see there's a new release from Barbra Streisand, "Live at the Bon Soir" which Columbia recorded at the club in Nov 1962, right after signing her. If I understand the story correctly, Columbia thought this live recording would be her debut album, but shelved it for a studio version until now.

    I don't see any original Columbia credits in the usual internet listings, other than the modern mixer, Jochem van Der Slaag. Any clues who and how they did this remote? Some of the 30th St gang? BTW, not Frank Laico's favorite artist, but this was probably before he developed that opinion.
     
  11. Dan C

    Dan C Forum Fotographer

    Location:
    The West
    This is an interesting new video promoting the new Complete 1981 Goldberg Variations box set. This is one of the producers who worked on the project, and this set contains most of the existing studio chatter and takes made during the session. They used two digital and two analog machines simultaneously, and would play back a preferred take so Gould could then start playing the next variation in the same time signature...or some such insane musical concept.

    There might be a few photos in here we haven't seen, but either way I found it fascinating. It's so fittingly the last project made in that wonderful space, and it was a very intense one at that.


    dan c
     
  12. lukpac

    lukpac Senior Member

    Location:
    Milwaukee, WI
    If this is to be believed, Roy Halee:

    "Because of Barbra's success there, Columbia Records A&R rep David Kapralik decided that the first album from his newly-signed artist would emanate from a setting in which she had become most comfortable: the small stage at the Bon Soir. Producer Mike Berniker and recording engineers Roy Halee and Adjutor "Pappy" Theroux set up the mics and recorders, and for three nights harnessed the electrifying show that Barbra had crafted."

    Barbra Streisand Live at the Bon Soir Hybrid Stereo SACD

    I'm assuming Halee was the balance engineer and Theroux was the "recordist" or tape-op, but I'm not certain.

    Some tracks from the shows were released on Just for the Record...:

    Just for the Record - Wikipedia ...

     
  13. GLouie

    GLouie Forum Resident

    Location:
    Seattle
    I see TTT member Paul Blakemore did the transfer for Bon Soir - we'll have to ask him about that.

    Did we previously note Adjutor "Pappy" Theroux was nicknamed Pappy?
     
    Last edited: Nov 11, 2022
  14. GLouie

    GLouie Forum Resident

    Location:
    Seattle
    Nice - everytime I see a fake AMPEX reel logo on a CD, I think of sticky shed.

    I don't hink we've seen (posted) some of those photos of The Chair.

     
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  15. McLover

    McLover Senior Member

    The name of Gordon's management company was Groscourt. The UA LP notes it was "A Groscourt Production"
     
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  16. McLover

    McLover Senior Member

    Were these KLH loudspeakers, Model 6? I recall Columbia liked this model. Unusual factoid, Columbia Nashville was bought from Owen Bradley (the famous Quonset Hut in Nashville). Bill Walker was a superb arranger. One of the best. Photos very appreciated.
     
  17. EmRR

    EmRR Active Member

    Location:
    Winston Salem, NC

    Quoting from RCA “Broadcast News” April 1936:

    CBS PLAYHOUSE

    The 44th Street Columbia Playhouse was placed in service in February 1934. A technical description of this auditorium studio was published in the May 1934 issue of "Broadcast News," entitled "The Columbia Radio Playhouse," by Howard A. Chinn. This Playhouse is in continuous operation and with such a degree of success as to justify the operation of two additional auditorium studios, the CBS 44th Street Little Theatre and the 45th Street Radio Playhouse. All three Playhouses are similarly equipped and operation at these points has proven to be very successful.

    The new CBS studios and Playhouses are noted for their excellence in program transmission, and represent another progressive step forward in anticipating high fidelity broadcast standards of the future.

    The entire project was directed by E. K. Cohan, CBS Director of Engineering. The audio equipment installation was under the direction of A. B. Chamberlain, Chief Engineer for the Company. Studio construction construction was supervised by G. Stanley McAllister, Manager of Construction and Building Operations.

    A Few Statistics - CBS Studios

    City of New York

    Studio 1 - 43'x41'x15'6"
    Studio 2 - 38'6"x21'6"x13'6"
    Studio 3 - 41'x28'x13'6"
    Studio 4 - 38'x21'6"x13'6"
    Studio 5 - 23′6″'x14'x13'6"
    Studio 6 - 25'6"x12'6"x8'6"
    Studio 7 - 30'x22'x8'6"
    Studio 8 - 8'x8'6"x9'
    Studio 10 - 27'6"x25'6"x9′

    44th Street Radio Playhouse ....91'x67'
    45th Street Radio Playhouse ....88'x49'
    44th Street Little Theatre ..78′6″x49′6″
    44th Street Little Theatre Auxiliary Studio......34'6"x22'6"x10'

    Audience Capacity:
    44th Street Radio Playhouse ....1,050
    45th Street Radio Playhouse.... 750
    44th Street Little Theatre….550

    Velocity Microphones, Total Number 50
    Amplifiers, Total Number.................180
    Volume Controls, Total Number ....325
    Volume Indicators, Total Number .. 66
    Microphone Outlets, Total Number 114

    The Playhouses at least at this time were RCA equipment installations, as evidenced by the additional descriptions and photos.
     
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  18. EmRR

    EmRR Active Member

    Location:
    Winston Salem, NC
    No proof, but that bears a lot of resemblance to the RCA 78 series frames, though with an elongated flat middle section. Otherwise the angles are right. It would be a custom version of the frame, if it were RCA. 78's were passive control surfaces with external rack amps, FWIW. If this is a custom RCA, it could be anything as far as the amps go.

    I can't find the spot this pic was originally posted, but near it was another picture that was indeed a WE 25-A, as someone mentioned. It's a close cropped shot, but you can see the distinctive center control box. I think that was another location, as mentioned.....somewhere else!
     
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  19. EmRR

    EmRR Active Member

    Location:
    Winston Salem, NC
    1st pic below, Western Electric 25-A
    2nd pic. RCA 76

     
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  20. EmRR

    EmRR Active Member

    Location:
    Winston Salem, NC
    Al Q's Flickr has another 799 Seventh Ave picture I don't remember seeing here. 1963, heavily modified Collins 212-B mixer frame. They stopped making those about 1956. If 799 Seventh was mix, this may be line level in, no preamps, just the progam amp. Or totally changed.

    799 Seventh Avenue 1963
     
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  21. EmRR

    EmRR Active Member

    Location:
    Winston Salem, NC
    Back to this mixer again -

    The handles on the sides are interesting, I wonder if this was a remote console used temporarily? It lacks the usual heavy frame decorative aspects you usually see.

    On further reflection I'm less inclined to put it in the RCA 78 family other than superficially. Those had wood frames.

    It does have the John Vassos designed RCA mushroom knobs at a time when they weren't yet widely adopted outside of RCA. Usually an RCA of this era would have square knob escutcheons, even if custom, these are the standard round types as delivered with Daven/Langevin/Cinema/etc controls.
     
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  22. EmRR

    EmRR Active Member

    Location:
    Winston Salem, NC
    Continuing the CBS tangent, August 1944 RCA "Broadcast News" details the 2-A consoles custom built for the new CBS broadcast studios.
    80 series RCA amps, which are virtually the same as found in the 76 consolettes, but as modular units.

    https://worldradiohistory.com/ARCHIVE-RCA/RCA-Broadcast-News/RCA-39.pdf

    January 1945 issue has several articles on polycylindrical diffusers in room design, it's the hot new thing! Everything you could want to know.

    https://worldradiohistory.com/ARCHIVE-RCA/RCA-Broadcast-News/RCA-40.pdf
     
    Last edited: Nov 22, 2022
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  23. John DeAngelis

    John DeAngelis Senior Member

    Location:
    New York, NY
     
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  24. EmRR

    EmRR Active Member

    Location:
    Winston Salem, NC
    From Getty Images:

    CBS Radio Playhouse number 3. 1697 Broadway at West 53rd Street, New York, NY. Originally known as Hammerstein's Theater, later became the Manhattan Theater. In 1936, leased by CBS, it became CBS Radio Playhouse number 3, and later as CBS Television Studio 50. Finally, as The Ed Sullivan Theater.




    CBS NY Master Studio List, New And Updated...1937- Present - Eyes Of A Generation...Television's Living History

    CBS Radio Playhouses
    CBS Radio Playhouse #1 242 West 45th Street
    CBS Radio Playhouse #2 251 West 45th Street
    CBS Radio Playhouse #3 1697 Broadway (became Studio 50)
    CBS Radio Playhouse #4 254 West 54th Street (became Studio 52)
    CBS Radio Playhouse $5 109 West 39th Street (became Studio 51)
     
    Last edited: Nov 22, 2022
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  25. EmRR

    EmRR Active Member

    Location:
    Winston Salem, NC
    Wow, editing option goes away fast here!

    The above master studio list says "Studios 53 to 56 Leiderkranz Hall, 111 East 58th Street. Used from 1950 to 1964". I'd add it to that thread, but it's closed.

    It does not list any of the NYC Playhouses as being on 44th, though the historical articles do, I wonder if the #1-5 references have also changed from earlier times.

    It does list "Studio 51 New York Production Center, 222 East 44th Street". It also says "Studio 52/53 Hi Brown Studios (also called Studio 51/54) unknown when numbering changed."

    More to suss....
     
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