Question about Graham Nash "Songs For Beginners" Classic reissue LP

CB: On October 15th, Classic Records released "Songs for Beginners" on vinyl. How does it feel to be putting out a good, old fashioned record in the year 2001?

GN: It was very interesting revisiting the master tapes. . . First of all, the master tapes - I'd been storing them in good condition for the last thirty odd years, as I do with all CSN stuff. . So the condition of the tapes was great. I was never very happy with the original mix - the technical aspects of the mix from 1970 when I did "Songs for Beginners". The master two track was distorted slightly and there were things in the mix that had I - you know one can always in hindsight change everything - you always want to go back and fix it. I had a chance to do that so when I was working with Nathaniel Kunkel - going back to the original master, finding them in good condition and having the opportunity to revisit them and remix them both in stereo and 5.1. It was great fun for both of us - for Nathaniel and for me. . .

from:
http://www.classicrecs.com/

i prefer my original atlantic lp.
btw, the atlantic cd is a re-mix too.

 

Boy, I came mighty close to ordering this on TPs recommendation. He really gives it a great write up on his website. Of course everyone is entitled to their opinion (and I usually will rely on Tom's). However, I'm glad I decided that as long as I have the original I didn't need another.

 

Absolutely. BEST example of violation of Prime directive #1 if there ever was one IMO.

I may be wrong, BUT I think the NEW drums have been recently over-dubbed.

Thankfully I still have my first pressing Atlantic LP.

BC

 

Hi,

Yesiree, this received Tom Port's "highest recommendation". I bought it from him for just that reason. He addressed the remix, "For the most part the changes are an improvement. The original mix is more natural, with more tubey richness, but now it sounds murky and shrunken next to the new one. The new mix is very smooth, but bigger, more open and transparent. Let me hand it to them - they did a great job."

-Jeffrey

 

I hated this remix. As Steve says, it turns it into a modern-sounding album. Completely loses its '70's charm.

I think the primary reason they didn't like the old mix was because there is some very audible distortion on the drums in places, plus significant tape hiss.

I definitely think they should have given this one a different catalog number than the original, or at the very least indicate on the jacket somewhere that this is a remix. It's *not* the same album.

I had the same thought myself.

 

oops, meant to edit my post

 

Why do artists have to go second guessing themselves?

Especially 30 years later??

 

Well, 5.1 is one thing, but if there's nothing demonstably wrong with the original stereo mix--beyond a little hiss and distortion--why tamper with it? I've never believed in that, when there's a perfectly decent master tape around. Too bad, really; nice little album. For this one, I guess we really are stuck with the old vinyl.

ED

 

Mid-life crisis?

mud-

 

Hi Mud,

Sure, if they live to be 110!

-Jeffrey

 

Nash

Add me to the lists of cats who bought this based on TP's rave. Haven't cracked it yet. I will do so this weekend. Maybe listen tomorrow night with the basketball game on mute

Peace
Norm

 

I bought the original when it first came out and listened to it a lot back then, and again when the CD was first released, I bought it again. Since I no longer have my original vinyl, does anyone know if the FIRST CD release (U.S. Atlantic) is the original mix or the new "modern" mix.

I agree with you guys, if the original artist want to create a 5.1 mix, brand new, he can do ANYTHING he wants, add echo, drums, whatever, as this is literally a new release. However, I still would always prefer the officially issued original mix for the stereo tracks. That't the way I "learned" to hear the music. Anything else is an "alternate".

 

revisionism

Alas, GN can do what he wants with that which
he owns, and/or controls. It's his stuff. If
he believes he can improve what he did 30 years
ago, and he wants to reissue it without telling
the world he also remixed it, he can do that, too.
Apparently, this is just what he did.

So much for the supposed facts. But here's the
rub--he can't change history. He can't erase your,
or my, impressed memory of his past work, but now
proffers a replacement of our "outdated and inferior"
copies with the "new and shiny" (should I say bright?}
version he now prefers, and I for one don't want
it replaced. For me, it is what it was, if you
understand my meaning. And if I so choose, it still
will be, if I hang onto my old copies of Songs For
Beginners, and refuse any updates. This is my
choice.

Sadly, with every passing day, a lot of
musical history is getting "updated", and the best
we can hope for is that someone of Steve's caliber
will be involved, so that we get real improvement
of the genuine original.

Okay, I know I'm preaching to the choir...

--Roger

 

Do I understand this correctly? If Graham is talking about the new remix for the Classic Lp re-issue that came out in 2001, did he actually remix the tapes for that issue then , or for the original Atlantic release on CD...back when that first came out.?..if in fact the Atlantic CD does use his remix why was this just coming out as news for the LP re-issue. Which is it? Remix for the Classic LP, or remixed back when for the CD release?

JF

 

i covered this earlier in this thread.
but, to recap.

there are 3 different mixes of songs for beginners:

1. original atlantic lp

2. atlantic cd

3. classic records lp


i remember how disappointed i was the first time i played the cd
and discovered that the studio chatter between nash, crosby, garcia and lesh before the start of "i used to be a king" had been removed!
i then checked the liner notes and discovered that it had been remixed.
good thing i made a cd-r of the lp. . .

 

artists always would like to change the their own music history... the engineers should lock their doors!