Quad 99 Pre with Denon 301mk2 - Add a Lounge LCR, Copla or something else?

Hi everyone. Looking for some advice.

I currently have a Quad 99 preamp that has a MC phono stage built in. I am using a Technics 1210 mk 2 turntable with upgraded tonearm (The Wand 9 inch) and upgraded cardas tonearm wiring and a Denon 301 mk2 MC cartridge. This feeds a Class D Audio SDS470C power amp to drive Monitor Audio Silver 8 speakers.

I have begun to wonder if my setup is not ideal to get the most out of my cartridge. The Denon is well balanced but many claim it improves with closer to 300 ohms of loading (the instructions say greater than 100 ohms ideal, the quad 99 is 100 ohms). This got me thinking. Is the Quad 99 phono section very good? Could I be getting more from my cartridge if I used an external phono stage? Would my Denon perform much better with closer to the ideal calculation of 330 ohms? I searched around and didn't find any definitive answers but did stumble across the Lounge Audio LCR and Copla which have rave reviews.

So my current thoughts are one of the following options:
1. Purchase a Copla on its own and use that to boost the loading of the 301mk2 into the MM stage of the Quad 99 preamp and hopefully see an improvement.
2. Purchase a Copla and LCR and use those instead of my Quads phono stage. Problem is I do not know if this will be a move upwards or sideways, as the Quad is meant to have a pretty good phono stage built in.
3. Save my dollars and purchase a more expensive phono stage, perhaps second hand, in the $600 to $800 range that will definitely better my Quads internal phono and the LCR as well.

Any ideas, thoughts or opinions on any of these ideas would be most appreciated. I am looking for improved detail, soundstage and analog goodness. Pretty much the next step forward so to speak.

Thanks.

 

Bumping this - surprised nobody answered.

I admit I have never used a Quads and cannot attest to the quality of the built-in phono stage, but do own two LCR's and a Copla and can attest to those. I also own two SL-1200's and have used them with the LCR and a DL-110, AT-440mlb and Nagaoka MP-110. Interestingly I cannot recall ever running either of my SL-1200's with the Copla paired with the LCR though. I'll have to address that in the coming weeks and try it!

The LCR and Copla have both undergone improvement iterations over the years, and today's models are very, very good for the price. (that's no secret, I am sure you are considering them due to all the positive press). I would confidently say the 2018 version of the LCR is better than the 2013 model.... probably won't get too much argument there. Good news is that for those that might feel slighted by the fact their LCR is 4 or 5 years old - no need to fret - Robert (Lounge proprietor) is now offering an upgrade path on many of his units for a small fee to take advantage of said improvements. Many have done that, there is a thread here on the board of testimonials to said upgrades.

Robert just upgraded both my LCR and Copla with silver wire on the PS and grounds, and some higher end caps and the performance noticeably improved. If you decide to get the LCR and / or Copla be sure and ask about the upgrades... I think it adds to the cost of the base $300 units, but I for one will attest that it is well worth it.

BTW, I had a conversation with Robert the other day, and I recall him mentioning the 301 Mkii as one of his cartridges, so he may have paired it already. Worth a check.

Either way, I don't think you will regret investing in the LCR / Copla - IMHO you would struggle to find anything that will run LOMC in solid state as well, especially at that price point. The is a reason so many here on the Hoff own one, I would go as far as saying it is the "un-official" phono preamp under $750. Can you tell I like mine? It is also fair to say I have compared them to many (check my profile) before settling on the LCR - I went through extensive comparison to the Schiit Mani, Vincent Pho 8, Cambridge 651p, Hagerman Bugle just to name a few.

"Analog goodness," as you put it, is an investment of both time and money, and to me there is a minimum investment before it pays off.... and you are in the right territory IMHO.

 

Thanks very much for the response VinylAddict, seems like the LCR/Copla is the way to go. Think I will get in touch with Robert and get his thoughts on the 301mk2 pairing with his gear. I suppose my only problem is that I have nothing to compare the Quad phono stage to. When I first got the preamp I was blown away by the clarity, midrange and lower end oomph it gave vinyl. I can definitely hear the differences between pressings and there is an obvious difference to a digital source as well, although I am not sure which I prefer (digital is more clean and clinical, vinyl is warmer but with less stereo imaging ability).

I will keep investigating... Might pay to do the upgrades incrementally. Start with the copla and see what that does on its own, then add the LCR at a later date.

Would you say the LCR gold is worth the upgrade over the normal LCR if I am not too interested in the headphone amp side of things? Is the LCR gold a better phono stage?

 

You are very welcome, just offering my opinion from my personal experience - as you know these decisions can be heavily weighted by one's own system, how nicely components play together, your own ears, preferences, etc But you have one man's long-winded opinion!

This I won't conjecture - I have never owned a Gold, have not seen many testimonials --- I recall last year talking to Robert about the Gold briefly before buying the LCR. I would talk to him, even about standalone Copla with your unit --- he might have some thoughts! I can say one thing, if it is touted to be "better" than it probably is given the Lounge track record, but how much, where I am not the go-to. Maybe someone else with a Gold can chime in.

 

Hello,
I have the Lounge GOLD. There are some upgrades in the power supply and a few more components. But I bought it as I wanted to pull my preamp out of the system. With a volume control knob the signal path is shorter. Though mine is still breaking in, I can confirm that there is a certain musicality to it which is a whole lot better than my previous built in phono stage. According to Mr. Morin, with time, it will reveal things I never knew existed on my LPs. Well I have certainly started noticing that already. But basically GOLD has the same topology as MKiii. But with few upgraded parts.

 

Thanks for the reply, guess the gold is more like a fully fledged preamp. Glad your enjoying it!

 

Well a few days ago I purchased a used but in great condition Perreaux SXV2 phono stage. It has allowed me to increase the impedance for my Denon 301mk2 to 1000 ohms. The SXV2 is a great phono stage with heaps of flexibility for gain, impedance and capacitance. It was well reviewed and apparently a big step up from their less favourably reviewed SXV1. It is more quiet, dynamic and provides a lot more detail than the onboard MC stage of my Quad 99 and for the price ($480NZD) was well worth the upgrade. I seem to be picking up all these really low level details in the music that I haven't heard before. It seems much more precise and clear, yet that was the same experience I had when I first picked up the quad... It just gets better and better. This has come at the expense of a little of the warmth of my setup, it is now a little brighter and a little more hifi sounding. Not a bad thing at all.

Having said that I now appreciate the diminishing returns aspect of the upgrade path. Although the difference was clear, it was not revolutionary, and had I spent full price on the stage I may well have been disappointed. What I have realised is that the onboard phono stage of the Quad is actually really, really good and it takes a lot to better it. No doubt there are much better stages out there than the Perreaux but I kinda fell with its level of flexibility then I have likely jumped off the stage upgrade path. Anyone looking for a high quality preamp with lots of features and a killer phono stage should definitely look into the Quad 99. Anyone wondering if it can be bettered, yes it can. But expect to pay for it.

Cheers for the help here. If the Perreaux hadn't shown up the copla would have been the purchase I made. I did like the idea of supporting a forum native but couldn't pass up supporting a local company.