I upsample most of the time to the highest integer I with HQplayer using the Sinc M filter. One of my favorites. Streaming Qobuz through Roon. I also use the headroom feature to avoid oversample overs. Around -2db
No external drives or NAS? I’m just trying to understand the use of Roon in your environment. Are you using a separate license HQ Player. Trying to differentiate how the two are playing together before your dac based on conversations and threads I’ve read from other HQ/Roon users. At the end of day- what area of improvement do you expect from your dac?
some of the very best dacs available use ESS chips, they can be implemented very well (with good power and analog output stages)
Seems like the Marantz doesn't want to go anywhere! Seriously though, I think the lines are blurred as these DAC's are more like preamplifiers than HT receivers. If it handles all of your sources and has volume control, it's a preamp!
Since you've dipped into HQP, Have you messed with Sinc-M vs Mx? I haven't spent more than a couple songs with either so I have no opinion between them yet.
Sinc M is probably the most special filter in the batch and worth the price of HQplayer alone IMHO the DSD portion hasn’t had me convinced tho. It sounds softer and wider and a bit bigger. But it loses depth and weight. I think I am hearing distortion in DSD. Everyone will say that DSD starts to shine at 256. But that takes a ton of processing power and I’m not convinced enough about DSD to have to get a new computer to do all that work. but the PCM filters really make a difference. @Archimago has done many tests and measurements with HQplayer , you should look them up. Really good stuff he has done.
I just found a YouTube review of the Gustard R26 by Currawong. He has ears and reviews I reasonably trust. Interesting review that attempts to place the R26 within the R-2R DAC hierarchy. It comes across as component but not a giant killer. Leaves me thinking that if I do consider a Gustard R-2R that I should wait and see if they do a model that is one level up from the R26 (and will obviously cost more). But otherwise neat. And I like that the network input was one of the preferred inputs. That makes it easy to integrate with Roon or with JRiver (using DLNA).
From most people whom I trust including myself with the Venus II , R2R DACs are smooth and soft. A bit of pipe and slippers. If you like that then cool
The lesser R-2R DACs can be like that. But certainly not all. And it also depends on whether the R-2R DACs to NOS or oversampling. The NOS favors are the ones that tend to smooth and soft. The oversampling flavors can be whatever flavor you want depending on the oversampling filter. From hard and pumping to smooth and soft.
@Tone? .. curious if you've heard the MHDT Lab Pagoda? It uses dual PCM1704 chips (24/192), NOS, no op-amps, no feedback, no filters, and tube buffered. I used HQPlayer for a couple of years with this DAC and found the pairing outstanding. (Obviously it isn't capable of higher bit/sample rates than 24/192.) IMO the Pagoda isn't tube-y or soft, not pipe and slippers, but dynamic, detailed and natural. I hear MHDT also created a new iteration of the Pagoda, the Oolong, but I haven't seen anything in the wild as of yet. Might be worth checking out. Good luck with your search.
The subject of DACs is really interesting because there are so many available now from $100 to crazy $$$$. I've never owned a DAC that cost more than $500 and have been happy with all of them except one, a Topping D50s Sabre DAC. A really well constructed little $250 DAC but it just didn't work for me.
That’s funny! I’ve never looked at R2R/NOS as being too overly relaxed but rather more “level” and (depending upon the manufacturer) excellent at reproducing the finer details without the “glare” that accompanies other overly bright sounding designs. When listening to how DAC’s play their part in the presentation I’ve noticed some chips/circuits are set up for party mode- overly punchy low end with extended highs. Very similar to the overblown presentation you’d get while watching a movie but with less dynamic range. I prefer a more “analog” presentation as long as the fine details and presence are preserved.
The DSD measurements need to be updated using modulators with the EC suffix. It is easy to hear the extra noise in ASDM7 without the EC. No surprise regarding the results. I'd like to see EC vs ECv2 as well. The other thing I've found is that the modulators only run on 1 core for me. The upsampling runs across many. The most I can get out of my i9-10900 cpu is ASDM7EC to 256. It will get to ASDM7 512 but without the EC the noise is bothersome. What I've read is you need an i9-12900 cpu to get EC to 512. I'm not sure which options I prefer after changing DACs so I'm still playing around. BTW, I set HQP to -6db instead of the standard -3db. Partially because it is safer, partially because my system has more gain than needed and the high output of this DAC becomes a nuisance.
You need not more than -3db. Anything over that and you are losing out on dynamic range. And when you oversample , intersample overs are very rare. They happen at low but rates. Read John Siaus article on it. I set mine to -2db and nothing lights up showing me I’m hitting distortion. The recording has to be pretty bad and low rates 44.1, 48 I just don’t see it for DSD yet on my equipment. It’s a much different sound that’s for sure. But from what I’ve read it has time domain limits which PCM is much better at. that’s why I think I don’t hear the depth in DSD as I do with PCM. Not nearly the depth
If the oversampling filter is also pipe and slippers then that is an indication that they need to use a better oversampling filter with more taps and better math. Or bypass the internal oversampling and use HQPlayer to do the better oversampling filter.
I used HQplayer filters with it to no avail. Same thing. Just the filters don’t make up the sound sig
Denafrips NOS isn't really NOS so it might still be getting some of its own upsampling flavor while in NOS mode. You would probably need to feed it either its max or native resolution to bypass most of what they do. Even max accepted input can sometimes be oversampled internally. That is one of the benefits of T+A and Holo. Their NOS is true NOS so they don't add anything to what HQP would send them when in NOS mode.
Yes this is true. It is not true NOS. it’s just a different filter which resembles NOS. but I do run HQplayer on my Marantz HD DAC1 with great results. Jussi from HQplayer has the same DAC although he doesn’t use it now. He uses T+A and holo stuff. As well as RME. Which I don’t like. Plus he love loves DSD. I just can’t see that as a musician of 40 years. I’m not hearing the allure of DSD.
It's really puzzling to me that you have this perception of R2R. I have found R2R DACs to consistently be more engaging than delta-sigma DACs. Both my various Audio Note DACs with AD1865 and an Abbas DAC with a TDA1541 were much more musical than my Meitner DACs as well as the Accustic Arts DAC I had before that. Common for all of them though was that garbage in = garbage out. The quality of the bit stream (analog squarewave) is vital. So much so that based on my experiences I would advice on spending AT LEAST as much on this as on the DAC itself.
Are you using the EC modulators? I used to be happy with the results of my previous DSD DAC using Sinc-Gausse varieties to DSD128. Now I'm not so sure. I do prefer Sinc-Ext2 to DSD256 much better than Gausse to DSD256 with this DAC. so far I'm less enthused with with the Sinc-M or Mx via PCM705 and 1.4m but still have some playing to do.
I see Generalizations and assumptions. AVR bashing is getting quite lame. Many sound just fine and this idea that "Separates" sound far better is often perpetuated by those just wanting to bash them for no real reason. I own a couple, not even in my profile (Yamahas) and they are great for what they are.
Since you like Marantz, have you thought about buying a used Marantz SACD KI-Ruby or SA-10 and using its DAC via the coax or optical input. Both have excellent analog sections.
I actually have thought about it , but it’s DSD conversion. Something I’m not so crazy about. I might try one , one day. Or the SACD 30n which has the same tech. thanks man
