Sinatra / Reprise Sound Quality: "I Remember Tommy" (1961)

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by MLutthans, Apr 16, 2012.

  1. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff Thread Starter

    Location:
    Marysville, WA
    It's go time. Let's do another comparison thread!

    Here's what I have to bring to the table on this one:

    •R-1003 mono, A8/B8
    •R9-1003 stereo, A5 for side one, but "R-9-1003-B 30,037-7" on side two, and in that space between the two designations, there's a "3" inside a circle, and below that three is a mark that looks kind of like a "del segno" mark:[​IMG]
    •FS-1003 stereo, two-tone orange label, both sides 1-H.
    •Original Ampex reel, catalog #RSL-1707
    •The Suitcase CD.....if I can find it. (It's not where it belongs. That's bad.:sigh: )

    Shall we also look at the bonus-track from the IRT sessions? I have "In the Blue of Evening" on "Greatest Love Songs" and the suitcase.

    If you have anything to contribute, please drop me a PM! For the album comparisons, let's use "I'll Be Seeing You."

    Thanks as always,
    Matt
     
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  2. MMM

    MMM Forum Hall Of Fame

    Location:
    Lodi, New Jersey

    Yes, if you want to compare a different sounding session, since it was held at Radio Recorders instead of United.
     
  3. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff Thread Starter

    Location:
    Marysville, WA
    Martin, do you know who engineered that session?
     
  4. rangerjohn

    rangerjohn Forum Resident

    Location:
    chicago, il
    This is going to be great!
     
  5. Bob F

    Bob F Forum Resident

    Incidentally, there have been THREE American CD releases of I REMEMBER TOMMY...
    1. Reprise 9 27019-2 (November 1991) - original 13 tracks and LP liner notes
    2. Reprise 9 45267-2 (April 1993) - adds bonus track; expanded reissue notes by James Isaacs
    3. Reprise 9 46969-2 (September 1998) - EOTC edition; drops bonus track and extra notes
    Most people are unfamiliar with the shortlived first issue. There are no CD production or engineering credits on that one.

    The more common second CD reissue with "In the Blue of Evening" was produced by Joe McEwen; the third CD by Greg Geller. Lee Herschberg is credited with digital remastering on both the 1993 and 1998 ("20-bit") resissue CDs.

    (The recent 2010 reissues by UMG in the EU and Japan are identical to the 1998 Reprise CD.)
     
  6. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff Thread Starter

    Location:
    Marysville, WA
    I think we will have the following versions covered thus far, with thanks to stevelucille, Bob F, and MMM:

    •R-1003 mono, A8/B8
    •R9-1003 stereo, A5 for side one, but "R-9-1003-B 30,037-7" on side two
    •FS-1003 stereo, two-tone orange label, both sides 1-H.
    •Original Ampex reel, catalog #RSL-1707
    •Later S9-series Stereotape reel
    •The Suitcase CD
    •1993 CD
    •EOTC CD

    Anybody able to send clips from other versions? Non-US versions, maybe? If so, please PM me.

    Bob - do you know if the 1991 and 1993 discs share the same mastering as far as the original 13 tracks go? If they don't, or if you aren't sure, could you send clips from the 1991 disc, too. (I assume you have it in your vast Sinatra Vault.)

    Thanks,
    Matt
     
  7. Steve Hoffman

    Steve Hoffman Mastering Engineer Your Host

    I mixed that album in 2000, both the four channel Radio Recorders rejected version and the three channel United Recording remake.

    Good times, good times.
     
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  8. TLMusic

    TLMusic Musician & record collector

    Musically this is a great album. I only have a "scowling Frank" mono LP at home, and would like to know where the best sound can be found.
     
  9. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff Thread Starter

    Location:
    Marysville, WA
    What's the deal with recording at Radio Recorders?
     
  10. paulmock

    paulmock Forum Resident

    Location:
    Hollywood, CA
    I remember you saying in another thread that you mixed enough material from the RR sessions to have Reprise make a "comparison" CD of the difference in the material that Mr. S rejected and what we have been hearing for 50 years.

    Juicy stuff, indeed!
     
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  11. paulmock

    paulmock Forum Resident

    Location:
    Hollywood, CA
    IMHO the Japanese mid 80's pressing is superior to all. Supremely quiet vinyl and excellent sound. Sorry, but I am not at home so I cannot now present the catalogue number. But tis' a goody!!!
     
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  12. hodgo

    hodgo Tea Making Gort (Yorkshire Branch) Staff

    Location:
    East Yorkshire
    Really looking forward to your comparisons on this one Matt as it's one of my favourite Reprise albums.
     
  13. Bob F

    Bob F Forum Resident

    They appear to be the same, except for the bonus cut added (as track 13) on the later CD. I'd bet this is the original stereo LP mix from back in the day, but I'll leave it to you to tell us for sure. Samples on the way.
     
  14. Steve Hoffman

    Steve Hoffman Mastering Engineer Your Host

    The original stereo mix of this album was quite good. If you all can find a nice, warm, non-messed-with mastering of it, grab it. The unmixed three-track is rather grim sounding. The two track reduction is in many ways, better. So there!
     
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  15. Thanks for the tip, Steve...this is one of my favorites of Frank's post-Capitol era albums.:love:
     
  16. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff Thread Starter

    Location:
    Marysville, WA
    Just in casual listening today, I'm really impressed by the POP in the brass and drums on the old stereo LP. Even the later non-gatefold LP that I have sounds really, really nice, at least on the comparison track.

    Matt
     
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  17. Steve Hoffman

    Steve Hoffman Mastering Engineer Your Host

    The deal? Don't know, or (more honestly, I used to know but have forgotten). However, Frank was discovering (or coming to terms with) the fact that he chose to do a Dorsey Tribute album and couldn't hold the soft notes any more. This gave him endless frustration at Radio Recorders and reels and reels of tape were recorded of him trying to nail songs he could have nailed in 5 minutes just 5 years before. He was very unhappy and talked about it on the open mic during the sessions.

    His head was in a much better place when he tried again at United, he had come to terms with the fact that he couldn't sing the stuff like he had before and chose to move on instead of being Mr. Pitiful about it.

    A fascinating listen for me, I felt quite uncomfortable eavesdropping on this stuff but Frank emerged a better person in a better place so all was well for him more or less after that..
     
  18. paulmock

    paulmock Forum Resident

    Location:
    Hollywood, CA
    On "Daybreak" and "Take Me" I swear the man is Dorsey's trombone reincarnated! Mr. S really did his homework on this one with Sy Oliver.
     
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  19. paulmock

    paulmock Forum Resident

    Location:
    Hollywood, CA

    W-O-W!!!!:eek:
     
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  20. aoxomoxoa

    aoxomoxoa Down by the old mainstream

    Location:
    Ohio
    That's very interesting. I would love to hear session highlights
     
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  21. Tina_UK

    Tina_UK Forum Resident

    Location:
    England
    Nice to see Bob posting, I thought he was too busy elsewhere doing " Bobs Burgers" :DWhatever THAT is LOL!
     
  22. Bob F

    Bob F Forum Resident

    I've been busy listening to an album titled "I Remember Tina."
     
  23. Tina_UK

    Tina_UK Forum Resident

    Location:
    England
    Well Bob , as long you never " Forget To Remember"
     
  24. McLover

    McLover Forum Resident

    Location:
    East TN
    This is my favorite Reprise era Frank LP and still gives me a smile every time I play it. The Stereo mix is splendid. And a joy to these ears. My favorite pressing of this LP is the original pre-1963 Scowling Frank label pressings. The notes by Lawrence D. Stewart are essential and missing on the later variants. The Reprise RSL 1707 Ampex 4 track reel tape is superb (wish I owned one, a friend of mine does). Essential album for all fans of Ole Blue Eyes.
     
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  25. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff Thread Starter

    Location:
    Marysville, WA
    Glad to know, as I just won one on Ebay over the weekend for $15, and I was the only bidder!

    Matt
     

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