Sizing up the average listener

Let me take another flying leap at this. Based on the enormous number of people I know, I'd think that the two people you note are not "average," they are the minority (quite a difference in attitude from the post I deleted, huh?). The ratio of people I know who pay attention to sound quality compared to the number of people who enjoy music played on any thing that makes a noise is very high.

What you say about what the people you know not having the same gear, I feel that's a very different discussion. I think there are some guys here who don't have much in the way of expensive gear (probably I'm one of them), and I'm not so sure anyone needs costly stuff-- the ability to observe is more important.

Whether any of us have the right to make sweeping generalizations about the music buying public at large-- well, we may not have the right to judge, but it is much easier to do than to write about Joe-six pack with a whole line of disclaimers.

 

Elton John on CD

Every one I've heard is complete garbage. Get the MOFI versions, which are excellent.

Who's at fault? Producers, consumers, reviewers?
I have a theory but it will have to wait for another day!

 

Re: Re: Sizing up the average listener

Sure, you have the right, but do you have the knowledge to make any kind of informed statement? I don't feel like I do.

Even if you did, what's the point of complaining? Am I the only one who gets tired of seeing the "average Joe" bashing? Strikes me primarily as a way to elevate oneself.

 

I know I get agitated when some snobby audiophile tries to tell me in so many words that I am not qualified to comment on sound because A) I listen to digital B) I don't own high-end, American made gear, and c) I don't listen to the "right" music.

I notice only a few select people are participating in this thread at all. I wonder why...

 

My 'beast' friend is quite into Tequila as well as types and brands. There's over 1,100 types and brands of Tequila in this world.

Whoohoo!

My buddy loved his margaritas, his shots, and so did I. Then we did Souza Tequila, and then Jose Quervo. We thought it was the best we'd had. We loved it.

Then we had Don Partron (sp) and found out Jose is mixed with vodka after processing.

After a week of this stuff, we could only take one sip of Jose.

No way, Jose. Is this being snobby? Am I significantly elevating myself? Am I still the average Joe? Well, you decide I guess!

 

Grant, you are just as qualified to comment about sound as much as the so-called audiophiles.

 

But Brad, I AM an audiophile!

 

I don't understand. I don't drink coffee and I don't touch alcohol.

 

Re: Re: Re: Sizing up the average listener

I agree. When I write about most topics I really *try* to keep the focus on my experience (but I'm human and occasionally I pontificate with the best of them). Personally, I do try to watch making generalities (I write as I think about some of the screwy generalities I've written here), because I already know that I really don't know what the average guy is thinking. Whatever I think I know on the subject is very probably wrong. That includes my above post too.

I know that in my world away from this forum people pretty much humor my love of music. They will talk to me until the cows come home about movies, but on all things involving musical playback they usually listen in silence. Most aren't giving music the thought that I do, but I don't look down on anyone for that. I just chalk it up to the way I'm wired, it's my interest.

I feel that there are many people on this forum with may different agendas. I feel some people come here to feel better about who they are, or their choices in equipment or music or particular purchases. Fine with me. Some people even love music too, that's even better.

 

Re: Re: So who's unclean?

Your Zness,

If I were you I wouldn't dare to post the lovely pic of Elizabeth. Some romantic chauvinist who thinks she's soo cute can have the unclean thought of asking her to take the trash out.

 

I know you are an audiophile just like I am. We are qualified to comment on sound quality.

 

Re: Re: Re: Sizing up the average listener

That's a noble thought-- I agree with it, but my point is, I find myself guilty of doing it on occasion in order to join in on some discussion. That's not counting the multitude of times that I caught myself and refrained from posting.

These thoughts were what I earlier wrote that I agreed with. After writing my last post it dawned on me that some people aren't doing this to just to bash the "average Joe," though some are. I'd like to believe that the bulk of the people are looking for a place to share their thoughts on what they own and the great deal they got because there are like-minded people here who will appreciate it. Most people tell their Significant Other that they found the DCC Doors disc unopened for $11 and there's not a whole lotta fanfare. Some people can't understand why they can hear a huge difference and their neighbor thinks they are nutz (or are very excited because their neighbor can)-- and are looking for reaffirmation that they aren't the crazy one. People are looking for a place to have some values affirmed and share their own thoughts. Some folks are trying to elevate themselves, that is true too.

But there I go making generalizations again...

My point is, a large part of what we take from these threads depends upon our interpretation of what we read. I came on this morning and one post in this thread really steamed me. I thought about it and I decided that my interpretation must be wrong and let it drop. But maybe I got it right the first tme though...

Anyway, there's not more threads like this because you're the only sub-genius we have at our disposal. I hope the burden isn't too great.

 

Re: Re: Re: So who's unclean?

Believe me Paul, I was purely poking fun at myself!

 

Re: Re: Re: Re: Sizing up the average listener

ClaviusB --> make up your damn mind, eh? We'll take away your "edit" button.

You're OK in my book. All hail the God of Photoshop.

Although I am a mighty subgenius, I have it on good faith that HZ is, in fact, the ultra-rare supergenius. Once a month, he meets with his pals, like Wile E Coyote, and sips champanya (consult Christopher Walken for correct pronunciation) whilst playing chess.

 

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Sizing up the average listener

Oh man! That's a scary thought!

Yeah, HZ is an amazing guy! In a zombie movie he'd be the one they're all after.

 

Mmmmmmm BRAINS!

 

Re: Re: Re: Re: So who's unclean?

You've got to be more convincing than that when Wilma summons you for a little pillow talk.

 

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: So who's unclean?

You're right! And I thought I had a lot of explaining to do after that time she found me with Betty.

 

Grant,

You couldn't be more right about that. I very often get into friendly debates with my uncle who is an "audiofile" himself and about 25 years my senior and also a lot more endowed with cash than I am about the virtues of Vinyl over CD. I notice that many "audiophiles" seem to prefer Vinyl over CD. I am not one of those people, and when someone tries to tell me I'm clueless because I prefer the sound of CDs to Vinyl, I get very annoyed. Once my Uncle told me that I only prefer CDs because that's what I grew up with, and then I reminded him that I started collecting music when I was 10 years old way back in 1982, when Vinyl was still the dominant format and that I didn't even own a CD player until the summer of 1989. I then proceeded to show him my collection of LPs, 45s and 12 inches. Well, he quickly abandoned that argument. Well, I'm rambling here so let me cut to the chase (what am I editing a film here? ). We came to an understanding, that Vinyl has certain properties that many may appreciate and that CDs have many charactersitics such as wider dynamic range and frequency response that others may appreciate, but that they both also have their flaws. To each his own, you know?

Now, my point is certainly not to start an analogue vs. digital debate etc., but, rather, that even among people who call themselves "audiophiles" there is really no consensus on many things, so there really can't be an "average" listener. It's all just too subjective.

 

Agreed. There's great records (or CDs) that sonically sound slightly off base, but the performance is incredible. There are records that blow me away sonically that "put me to sleep" for entertainment value. On and on...ect....

Very true that there is no such thing as an average ear, or a listener attached to it.

 

My "n" just went up to 3.

From a post today on the KX ng:

 

Re: Re: Re: Re: Sizing up the average listener

I have the same experience. I don't care about movies or sports or talk about them, so people look at me as if i'm a creature from mars. No one can relate to music. At least, not these days.

As far as "audiophiles" go, we tend to sequester ourselves and only communicate with like-minded people. That's why many of us seem out of touch with what the "average" Joe is thinking. Some get a feeling of superiority from being into and having exceptional knowledge of something that most people don't know about. Some people with mega-buck rigs feel superior over those who are stuck with "Japanese" "rip-offs".

 

For people who pursue the so called "absolute sound", there has to be a reference, even with amplified, manipulated, processed music. A concert hall may not be the right environment for such but a recording studio is the more likely place to be. An electric guitar should not sound like an electric fiddle and the Marshall amps are usually not placed behind the drum set. Of course the musicians and the producers have the freedom to add distortions, reverbs and all kinds of sound effects but the listeners still can try to reproduce the experience of being there, a place which may only exist in the performers' imagination but materializes when captured on the master tape.

I agree that judging (or feeling) what "sounds good" is a matter of personal taste. "Being accurate" is less subjective but it depends on what you choose as the reference.

My high school physics teacher used to say, while comparing the senses of sights and sounds in an optics class, that a human being can filter out certain sounds and tune in to others but can't do that with what he sees. I believe our hearing systems are capable of doing that but we all have different types/levels of "filtering". In addition, our brains can decide whether or not to "bypass" the "equalizer" besides changing its settings. Enjoying good sounding hi-fi systems can be an acquired taste, like fine tuning the "factory preset" of your "adaptive hearing filter" to a favorite setting. Learning to "listen to just the music again" could mean "turning a few knobs" or "moving a few sliders" out of the comfort zone. But the willingness and the enjoyment may vary. After all, different people have different levels of tolerance on "offensive" sounds.

 

Just ran across this little gem:

"There is nothing noble in being superior to some other man. The true nobility is in being superior to your previous self." - Hindu proverb

Eerily apropos, huh? When I was 6 years old, I got the "Can't Buy Me Love" single when it first came out. All I had to compare it to were the previous Beatles records, but I remember that the "new" guitar sound (George's Rickenbacker 12-string) on "You Can't Do That" hit me like a ton of bricks. I wasn't even sure I liked it as much as the "old" guitar sound, but just the fact that it was different was exciting. This was on an old plastic portable record player. Nowadays, while I'm noticing which hours of the day the AC seems purest, I wish I could recreate the intensity of that experience.