I did an anti-skate test last night with a LASERDISC

Discussion in 'Audio Hardware' started by radioalien, Aug 1, 2020.

  1. radioalien

    radioalien Well-Known Member Thread Starter

    Location:
    Washington
    I actually have some Laserdiscs (a whole other story), and I used one that didn't have material recorded on one side. If you must know it is the 90's classic Stargate. When I placed the stylus down, it seems to stay pretty still, not totally, but enough to keep it from moving inward. I hear that it is hard to do a test this way, since there are no grooves, but wanted to try it. I hope this shows my anti-skate is working properly.
     
    Last edited: Aug 1, 2020
  2. vinylontubes

    vinylontubes Forum Resident

    Location:
    Katy, TX
    It proves it's working. It doesn't prove it's working properly. Skating toward the center is an intended design. It's caused by the offset angle of the cartridge relative to the vector along the effective length of the tonearm. So if the stylus remains stationary, you've effectively removed an intended feature. Properly set anti-skate doesn't eliminate skating, it slows it down to prevent aggressive acceleration.
     
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  3. FalseMetal666

    FalseMetal666 Forum Resident

    Location:
    San Francisco, CA
    If I’m not mistaken this is exactly the method that Peter Lederman and Frank Shroeder recommend for setting up anti skating. And they’re rumored to be fairly knowledgeable about this stuff.
     
  4. Wayne Nielson

    Wayne Nielson Well-Known Member

    I use acrylic blank discs all the time to calibrate AS on all of my tables. In most cases, it ends up close to the recommended settings of the dial gauge. My Sony PS-X7 is spot on, all of the Technics are a tad higher. VPI is very close as is the Empire 598.

    No its not the most perfect tool, but if you have a vintage table, it will let you know if the AS is even working. I'm on my 3rd year of using an AT shibata and still see no signs of wear, nor hear any discernible distractions while playing records. I have been using this technique for many, many years. The result is little to no uneven stylus wear, no perceived IGD of any kind and records produce a sound stage that is full and centered. If the method is wrong, you can't prove it by me.

    I used to include a blank disc with my alignment tools I sold thru Audio by Van Alstine (now retired, no longer available) and never got one bad comment from customers using the disc (or the alignment protractor).
     
  5. jea48

    jea48 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Midwest, USA
    I used a 12" blank vinyl record for getting a place to start from then use the ear to fine tune.

    This guy does a pretty good job of explaining how to set up a turntable.
     
  6. tman53

    tman53 Vinyl is an Addiction

    Location:
    Pa
    I think you may be mistaken. Peter Lederman has a detailed video that describes his preference for setting anti-skate (for his carts) and I don't recall a laser disc being involved.


     
  7. FalseMetal666

    FalseMetal666 Forum Resident

    Location:
    San Francisco, CA
    He recommends a blank record which might be the only thing harder to find than a laser disc.
     
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  8. ti-triodes

    ti-triodes Forum Resident

    Location:
    NYC
    I’ve been using Side 4 of Second Winter for years. It’s the only vinyl that I know of that’s blank. Some vinyl test discs have a blank section to run the same test.
     
    RTurner likes this.
  9. Abbagold

    Abbagold Working class hero

    Location:
    World
    I'm using the blank side of Hendrix's "Radio One" from Ryko. Been using it for years now.
     
  10. Buisfan

    Buisfan Active Member

    Location:
    amstelveen holland
    Sorry, but I dont understand what your idea behind this "explanation" is.
    A proper set bias makes arm stand still.
    But this blanc disc method only works for conical styli. (my experience)
     
  11. Wayne Nielson

    Wayne Nielson Well-Known Member

    I use the blank record disc with all kinds of styli, elliptical, shibata....whatever. They all work on the disc.
     
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  12. Buisfan

    Buisfan Active Member

    Location:
    amstelveen holland
    Not good.
    Only a conical stylus on a blanc disc complies with the setting found with a testtrack.
    Other shapes dont correspondent.
    A shibata needs much more bias. When set properly with test record it will fly to the center with a blanc disc.

    I.m.o. only setting bias with a proper test record will yield the best setting for bias.
    For convenience a blanc vinyl disc is oke for a conical stylus.
     
  13. radioalien

    radioalien Well-Known Member Thread Starter

    Location:
    Washington
    I should clarify that it actually does move very slightly inward
     
  14. BillWojo

    BillWojo Forum Resident

    Location:
    Burlington, NJ
    So a laser disc works as well as a blank record. Good to know, it's easier to find a laser disc than a blank record. I see them in the thrift shops now and than, I'll be on the look out for one now.

    BillWojo
     
  15. vwestlife

    vwestlife Forum Resident

    Location:
    New Jersey, USA
    Some turntables had separate scales on the anti-skating adjustment for conical and elliptical styli, showing that at equal tracking forces, an elliptical stylus requires more anti-skating than a conical stylus:

    [​IMG]
     
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  16. TheVinylAddict

    TheVinylAddict ___The Enforcer___

    LP's that have blank sides in the set that I've used to test skate, among others

    Donald Fagen "Sunken Condos", Phish "Fuego", Joe Jackson "Grand Monde" and another Phish LP I have that also have a "blank" Side 4.

    There are a couple earlier Columbia Masterworks classical pressings (in box sets) I have that are also blank on one side, but drawing a "blank" :) right now what the name of the sets are.
     
    Aftermath likes this.
  17. 4-2-7

    4-2-7 Forum Resident

    Location:
    SF Peninsula
    No it doesn't show proper operation.
    Laser disc plastic is too soft, the stylus cuts into it, of course it's not going to move much. I only used a blank record when testing how level a air bearing tangental arm is. They don't have any anti skate so if everything is level the wand will not move on a spinning blank disc.

    One doesn't use a blank disc of anything to set anti skate unless to goal is not to have any. If that's the case set it to zero.
     
    Last edited: Aug 3, 2020
  18. 4-2-7

    4-2-7 Forum Resident

    Location:
    SF Peninsula
    Anti skate on a tonearm is a progression of opposite force generated by the records force the other direction. The speed of revolutions get greater and greater as the stylus tracks to the inner portion of the record. Anti skate applies a graduation of force greater and greater the other direction for the stylus to have equal balanced pressure to left and right walls of the groove.
     
    Last edited: Aug 3, 2020
  19. Davey

    Davey I carry the moon inside a silver bag

    Location:
    SF Bay Area, USA
    Lot of misinformation in this thread.

    But if looking for a record with a blank side, one of my favorites of the last few years is the Blackened Cities EP from Melanie De Biasio, great stuff ... What is currently spinning on your turntable?
     
  20. FalseMetal666

    FalseMetal666 Forum Resident

    Location:
    San Francisco, CA
    Figured I'd check my antiskate with one of my blank records and saw that the stylus was actually etching the blank vinyl surface.

    2.5g VTF on a Denon 103 with line contact stylus.

    Any thoughts on whether something is wrong here?
     
  21. Davey

    Davey I carry the moon inside a silver bag

    Location:
    SF Bay Area, USA
    The stylus tip will always scratch the smooth vinyl, that's expected.
     
    FalseMetal666 likes this.
  22. jupiterboy

    jupiterboy Forum Residue

    Location:
    Buffalo, NY
    Yep. I have a few blank sides. I've used this method before. IMO, it results in too much antiskate.
     
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  23. Davey

    Davey I carry the moon inside a silver bag

    Location:
    SF Bay Area, USA
    Depends what you set it to do. When the anti-skate is set so the tonearm drifts toward the center at about half the speed it would without anti-skate, seems to match pretty closely with other methods. But sure, you normally wouldn't want to make it stand still. It's mainly a functional test to make sure it works and is fairly uniform.
     
    jupiterboy likes this.
  24. TheVinylAddict

    TheVinylAddict ___The Enforcer___

    Such as? :D:cool:
     
  25. jupiterboy

    jupiterboy Forum Residue

    Location:
    Buffalo, NY
    Yes, you can make it stall out and sit, but that’s too much.
     
    Stanton56 likes this.

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