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Marvel (MCU) Phase IV

Discussion in 'Visual Arts' started by Deuce66, Jul 21, 2019.

  1. vince

    vince Stan Ricker's son-in-law

  2. Isaac K.

    Isaac K. Forum Resident

    Not made from a white male perspective? Let’s see:

    Iron Man: white male
    Hulk: white male
    Thor: White male
    Captain America: white male
    Ant-Man: white male
    Spider-Man: White male
    Dr. Strange: White male
    Star Lord: white male

    Am I missing any main characters?

    It wasn’t until Black Panther did we get anything else. Not until the last year did we get a woman. When The Avengers was released Black Widow was the only one that was almost never featured in the toy lines or other marketing. So yeah, a little inclusion is more than due.

    When Iron Man was first released believe it or not he wasn’t all that well known either. Marvel chose him primarily because they no longer retained the rights to their big guns. All it takes to keep the MCU going is a good script and actor to fill the role.
  3. The Hermit

    The Hermit Wavin' that magick glowstick since 1976

    Nope, but you're sorely missing any rational perspective, that's for damned sure!!!

    Do you really think Feige and Marvel chose those characters because they were white males... really???

    Are you African-American, because you sound pretty bitter and aggrieved? My advice; stop listening to Spike Lee, he's doing you no favours whatsoever.

    Relax dude, be happy... take your head out of your ass and have a drink, you'll feel better for it, trust me :cool:... enough said.

    Sorry mods, there will be no further replies from me on this matter, don't worry.
    Last edited: Jul 23, 2019
    Paper Wizard likes this.
  4. Isaac K.

    Isaac K. Forum Resident

    Nope. I’m a white male. :p

    Facts are facts. I didn’t say they chose them because they’re white males, I’m saying that Hollywood has a verifiable history of making primarily films from a white male perspective. Honestly, you’re the one that is getting agitated over these details, not I. Accusing me of being African American is a little strange. I know a lot of white guys that are awfully “bitter and aggrieved”... especially when it comes to women and minorities in historically white male roles.
    Stormrider77 likes this.
  5. alexpop

    alexpop Power pop + other bad habits....

    Nick Fury is black played by S L Jackson, originally a pretty impressive white dude in the comics(at least ). My only complaint is SLJ /Fury character is boring plays it pretty straight laced. X Men had Storm played by Halle Berry. Black Panther (nuff said ) plays a sorta do gooder Captain America.
    showtaper likes this.
  6. Seeing a Phase 4 full of diversity (Black Widow - female led film, Eternals - varied race and gender of the lead cast, Shang-Chi - lead Asian actors, Thor - involving Lady Thor, Dr Strange - another white guy, Blade - black male lead), and suddenly going "hmm nope I'm out"? Suspicious.
    Stormrider77 and Isaac K. like this.
  7. Chazro

    Chazro Forum Resident

    West Palm Bch, Fl.
    Regardless of the medium, books, tv, or film, I've always hated the seemingly political correctness of pushing stereotypes. The 3 that immediately come to mind are gays, females, and blacks. If a character was originally written as a white male, why change it? If a character, like the Panther, was originally conceived as Black, why would they change him? But female Thor, female Iron Man, etc. is just creating product for a marketshare. Its cheap and exploitive. If a creator wants to write a black or female or gay character it's not a problem, just create a new character/concept, hate when they use a characters pre-existing popularity as the starting point. Its simply business, I get it. Sometimes, the 're-branding' thing actually works though, look at Supergirl, She-Hulk, and the black Spiderman. Been happening 4ever also, think of all the similar characters in the Super/Bats/Shazam families but somehow, it never felt as 'forced' or as heavy-handed as it does now!
    jpelg, dkmonroe and showtaper like this.
  8. Why not change it?
  9. Chazro

    Chazro Forum Resident

    West Palm Bch, Fl.
    Are you saying you should change something, simply because you can!?
  10. alexpop

    alexpop Power pop + other bad habits....

    Dont mind change as long as it’s best‘s earlier version. Feel sorry for the actor taking on playing Wolverine.
  11. GregM

    GregM No static at all

    Daddyland, CA
    I think your take on it is correct--the "infinity" narrative interwoven in all these films really upped the game for the entire genre and led to some truly inspired filmmaking. Just look at what DC has done during this timeframe to compare/contrast. Also supporting your observation that this run of MCU films has been something special, Stan Lee has informed the entire narrative, serving as exec producer on all films. Not to mention his hugely entertaining cameos. Sadly, he is no longer with us. This does not bode well for the next run of films, though I'm sure Disney thoroughly picked his brain over the past few years to help flesh out the next narrative.

    You must be very pleased as a matter of routine. It always cracks me up when those kinds of stones are cast from the most breakable glass houses, e.g., surrounded by beatles, south park, and other white bread material. One can sleep soundly at night knowing the PC police like you are on the job. Certainly if someone doesn't sing the praises of Black Panther from various ivory towers they must surely be racist!
  12. Isaac K.

    Isaac K. Forum Resident

    Yes, but Nick Fury and Storm are supporting characters. They aren’t the leads. Also, the MCU seems to be more drawn from the Marvel Ultimate books and in those Nick Fury is black (and also used SLJ as the model in a keen use of foresight). I already mentioned Black Panther. Just because there are black people in movies doesn’t change the reality of a white male perspective in these films.
    alexpop likes this.
  13. Ken_McAlinden

    Ken_McAlinden MichiGort Staff

    Livonia, MI
    I believe he is saying why accept it as a limitation if it is of no real importance.
    Stormrider77, Isaac K. and BeatleJWOL like this.
  14. Correct. Again, this is all about representation.
  15. Chazro

    Chazro Forum Resident

    West Palm Bch, Fl.
    Let's not forget the inherent white POV in tales like Paul Bunyon, Tom Thumb, & Johnny Appleseed! Its not important! Lets change it all!!!;) This line of reasoning is silly, and dangerous!
  16. Sometimes there's a John Henry to every Paul Bunyan. Sometimes there's not. Correcting that imbalance isn't wrong.

    Dangerous to who?
    dprokopy likes this.
  17. alexpop

    alexpop Power pop + other bad habits....

    Yes! It’s kinda of sad that. Changing slowly ( too slowly).
  18. Isaac K.

    Isaac K. Forum Resident

    Did they not feel forced? Or do you feel differently because those characters pre-date you? Just wondering, but I can easily see people complaining about Supergirl and She Hulk 50 years ago, too.

    The thing that gets me about this sexism/racism when it comes to modern choices in who gets to wear the costumes is this thing has been happening for decades. Something like four different white guys other than Steve Rogers had been Captain America before Sam Wilson, but only now it is a problem even though he makes the most logical sense being one of Cap’s oldest friends in the comics. And something tells me that there would have been far less of an outcry had they given the hammer to alien male Beta Ray Bill rather than already established character Jane.
    BeatleJWOL likes this.
  19. showtaper

    showtaper Concert Hoarding Bastard

    She will probably be Korean and married to Captain Marvel. :D:D:D:D
    alexpop likes this.
  20. Already have a lady Wolverine-type character covered in the comics: Laura Kinney (Earth-616)
  21. alexpop

    alexpop Power pop + other bad habits....

    SLJ /Fury was fleshed out more in Captain Marvel. But..he should have loads of gizmos like the silver age comics Nick Fury, and K.A. more!!!! Must be frustrating for the actors character, always in the background.
    Isaac K. likes this.
  22. alexpop

    alexpop Power pop + other bad habits....

    Modern world. Will Disney ok it. :D
    showtaper likes this.
  23. Isaac K.

    Isaac K. Forum Resident

    Yeah, one of his best scenes is his Super car in Winter Soldier!
    alexpop likes this.
  24. alexpop

    alexpop Power pop + other bad habits....

    He needs his own film.
  25. Ken_McAlinden

    Ken_McAlinden MichiGort Staff

    Livonia, MI
    Fox had a version of her in the "Logan" movie, too, of course.
    BeatleJWOL likes this.

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