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SL-1500C tonearm shape defective?

Discussion in 'Audio Hardware' started by woodpigeon, Feb 27, 2021.

  1. patient_ot

    patient_ot Senior Member

    Location:
    USA
    I would forget about trying to level the arm and adjust VTA using the cart as a reference point.

    Watch out with those bubble levels - they are difficult to use on Technics headshells or any headshell that's not 100% flat on top.
     
    Danilo and woodpigeon like this.
  2. oregonalex

    oregonalex Forum Resident

    This. If you try to eyeball it against a block, you'll go crazy.

    BTW, I thought all Shure cartridges have the same height. My V15III is 15mm, but BODY only. Tip to mount it is 16.5mm. So only 0.5mm shim is required for being level at 0 VTA setting.
     
    woodpigeon likes this.
  3. avanti1960

    avanti1960 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Chicago metro, USA
    the rear part of the headshell is flat and perfectly parallel with the top of the cartridge and there is no difficulty whatsoever.
    much better than trying to sight those grid lined clear blocks.
    level the platter
    level the head shell adjusting the VTA ring.
    very accurate.
     
    woodpigeon likes this.
  4. patient_ot

    patient_ot Senior Member

    Location:
    USA
    I don't like the stock Technics headshells, but when I was using one I didn't have much luck with the bubble level method. I got better results using the acrylic block. Just my experience. Bubble levels also vary in their accuracy.

    The other thing is that not every cart manufacturer suggests adjusting cartridges the same way. Some manufacturers and models are spec'd with a 23 degree VTA rather than 20 degrees, for example.

    I think OP should use whatever method works best for them. Odds are there is nothing wrong with the tonearm.
     
    woodpigeon and Sterling1 like this.
  5. Sterling1

    Sterling1 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Louisville, KY
    All of my V15V's level exactingly on a standard record from a 2mm shim in context to being mounted to stock headshell of Technics SL-1210GR utilizing stock 3mm mat when tonearm VTA is adjusted to ZERO setting. As I recall, Shure literature does not clarify the cartridge height is or is not measured from stylus tip to top of cart body or from bottom of cart body to top of cart body. My measurements with a dial caliper show 15mm from stylus tip to top of cart body and it appears the mounted result is as Technics said it would be. Also, the Ortofon 2M Series is indeed 18mm from stylus tip to cart top and when these carts are mounted in stock headshell and VTA is adjusted for that 18mm height those carts are level too.
     
    Last edited: Feb 28, 2021
    woodpigeon likes this.
  6. oregonalex

    oregonalex Forum Resident

    I found this. From the horse's mouth.
    https://service.shure.com/s/article/dimension-of-v15vxmr?language=en_US

    Also this, as far as it is applicable:
    https://service.shure.com/s/article/m97xe-height-and-vertical-tracking-angle?language=en_US
     
    Sterling1 likes this.
  7. Sterling1

    Sterling1 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Louisville, KY
  8. Sterling1

    Sterling1 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Louisville, KY
    One more thought, The V15VxMR is not identical to the V15V-MR. I have still to this day not seen literature or comments from Shure regarding the cartridge height including stylus. But, since it's been about 3 years since I shimmed my cart and my memory of it is vague I re-measured the cart height from stylus, It's ,596 which converts to 15mm rounded up. And, on the Technics turntable with stock mat and headshell the cart is parallel to a standard thickness LP when tonearm VTA adjustment feature is set to ZERO. BTW, I pulled out my V15 III, sans stylus, and it measures .596. Having no stylus assembly for it I do not know what the height of the cart would be including stylus. At any rate, kind of strange.
     
  9. Uglyversal

    Uglyversal Forum Resident

    Location:
    Sydney
    I know your are settling down on the idea that this is normal. To me is odd, I don't see why a TT that has a VTA adjustment needs to be adjusted always right to the top to fit cartridges commonly used. There are errors made by big companies I would contact the manufacturer and see what they say, having the wand in that angle just doesn't look right to me.
     
    Sterling1 and woodpigeon like this.
  10. Davey

    Davey I'm just saying that I just can't see you tonight

    Location:
    SF Bay Area, USA
    Yea, makes you wonder what the azimuth looks like if the tonearm tube is rotated in its mount, though if your headshell has adjustment you can take care of it there.
     
    Uglyversal likes this.
  11. Uglyversal

    Uglyversal Forum Resident

    Location:
    Sydney
    You can but you shouldn't have to, you should also have some room to play with the VTA that's the whole purpose to have the adjustment in the first place.
     
    Ham Sandwich, woodpigeon and Davey like this.
  12. Davey

    Davey I'm just saying that I just can't see you tonight

    Location:
    SF Bay Area, USA
    I know, I wouldn't accept a turntable with a tonearm skewed like that, but it seems like he's already decided to keep it, so I just mentioned that the azimuth should be checked, if it hasn't already been verified. Maybe the Malayian operation people aren't quite as finicky with these things :)
     
    Joel Shapiro likes this.
  13. Uglyversal

    Uglyversal Forum Resident

    Location:
    Sydney
    Just keep them coming out, if anyone complains we'll offer a free printed protractor.
     
  14. woodpigeon

    woodpigeon Well-Known Member Thread Starter

    Location:
    New Zealand
    Yes, this is the crux of the reason I posted.

    Disregarding the arm wand, I’m not able to get any one of four different cartridges level without maxing out the VTA. That seems wrong.
     
    Uglyversal likes this.
  15. woodpigeon

    woodpigeon Well-Known Member Thread Starter

    Location:
    New Zealand
    Looking at the user manual. According to the arm height section, an 18mm cart needs the arm height adjusted to 4mm. (Page 16 here: https://www.technics.com/support/downloads/data/operating-instructions/SL-1500C_EB_TQBM0414.pdf)

    The Quintet Black is 18mm high, but is not level at 4mm or even 7mm arm height.
     
    Uglyversal likes this.
  16. Sterling1

    Sterling1 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Louisville, KY
    All information you have given is suggesting a turntable defect at the headshell mounting collar or at the tonearm pivot area, perhaps a part not properly fitted. I am going to resend my belief that parallax error is precluding appraisal of a level cart. In other words return the turntable for another. There may be something else going on like maybe you have installed the cart to headshell with thick washers, as in 2mm thick washers between headshell a cart? Or, perhaps the need to adjust to 6 rather than 4 on the VTA ring is indicating a improper fitting of the ring. Who knows? https://www.technics.com/support/downloads/data/operating-instructions/SL-1500C_EB_TQBM0414.pdf
     
    Last edited: Mar 1, 2021
    woodpigeon likes this.
  17. Sterling1

    Sterling1 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Louisville, KY
    One more thought, I wonder when technicians assembled this turntable if perhaps they forgot to add shims/spacers to calibrate the VTA ring? Seems a 3mm spacer is needed.
     
    woodpigeon likes this.
  18. Leonthepro

    Leonthepro Skeptically Optimistic Autodidact Debater

    Location:
    Sweden
    Yeah VTA is not that critical, you cant get perfect anyway since its a moving target.

    Exposing the VTA myth? [English]
     
    aunitedlemon likes this.
  19. tommytune

    tommytune Forum Resident

    Location:
    Iowa
    Another item to check is the headshell bayonet. If the diameter is too small, with a single tang at the top, will pull the headshell front up when tightened in the tonearm collar. The stock headshell diameter ( on my table ) is just right as to not tilt the headshell when tightening.
     
    Sterling1 and woodpigeon like this.
  20. woodpigeon

    woodpigeon Well-Known Member Thread Starter

    Location:
    New Zealand
    Alas, the table is a shop floor model purchased from a box store 12 months ago, so returning it probably won’t work out.

    However the local hifi dealer has started carrying Technics recently and I have a good relationship with them. Will ask if they can put me in touch with the right person at the NZ distributor for some tech support.
     
  21. woodpigeon

    woodpigeon Well-Known Member Thread Starter

    Location:
    New Zealand
    I’m not overly worried about perfect VTA, just have a hunch that something is amiss with the arm/headshell arrangement.
     
  22. Oelewapper

    Oelewapper Plays vinyl instead of installing it on the floor.

    I have a Concorde Century too and on my SL-1200G it’s level when the tonearm is level... So I think there’s something funny going on with your tonearm.
     
    woodpigeon and Sterling1 like this.
  23. Sterling1

    Sterling1 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Louisville, KY
    The turntable might suffer from damage done to it while demoed at big box store or it may be a return to big box store, damaged by original buyer.
     
    woodpigeon likes this.
  24. patient_ot

    patient_ot Senior Member

    Location:
    USA
    The TT has a 2 year parts and labor warranty. If OP is worried about it, they can take or send it to a service center for inspection.
     
    woodpigeon likes this.
  25. woodpigeon

    woodpigeon Well-Known Member Thread Starter

    Location:
    New Zealand
    Yeah I’m getting in touch with the distributor to work out if they can help.

    Thanks all for the replies.
     

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