My vintage McIntosh MX-110 preamp surprised me today. Follow up post #61!

Not sure about Robby's record collection, but I noticed the following in Ray Manzarek's 1964 UCLA student film Evergreen (which was filmed in Ray's apartment):

• The Jazz Crusaders "Lookin' Ahead" LP: Pacific Jazz Records (1962)
• Empire 398 turntable
• Harmon Kardon A700 integrated tube amplifier

 

Crazy, who is the guy in the video?

 

I believe it was Ray who had rented that beach house and The Doors used it as a rehearsal space. The owner must have been audiophile.

 

I just purchased a MC110z in need of restoration. Cosmetics are fine, with light corrosion and rust that is not deep and will clean up well. The face, lettering, and knobs are excellent. Dial glass will need replacement however.

Other than Terry DeWick, and Audio Classics, who else is recommended for restoration work ?

I have a 225 and 240 in need of restoration also.

Thanks.

 

Bill Thalmann is superb- he is located in Virginia. He restored a Technics SP-10, did the Krebs mod to the turntable, and restored a pair of Quad II amps for me, in addition to working on the MX 110z. The shop is pretty impressive- crammed with keyboard instruments, hi-fi, a lot of it high-end gear. Bill was the tech director at Conrad Johnson for a long time. Also pretty reasonably priced and pleasant man to deal with. Serious operation he's got there, and I don't think I'm alone in my high regard for him and his work.

 

Bill restored my Fisher 500B about 10 years ago, maybe more. Great fellow, and interesting to talk with. And he knows his business.

 

Steve, great post, thank you. I'm considering buying a used MX110z and an MC240 (per your rec), I have a denon 103r MC cart with the Denon 62lp, would I need a SUT?

Also, it seems like I should just dive in and make the purchase!

 

The input sensitivity of the MX110 phono stage is 3 mV.

That means you would want to present a cartridge with an output voltage rating of 3 mV or more to the MX110 phono input stage to achieve optimal performance.

The Denon 103R only has an output voltage of 0.25 mV. This is insufficient to drive the MX110 phono stage to its true potential (optimal signal to noise ratio).

You have two options when using a Denon 103R MC with the MX110:

• Option 1: Step Up Transformer (SUT) to the phono input
• Option 2: Outboard phono preamp with moving coil (MC) capability fed to either the Aux or Tape Monitor (line level)

Since you have two phono inputs, on the MX110, try the 103R with SUT in one input for your best records.

And if you want to have fun, get a second table and try a Shure M-447 on the other phono input. Not the last word in fidelity (the 103R is more refined), but the M447 is sort of the "Volkswagen bug" of vintage cartridges. It does a lot of things well in a workmanlike way. You can easily swap out the N447 for the 78 stylus and the tracking force, alignment and arm height remains constant. It's good for vintage LP records, 45s and 78s that are not in the best of condition. Jico Japan sells quality replacement Shure styli now that the Shure phono division is defunct. And with a whopping 9.5mV of output, you can plug it directly into the phono input without a SUT.

 

I'm running a Franken-Denon 103 into the MX 110z via a fairly inexpensive step up. Here are the details, including in a footnote, a link to the fellow that makes the step up as a complete product. Running as my second system, through old Quad ESLs, quite wonderful: https://thevinylpress.com/a-phono-bargain-or-three/

 

You have two options when using a Denon 103R MC with the MX110:

• Option 1: Step Up Transformer (SUT) to the phono input
• Option 2: Outboard phono preamp with moving coil (MC) capability fed to either the Aux or Tape Monitor (line level)

@Bill Hart I have a Sim Audio Moon 310 and 320s power supply, would that work for option 2?

 

The 31o has MC capability and RCA phono plug line outputs. It appears it would work OK with the MX110.

Input sensitivity of the MX110 AUX in is 300 mV.

 

Thanks for your help Steve! I'm trying to figure out if I'm the type of guy to spend 5k plus time/energy on a second system, just to hear the vintage Mcintosh sound!

 

I think if you want to truly appreciate the MX-110/MC-240 setup, you'll want to use the all-tube phono preamp section in that MX-110. I would recommend going for a high-end MM cartridge instead of a step-up phono preamp. I'd recommend looking at the Ortofon 3M Black.

 

That makes a lot of common sense, which, by your location, is no surprise. Signed, a Waterville Panther living on the west coast

 

He could still use the MX110 phono stage by feeding the DL-103r into a SUT. The SUT basically boosts the MC signal to a MM level and allows the MX110 phono stage to do the rest.

A DL103r is a superb cartridge but requires a 2.5g tracking force and favors a broadcast type arm. Think Empire 980 or ROK S-320.

 

Does a SUT downgrade the quality of the signal, and therefore sound?

 

If you want to go the high end MM route with a Japanese direct drive and lower mass arm, consider an AT line contact cart.

 

There are people who swear by the SUT and MC combo. Google CINEMAG.

 

By the way, if you want to pair the MX110 with a vintage table that performs, those 1960s Empire turntables perform! This would be an ideal vintage table, and the Empire 98/980 arm is a mass/compliance match for your DL-103R.

 

Hi, Garth. I'm not familiar with the Sim Audio pieces, I can certainly look them up, but I'm a little unclear of context here. Do you also have an MX 110z?* If so, are you talking about bypassing the phono stage in the McI piece? I was pretty surprised how good the MX110z was-- including its phono stage-- with a sympathetic restoration and good NOS tubes. The SUT that I noted was cheap and efficacious, seems to work very well with the Denon 103; it has several different loading options with the repositioning of a couple of switches.
*NB-sorry, i just realized you had earlier asked about using the Denon 103r and were contemplating the McI piece. I think it is a terrific sounding piece, and a relative bargain considering the market for good sounding vintage tube preamps, some of which I owned back in the day.

 

Garth. I have a Thorens TD-124 with SME 3009 II improved tonearm. The Shure V15 type IV, V, VMR or Ortofon 2M Black or Bronze MM cartridges into the MX110z sound incredible. I have tried some MC cartridges into my Mac and decided they did not have the sound I wanted. Sometimes we don't know what we have until we try something else. The phono section on the MX110z has a deep, full tone I love.

 

@Steve Hoffman Thanks for your detailed thread dating back to 2011, based on that I decided to obtain the MX110z (from a forum member) and the MC240 from a Mcintosh expert, he's cleaning up the 240 (upgrading caps/new connector posts) so I'll have both of them in a few weeks. I just purchased a Parks Audio SUT (ten) from a forum member as well. So, I'll get to have the vintage, tube Mcintosh sound soon and will let you know all about it!

 

So you bought a solid state step up amplifier? That seems counter-intuitive to getting a full tube system.

Again, if you want to get pure tube, you really need to get a nice MM cartridge or failing that, an external tube preamp to feed into the tape input. When I had an MX-110/MC-240 setup, I fed the MM input with my MM Ortofon 2M Black cartridge and I think it sounded very nice.

 

@bresna- I don't know anything about Parks Audio products other than having heard of the brand, but if @Garthb bought a step up transformer under that brand (which I gather uses the Cinemag transformers) he may not be using a 'solid state step up amplifier' - only transformers, which - I suppose you can characterize as solid state and do 'amplify' in the sense that they increase voltage, but aren't 'solid state...amplifiers' in the conventional sense of that term (a 'head amp' or pre-preamp would be more like a conventional amplifier). I use the blue Cinemag transformers into my MX110z to good effect as an 'on the cheap' solution to accommodate low output moving coils in my vintage system; my main system relies on a far more involved tube phono stage with built in SUTs. I wouldn't characterize either as 'solid state amplifiers' in the conventional sense- they are transformers with little else to them.
These were around back in the day as a way to deal with low output moving coils, typically do not add noise and range from the cheap to the very esoteric. I don't think using a step up transformer does violence to the notion of a tube signal path, though I suppose there are arguments against using them. (I did have one tube phono stage with both transformers and adjustable gain on the MM input side and found that the MM inputs were better sounding but that was specific to that component).