Phono amp upgrade

If you do decide to test drive the Moon...and have some XLR's around...the unit does keep both outputs active.
So it is EZ to compare with a button push of your amp's remote to hear the difference.
IIRC, it is adverted as a 6db increase with the XLR's, I found that it did not result in increased volume but in a more vibrant presentation.
Perhaps the increase was across the frequency range?
But then, other pre's also offer balanced outputs. Not suggesting Moon is the be all/end all.

 

The JC3+ does this too - I like that feature - I leave both XLR and RCA hooked up, and if playing a cartridge with higher output, have the option of flipping over to the RCA to lower the gain.

Does the Moon also provide higher gain on XLR? The JC3+ has a "+6 Db" on XLR vs RCA. (many pre's do that). But not all do - my C-27 gain is about the same for XLR and RCA so they compensated. Both the JC3+ and C-27 are true balanced designs - is the Moon, just curious?

 

And I'm not dismissing the SPL, it's not something I'm really interested in trying, but does have some rather novel and interesting features at this price point, including the high voltage (+/- 60V) discrete opamp modules they use throughout the line, and the beefy built-in analog power supplies. I'd rather put my money toward a product from an audiophile company where I know the designer(s) spent long hours tweaking the circuits in the listening room to get it just right, but that doesn't mean you can't buy great sounding professional gear too, it just means the chances are probably lower if you are looking for some of the audiophile properties that we spend a lot of time talking about around here...

 

here's the site that first had them for sale- looks like they are dropping the line as there are no "new" models available...

Search - spl

 

Yes, 6db gain on the Moon.

 

Things like you mentioned are things that most of us don't have the background to catch (me included) and why I always appreciate your perspective / eye given your experience in these areas!

 

why would you buy a cartridge that needs "softening" ? the chinook is not the answer to "soften" anything .

 

Figured...... interesting on my Accuphase C-27 -- I just tested RCA vs XLR again by changing inputs and the RCA is actually a tad higher on Db than on the XLR! Like I said, I read somewhere that Accuphase compensates to level the two off - but not 100% sure. Heck I am not 100% sure in the first place why the 6 Db gain exists on many....... maybe Davey can help us shed light on this topic.

I will assume the Moon is a true balanced design at this price point..... note that not all are, not everyone is aware that just because an XLR port exists that it does NOT mean the design is a true balanced one.......

 

the "moon" is slightly brighter and leaner than neutral FYI.

 

With a balanced connection, the voltage output is doubled (+6dB), but depends on the input circuits as to what happens next.

 

That might be a subjective call.
I find it is what you feed it.

 

good point. Michael Fremer called the Lehmann Black Cube SEII "bright" sounding too yet when I ran it on my old VPI with an Audio Technica ART9 cartridge it was warm and bassy all day long with no trace of brightness.

 

The parasound jc3 would be nice but unless I can find one used it's out of my price range.
Be interesting to see what music direct has to say with the options they carry.
Not much feed back about the luxman. Seems very versatile.

 

Whenever I looked at buying in the $1500 - $3000 range (which I have bought a few in that range now) the Moon 310LP always fell off my short list because of the lack of user reviews compared to other choices like the 20/20 and JC3+ and a couple more. (of course there are always forum posts and pro reviews). In addition (and as a result) a thin resale market and they can take a 40-50% haircut on resale.

But on the bright side, OP - you can get a used one for a great price potentially if you are sold on this choice!

 

You may know this - but you would be looking for JC3+ (note the plus) -- the original JC3 WOULD be in your price range ($1500), but I would not get that personally - lacks loading options, gain is a little funny on MC..... it was a great introductory unit, but the 3+ trumps it.

The JC3+ typically sells at 20-30% haircut off retail when used --- you can find them, they come up fairly often. Like I said I stole mine -- the seller wanted $2250 but I talked then down and got a smoking deal. It is not out of the question to land one in the $2000 - $2250 range - look at HiFiShark past sales -- one of those is actually mine!

 

But in closing -- OP -- your plan on trying them out side by side is best --- you may find totally different findings and end up with something completely different. Not everyone likes the 20 /20 or the JC3+ or the Moon 310LP...... that is the beauty of the phono pre market we all find different things. As you can tell I think the JC3+ is a great choice in comparison --- but it is also $3K retail new and maybe not a fair comparison.

 

Once I've had a chat with MD I'll let you know my findings

 

Who says you have to end up with only one anyway?

EDIT - btw, what does MD have to do with your choice - are you going to see what they have in stock? Are you limiting to what they carry?

 

I believe the main reason was to get info/opinion on the SPL.

 

They carry the Moon, Luxman, Sutherland and SPL. They have a 60 day return period. Pretty safe buying from them

 

Ok so after a lengthy conversation with Music Direct he recommended the Sutherland first then the SPL. The Luxman and Moon he said are both excellent amps but maybe not best suited to the Lyra.
Now this is his opinion, right or wrong.
So I decided to order both and return one I don't like.
Fun times ahead.

 

Well, if we knew you were going to ultimately take the first opinion / recommendation of a sales associate at MD, you could have saved us a lot of time! Gotta be honest, when buying higher end gear I personally take all of the inputs from sales associates at a places like MD with a grain of salt...... and definitely not the deciding vote, but everyone views it differently.

Either way - best of luck - the good news of all the products mentioned here you hopefully won't be unhappy. BTW, you were aware that the 20/20 power supplies are two (2) laptop-type wallwarts, right? It is not something apparent to many as it is not pictured anywhere, and was a surprise to me when I was shopping them when I found out. It was the reason the 20/20 fell off my short list....... I don't like it when $2K+ gear uses wallwarts, and two of them is something I did not want to deal with. (you can see them in this pic). Sutherland 20/20 - Photo1809991 If you knew that then no worries, just sharing as again it was a surprise to me.

Note you can spend an addition $500 and get an external power supply in a chassis -- but now you are pushing $3K for the Sutherland with that addition. I always found the marketing for the external power supply interesting --- they say in so many words that the original with the wall warts "doesn't need it" --- well, then why did they make it? Bottom line - of course a real power supply is better than a wall wart......... something to consider.

 

The nice thing buying with MD is I can return them both if necessary.
The double wall wart is a pain but if it sounds as good as they say, and it is a universally loved amp, then the upgrade isn't a big deal.
The SPL is going to be interesting. He liked it said it's just not a familiar brand over here.

 

Reading SPL website and they are a really interesting company.
Around 30 years based in Germany and produce mastering studio gear.
The Phonos comes from there Professional Fidelity line.
Hopefully they continue the proud German tradition of excellent build quality.
Really am excited to hear this amp with not a great deal known about it on here.
Hopefully a hidden gem

 

This is from the Master Switch best phono amps 2019. Gives a little more detail on the product.

A Close Second
2. SPL Phonos ProFi MM/MC ($1,999)

MM / MC: Both
Cartridge Capacitance Range: 150, 220, 330 pF.
Input Gain Range: Fixed or Variable (50 - 71.5dB)
Impedance Range: 10 - 1,200Ω
What We Like: Design, audio quality and user control over impedance and capacitance.
What We Don't: No XLR outs.

SPL is one of the most recognizable names in the audio industry, and they single-handedly revolutionised transient processing (think punch) with their Transient Designer line. We mention that since, for vinyl audio in particular, transient detail is king. A brief glance at the ProFi front shows the two most desired audiophile phono stage requirements - user definable control over input capacitance and impedance (both explained in our Buying Advice below). This, plus the fact that the ProFi can accept signals from both MM and MC type cartridges guarantees that this impressively specced phono stage can handle any vinyl era.

Despite not featuring balanced outputs, there are three user-definable settings for line output gain, including the -10dB and the pro-level +4dB options. The main reason for the ProFi’s incredible gain readings and audio fidelity is SPL’s VOLTAiR technology, employing an unusually high voltage, which brings the benefits of an increased dynamic range. The Phonos ProFi is more pricy than the Pro-Ject RS, at number five on this list, which offers similar impedance/capacitance control. Although this model features fewer settings, SPL have really managed to nail the most useful settings and still win in terms of sonics. This phono stage can become the beating heart of a super-versatile vinyl setup, dragging those vintage records screaming right into the 21st century.