Curious how you’re going to use the amps. You say bi-amping … aha, I assume you’d follow the manual, using one amp per side. Seems like a cool experiment. Don’t know if anyone else here has tried it …
Yes, if I do this I will follow the manual using one amp per side. Need to call Parasound to make sure of the proper way to hook up my 2 Rel subs at the same time. Also looks like I can’t use standard XLR cables. Either go with RCA or use XLR Y cables. Just wondering if it will be worth it or not sonically.
Teag, I've been toying with the idea for decades of tri-amping my speakers. The 21+ to the woofers and a pair of 23+s for mids and tweeter with a Marchandelec XM 44 electronic splitting the signal 3 ways. Let us know if this is worth doing. Bypassing the passive crossover network has its advantages for sure.
Wow, that’s taking things pretty far! Having a 23+ on the tweeters seems a bit excessive TBH. Bypassing the passive Xover is a very big leap as well, seems one is becoming the speaker designer. Hopefully the active crossover uses super premium parts and has controls for frequencies, slopes, and other important parameters (phase) … PS: if you’re still using the Pioneer P-580 speakers, they seem very interesting and special indeed. Best of luck with your journey.
I remember having read once that 2x A23's didn't sound as good as one by someone who tried it. But it's an interesting experiment so do try it and give us some feedback please!
I contacted Parasound support via email with a few questions about bi-amping the A23+. Specifically I asked: "I have been enjoying the A23+. So much so that I just bought another A23+ and want to try bi-amping! I read the instructions and I understand the speaker wiring for bi-amping. Not sure about the input wiring. The instruction is not clear where the input from the preamp goes. Do you have a diagram of how to wire the inputs into the back of the 2 amps? I may do XLR or may do all RCA. Please let me know - thanks for your help." Here is the unfortunate reply from Parasound support: "Hello, PARASOUND is no longer advising end users regarding set up related inquires. Please contact your Parasound dealer for further assistance. -Parasound Service" Looks like the bad effects of the company being sold have started.
For vertical bi-amping, you just need to get your IC to both channels of one A23. You can use a female to double male Y adapter cable. These are available in RCA or XLR. Plug your IC into the adapter, and plug the adapter cables into the right & left input. Or you can run an RCA interconnect to either the right or left input, and use a short interconnect from that channel's "loop" output to the input of the other channel. I would go for the Y cable myself, just so that both sides of the amp are seeing equal length of cable. Probably not necessary, except for my OCD.
Thank you for this information. Makes total sense now. Most likely I will buy a new set of 1M RCA interconnects to go from the preamp to the amps, and 2 new sets of .5M interconnects to go from the loop output to input of each amp. I currently use Kimber Silver Streak and will probably stay with that model. I appreciate your help.
You're welcome! Please let us know how it works out when you get a chance. You might ask Kimber what a pair of Silver Streak Y Cables would cost you.
That’s a complete 180 in the level of customer support they provided in the past. I guess we shall see what the future holds.
not dissatisfied with the JC5, just a personal preference based on how it and the a21+ sounded in my system. to my ears after extensive testing the a21+ sounded closer to my reference pass labs xa25 than the JC5 did. i did not need the additional power the JC5 has either. The a21+ is a heck of an amp as its &3500 retail would suggest. In other systems the JC5 could sound better especially when driving more demanding speakers in larger rooms, similar to what the JC1 mono blocks would do over the JC5.
i did, the a21 sounds slightly dryer and at the same time less transparent than the a21+ and possibly a touch less refined. the a21+ seems more dynamic too. its a great amp.
My position on this is that people that can afford a JC5 try both. I would guess that the JC5 would sound better to most, but certainly not all people. System synergy is a tricky thing. People hear differently, have different electronics and speakers, listening rooms and preferences. For some people this might result in an A21+ sounding better to them. Don't trust my recommendations or avanti1960's. Use them as a starting point for gear to audition and see what sounds better to your ears.
Actually, based on exactly what you said *do* trust yours and avanti's inputs, and still use that as the starting point as you said. I fully believe avanti when he states his findings in his system with his ears. But also believe that it's possible I might hear it different in mine. I own an A21, and honestly would not be at all surprised that Parasound made a concerted attempt to make the A21+ sound better, and could have well succeeded. (it's not always the case). Whether everybody hears that the same way, it's just not possible, and once people realize that it makes it hard to argue or doubt someone else's experience. Whether I can hear that change in my system, with my ears, my experience and my cabling, other things that affect sound - that's where it can start to be tough to measure and draw definitive conclusions, and gets interesting when one doesn't hear it that way. But I still can "trust" what you and avanti are hearing. With the gear we discuss at times, if you step way back and look at class / price range we're dealing with, it's a "better, best" thing, something the majority of the people on earth would not be able to detect a difference, nor really care. (and probably think we're nuts for spending that much). The "differences" we're hearing can be over-stated in the bigger picture, and in reality it's more subtle, something a trained ear like many here have can detect. (but most can't). It's important to keep that in perspective. When I asked the question above, I was being a wise guy... avanti knew it, but you know what - he answered honestly anyway, shrugged off my attempt and answered with what he's heard. But I think partially it's because he agrees with what I'm saying, and knows we're all going to hear it differently and said "here's my feedback, take it or leave it, hope you're big enough to live with it as my experience." That's how it should be. And I respect that, as much as I respect others who can live with his experience and opinion. And it's possible even that he's right too - he's got a fair amount of experience, and has been right before.
well said. i have run into this before where there was a cost vs sound performance dichotomy. it was like this component is cooler, more expensive and does great things and i should keep it even though the less expensive component sounds more enjoyable overall? that understanding would haunt me every time.
Sometimes more expensive just means different and not necessarily better.Amp tech is pretty mature...getting great performance doesn't always have to break the bank right?
So then in AZ where I live, with tax, happiness would cost me about $3814. Better be free shipping though. My problem is it's that $3500 times 3 or 4 because I didn't get it right the first time. Happiness can be elusive (and expensive) - I guess I still can sell the other amps to recover some of my happiness.
Richard definitely spoiled us! But the response is understandable, if they don't know then why attempt giving misinformation.
