iFi AC iPurifier - Mini Review

Discussion in 'Audio Hardware' started by mds, Jan 22, 2019.

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  1. Agitater

    Agitater Forum Resident

    Location:
    Toronto
    First and foremost, as @F1nut has thankfully repeated in a number threads over the years, except for the first few months of operation after being first plugged in and used for an audio system (or anything else for that matter), in many areas with less than ideally stable AC an MOV-based surge protector is largely useless. The problem is that the MOVs themselves deteriorate in effectiveness with use. They are terrible long-term choices for protecting audio equipment.

    Second, there are lab/test bench conditions in which barely measurable benefits can be conferred from such an MOV-based surge suppressor for a parallel circuit, but it is only vaguely associated with actual protection and won’t protect audio gear connected to other circuits. The suggestion or assumption being made in this thread is that someone can plug in a surge protector anywhere in the home and it will then suck up surges to protect equipment not connected to the surge protected circuit. That does not make practical sense and it doesn’t work. Don’t risk valuable equipment on any such baseless assumption.
     
  2. Agitater

    Agitater Forum Resident

    Location:
    Toronto
    Curious. What meter did you use?
     
  3. spartree

    spartree Forum Resident

    Location:
    Canada
    Interestingly, it seems like some folks have actually experienced more noise when the iFi is plugged in. In the videos below a user tries the device with and without ground engaged.



    Was "iFi AC iPurifier" brings Radio noise?
     
  4. LakeMountain

    LakeMountain Vinyl surfer

    Location:
    Netherlands
    This looks like a strange set up. Both polarity and ground warning lights are on red. He is also not plugging in the ground on purifier itself next to the waring lights?
     
  5. Phil Thien

    Phil Thien Forum Resident

    Location:
    Milwaukee, WI
    I'm not endorsing the product, just speaking to how the devices used to make such contraptions work.

    There aren't a lot of options when it comes to products employing non-MOV suppression, and what exists has a distinctly different protection profile (vs. devices employing MOVs).

    ZeroSurge is the only seller I know of, of what could be considered plug-in consumer non-MOV protectors out there, and there is a bit of debate over their effectiveness compared to MOV-based units.

    There are MOV-based devices with replacement modules available. Though, they aren't inexpensive.
     
  6. Mojo Warrior

    Mojo Warrior Forum Resident

    Location:
    EasternSierra
    Whatever happened to Filter Chokes?
     
  7. motorstereo

    motorstereo Forum Resident

    Location:
    Ct.
  8. Agitater

    Agitater Forum Resident

    Location:
    Toronto
    Thanks. My own meter died the other day. I’m looking for a replacement. My electrical contractor who normally supplies equipment to me is shut down just like everyone else, so I’m prowling online suppliers myself.
     
  9. Agitater

    Agitater Forum Resident

    Location:
    Toronto
    MOV-based surge protectors work just fine... for 3-12 months. After that, or perhaps after a somewhat longer period of time in areas with excellent AC line stability, they have to be replaced because they’re no longer protecting anything.

    That’s the point - audiophiles with years-old surge protectors actually have unprotected audio gear. The MOV-based surge strips or blocks have worn out.
     
    F1nut and Claude Benshaul like this.
  10. Agitater

    Agitater Forum Resident

    Location:
    Toronto
    In parallel circuits, current flows to loads just as it does in series circuits. If the surge suppressor was connected in series with the panel, it might be of some use in some installations. If it’s connected in parallel, a non-associated load (e.g., an audio amp connected to some other circuit) can’t benefit from the suppressor.
     
  11. spartree

    spartree Forum Resident

    Location:
    Canada
    He’s using a cheater plug to demonstrate the effect with and without ground. At about 44 seconds into the demonstration he connects the ground and both lights turn green.
     
  12. Phil Thien

    Phil Thien Forum Resident

    Location:
    Milwaukee, WI
    Sure it can, because the varistors (voltage dependent resistors) have a resistance that is inversely proportional to voltage. Below the intended voltage, they're open. Above that voltage, they're shorts to ground.

    And the breaker to which they're attached is a 220 breaker, the device is essentially wired right across the service provided by your utility, with only a 50A (or whatever is called for) breaker between it, and the wire entering your load center.

    Don't think of them as a device that adjusts a faucet/tap to control the rate at which water fills the tub, but rather as a drain which adjusts to control how fast water empties.
     
  13. Agitater

    Agitater Forum Resident

    Location:
    Toronto
    I’m familiar with the electrical principles. It’s not a solution (theoretically or practically) that I would use or trust. In any event, that’s not how an iFi Purifier is installed. So in what such way - measurably and demonstrably - does an iFi AC Purifier work? I cannot measure any beneficial effect and I cannot hear any beneficial effect. Neither can anyone else I personally know.

    It used to be fun measuring, listening, double-checking, blind-testing and double-blind testing various audio gadgets both with and without my music listening groups over the years. There is so much junk and audio woo on the market at this point though that the whole effort has become a lot like work.

    Audiophiles should enjoy these accessories and ‘must-have’ gadgets while they can I suppose. I note that every audiophile who comes to me and other more practically-oriented people with yet another allegedly ‘unsolvable’ problem usually has a large drawer full of this sort of junk, none of which is providing even the tiniest benefit. As always, when the effect of the placebo wears off, The problem remains.

    My advice to those audiophiles who are slathering gadget salves on hum, EFI, EMI, grounding, voltage sag or surge, and other power issues is for them to stop home-brewing alleged solutions involving yet more expensive gadgets. Solve the root problem first.
     
    RolandG and Oelewapper like this.
  14. Phil Thien

    Phil Thien Forum Resident

    Location:
    Milwaukee, WI
    I guess my point all along is that, it is the same as a whole-house suppressor. Since it is 120V, it would only provide suppression to the side of the load center on which that particular circuit is wired.

    The thing is, my point all along is, it could theoretically work, not that it does work. When it comes to the practical, I agree with everything you say.

    I think it has been an informative discussion and I hope I haven't annoyed you too much because (once again) I find your posts a safe port in what normally amounts to a storm of nonsense.
     
    RolandG likes this.
  15. Agitater

    Agitater Forum Resident

    Location:
    Toronto
    Annoyed? Not a chance! IMO, your contributions are always valuable.
     
    RolandG likes this.
  16. FalseMetal666

    FalseMetal666 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Seattle, WA
    Every time I start talking myself into buying some "band-aid" I try to remind myself the money is likely better spent on hiring an electrician to fix my garbage-ass house wiring.
     
    Agitater likes this.
  17. Agitater

    Agitater Forum Resident

    Location:
    Toronto
    Replacing outlets and switches with higher quality units, balancing the load in your panel, getting rid of doubled up connections, correcting branching problems, replacing worn breakers, ensuring all switch and outlet connections are correctly polarized (and that all of the connections are the same), rerunning undergauge or overgauge cable with proper and good quality 14/3 lumex, and keeping AC runs well away from in-wall TV coax and POT copper and ethernet cabling are all part of each phase of a gradual top to bottom rewire. At the same time, panel space can be made for a whole-home surge suppression device. The nice thing about such a project is that it can be budgeted and done in several phases.

    Obviously, the first phase should be a couple of dedicated 15A circuits strictly for audio and video/TV!
     
    motorstereo likes this.
  18. LakeMountain

    LakeMountain Vinyl surfer

    Location:
    Netherlands
    You are right! I found a labtest of the iFi AC purifier in a German audio magazine confirming your statements.
    [​IMG]
    Their findings are:
    - it effectively reduces noise of ca. 9-30kHz by ca. 20-25dB, provided the ground is properly connected. This performance is roughly in line with other, more costly power filters, which they also tested.
    - without ground noise filtering reduces by ca. 10dB.
    - plugging it into the power strip (iFi Power Station with X2 capacitors) only marginally improves noisefiltering.

    The above lab results were confirmed during listening tests, some improvement without ground connected, more improvement with ground, minimal improvement when plugged into the power strip, provided you use a good quality alternative power strip.
    The iFi AC-iPurifier got a recommendation.
     
  19. Oelewapper

    Oelewapper Plays vinyl instead of installing it on the floor.

    Nice article, but in the end, the way it's measured says it all.
     
    Agitater likes this.
  20. LakeMountain

    LakeMountain Vinyl surfer

    Location:
    Netherlands
    What is wrong with the measurements?
    And measurement results could also be replicated by ear.
     
  21. Oelewapper

    Oelewapper Plays vinyl instead of installing it on the floor.

    I have no idea what's right or wrong about the measurements, because the setup is not specified no judgement can be made on that point.
    That's why good articles always specify how the test setup was built, so people know in what context and to what extent the measurements are representative for real life situations.

    With scientific articles it goes even a few steps further: they even specify the brand and type/model number of the equipment and if/when it has been calibrated and to which standards/norm.
    This not only gives the reader an idea of how the measurements apply to real life situations, but also the accuracy of the results.
     
    RolandG and Agitater like this.
  22. LakeMountain

    LakeMountain Vinyl surfer

    Location:
    Netherlands
    OK, this is fair enough, you are just withholding judgement due to a lack of info.

    The only thing I can add is that their lab set up was explained in some earlier editions as they more often test power conditioners. Unfortunately I don’t have access to these editions. However they all remain journalistic pieces and and not scientific papers.
     
    Oelewapper and bever70 like this.
  23. all24bits

    all24bits Mature Adult

    Location:
    USA
    Well, I personally can, and people I personally know can as well. Your setup and ears will vary. Sometimes it makes a difference; sometimes it doesn't. This is evident through my own testing. On one wall, it made no difference. On another wall, CLEARLY an audible difference using my test track "Come Fly With Me". Frank's vocals come out in the mix about 3-4 inches within the "virtual space". Everything seems a bit cleaner as well.

    At my workplace, it doesn't make any difference. At my friend's house, it does. In fact, he plugged it in (and I didn't even see him or know he was doing it) and immediately I looked up from the couch and asked him what he touched or fixed on the stereo --- nothing. He had plugged it into his wall and the difference was jaw dropping and immediate.

    Another buddy of mine had it, we tested it, and it made a slight difference, but nothing jaw dropping. Yes, a difference, but worth 100? No, not on his system.

    On my system and my other buddy's system? IMO, yes, the price was worth it.

    Sure, I believe you when you say it makes no difference TO YOU. [I recommend you not buy them then, and save your money for something more fun like records] But you can't prove it didn't make a difference to me and two other people. In fact, I have the receipt (no sighting experience posted above) to prove it does.
     
    LakeMountain likes this.
  24. britt2001b

    britt2001b Senior Member

    Location:
    United States
    I just purchased the ifi AC iPurifier and have been using it for almost a day. No "jaw dropping" wow moment but I have detected a couple of things that make this a worth while purchase. I've been listening to The Beatles since 1964 much of the time with headphones. I know their recordings like the back of my hand. I have always heard a graininess on the double tracked vocals and the AC Purifier smooths out the graininess a bit and I'm hearing more off mic background chatter. Also, the bass is better defined. I have to admit it's fun hearing McCartney's bass runs from their early recordings as I have always struggled to hear them before.
     
    all24bits and LakeMountain like this.
  25. mds

    mds I NEVER sell equipment! Just build another system. Thread Starter

    Location:
    PA
    No it's not jaw dropping experience, but does seem to make a difference that one can perceive.
     
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