The Disposable/Nonfixable $4K Audio Desk Cleaner

My Audio Desk motor went south and when I Googled where I could have it fixed I found out the only way to get it fixed is to send it back to Germany. Someone said that AD wanted almost $2K to fix a broken water pump, NOT an uncommon problem. If it cost that much to fix a pump, I could just imagine how much they would charge to fix the motor!!! That kinda' $$$ makes fixing it cost more than it is now worth after 4 years of use.

Basically they way it is designed, it was meant to not be repaired . . . as the unit's plastic body is glued and welded together and access to the parts is poor.

I used an oscillating tool to open up the bottom after knocking off the bottom plate with a hammer and a piece of wood. Even with the unit fully exposed I have to figure out how to remove the motor gear and access the screws holding it on. Then I have to figure out where to purchase a similar motor.

Herr Glass wants total control and $$$ and never authorized a repair station in the USA to fix Herr Glass's machine . . . and like any machine, they eventually break.

So in a sense these machines are disposable and you just throw your investment $$$$$$$ away!!

I wish I had known about this when I purchased one - because I wouldn't have bought it!!!!!!!!!!!

You could say I'm slightly PO'd!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

Did you contact the dealer?

 

Do you have a local shop that rebuilds stuff? I've had an alternator repaired twice now, same one, different problems. Total cost for both repairs combined was about $120. If they can get the motor apart I bet they could repair it cheap.

Otherwise, Grainger for a possible replacement.

 

Yes, and he said he'd have to send it to Germany.

 

What almost any repair shop can do I can do, and fixing and rebuilding alternators as well as rebuilding cars from the ground up including rebuilding manual transmissions, assembling motors, suspensions etc. My hobby was restoring cars and working on a race car my Dad and I owned from the 1960s till 2005 when I lost interest.

I'm pretty talented when it comes to mechanical abilities if I think hard enough to figure out what is wrong and how to repair it.

When I am able to get the motor out I'll try to find a replacement, especially if there is a manufacturer's name and model # on it.

Thanks for the suggestion though.

 

Well, at least you saved me from ever thinking I should come up with $4k for one of these...

 

Are there any identifying marks on the motor? I’m doubting they made the motor themselves.

Or the pump, for that matter.

Maybe you have a new sideline business.

 

Sounds like another audio scam.

 

So sorry to hear that you are having that problem. It's really a pain, and I hope you find a way to get it repaired locally.

I recently had a similar problem: a unit with a failing circuit board that would have to go to Asia for repair. The manufacturer did offer a good trade-in value towards their newer model. I am not sure whether to take it, or look for a North American alternative.

I have never looked down on foreign-made gear, but such experiences have made me see the value of stuff made -- and serviceable -- in North America. I'm pretty sure that my Janszen speakers, JL Audio subs, Anthem preamp, and Bryston power amp can be serviced readily if they ever need it.

 

Even if not, Google image search might -- just might -- help.

 

Great idea!!!!!!!

 

As an Audio Desk owner, I have to ask: did the modifications that you reported making to the machine in any way impact the price quote that you received for repairs? Just trying to plan for my own breakdown (so to speak) in a few years.

 

Bing also has a very good image search. Better than Google for searching for similar looking things.

 

I have gear that is made in America and gear that was manufactured overseas.

I am glad that I do have gear that is manufactured in the U.S. (or serviced in the U.S.), by Emotiva, Rogue, Polk, Zu and others.

But I do have gear from overseas companies, but I have confidence, that their distributor's here will be able to service these products, should the need arise.

Going forward from here, I think it is important for everyone purchasing audio gear to do some pre-purchase research on service and product support.

 

I assume the unit is out of warranty. I had several of the early ones. Robert Stein was very helpful at the time. I eventually got out of the AD and switched about 5 years ago to the KL, which is better built, but that doesn't mean it won't fail or be expensive to repair.
Here's a link to a guy that figured out what pump was involved and did the replacement himself if you are so inclined:Audio Desk Systeme - Vinyl Cleaner – Repair of Water Pump Failure | Audiogon Discussion Forum

The right move in my estimation, is an industrial US bath, a spinner (which you can make or buy from cheap to fancy), a recirculating pump with a very tight filter and you could be into a better cleaning machine for less.
I'm brand agnostic. All I care about is that they do their job.
Right now, I've got a big Monks and a KL and when the KL fails, I'll buy an Elma and do the DIY thing.
You obviously don't have to spend Elma money. You could probably buy 8 cheap US tanks for the cost of one.
But, that thread I posted above should help you if you are out of warranty and it's a door stop.
PS: to my knowledge, the solution offered by AD, apart from paying the tariff or fixing it yourself, was to trade for the "Pro" version, which I never used. One of my friends (who now posts here) is delighted with his, and he cranks through a lot of records.
What's interesting- and you'll see my comments about the Elma in that link I provided, is that Elma doesn't make its transducers (or presumably the pump) field replaceable. I asked, figuring it was an industrial grade unit used in medical and tech/institutional applications. I suspect that if you have a big factory line sized unit, they'll send a tech since the big industrial machines are not exactly something you'd pop into a box and ship.
good luck.

 

Bill, how would compare the Monks and KL in terms of cleaning ability?

 

I am not sure what is involved in foxing the motor, but I did just replace the pump in mine. It was a tad daunting as I had to split the bottom from the unit and use my dremel to saw my way in to the tank, but after a couple hours and a new $20 aquarium pump it's all back together and working great. Yes the unit does a great job and yes it's a horrible design from a servicing standpoint. Good news is that once you've cut your wal in, it's much easier to get in a second time. Mine is all back together with 3M 5200 Adhesive.

 

Sorry to hear. I bought a Rega Apollo new, discounted weeks before the newer model came out, and it died twice in two years. It was bought thru a Rega dealer. The first time it was under warranty, the second time they wanted $300 + so I left it with the dealer. Unfortunately, I've come to believe that this is typical of the industry.

 

At this point you got little to lose so I'd try and source the parts and see if you can fix it yourself.

I'll take a risk on a product from time to time but I do check warranty situations for larger purchases more often than I used to. At one point naivety had me believing that as long as there was an official distributor available then you would be taken care of in these situations, but that's not always the case.

 

Different qualities. I like what ultrasonic cleaning brings to the table in terms of what I'd call a "pristine finish" but after I got over my initial delight of one button convenience (with the first commercial units), I was unsatisfied with the results on some records that needed more work. I found that using a conventional RCM was able to grapple with some of the more troublesome old records- at the time, I only had the VPI (16.5) and was using the Audio Desk. Combining methods enabled me to get some records to a high playing standard that didn't clean up in the ultrasonic machine. (And in the past, I hadn't done repeated cleanings on the VPI).
The Monks is, in some ways, like the Rolls-Royce: it was one of the first, if not the first, commercial cleaning machine (like those photos of RR in front of the pyramids back at the beginning of the 20th century); is well built in a very British engineering way (quirky but nicely made) and is actually quite fun to use if you get into it (I was shown some of the tricks of set up and maintenance by the guy who maintains the machines for the Library of Congress who is himself an archivist and has been doing institutional Monks maintenance for years). I don't use the dispenser head, because I will apply different fluids depending on need and condition of the record. I also do a rinse step. I can crank through records pretty fast on the Monks, surprisingly so given the perception that the point nozzles take forever. (They don't).

The KL is overbuilt in a more modern way and its cabinet is impressive in a billet CNC way compared to the Audio Desk. But it's what's inside and how it works that counts. The LP handling system does not involve any rollers like the AD, so it doesn't do any surface washing, and its less complicated design was attractive to me for that reason. Although there are variations in ultrasonic machine design, frequency and features, the main objective is to plop a record in, and let the cavitation do its thing. In that respect the KL is great. But it doesn't use any surfactant- which I originally believed was a positive; however, my learning has taught me that using something to break water surface tension will enhance ultrasonic cleaning results considerably.
Comparing the Monks and the KL are almost like saying "shall we take the Rolls out dear?" or have a spin in some modern supercar. (strained analogy but it highlights their real differences in almost every respect).
If I had to choose one, because I buy mostly older copies, it would be the Monks, and I'm a sucker for its old fashioned design. If I were going to spend money on an ultrasonic, I'd go DIY with the additional filtration a lot of people have added. Having a conventional machine -- nothing fancy, like a VPI and ultrasonic- DIY with filtration-- would be the way to go in my estimation. If you only buy audiophile maintained records or new, you can probably get by with just ultrasonic, and on the occasions when even a new record needs pre-cleaning, do it manually.
Obviously, this is partly personal preference in terms of operation, but a lot of my take is based on results with older used records- determined by how cleanly they play.

 

Thanks for the extended description Bill. I have a Loricraft and have been curious what benefits if any an ultrasonic machine might provide.

 

The common issue with the AudioDesk is definitely the water pump which is actually quite easy to fix with a little handy work. The KLAudio isn't without its faults too. There has been circuit board and transducer failures and I am one of those victims. I have both the AD and the KL.

 

My mods were minor and had to do w/the squeegee and access to clean the rubber wheels which should make it even easier to fix.

 

Roger that. As I thought about it later, I realized that the machine must be out of warranty, so there would be no "voiding" issues. Don't mind me.

 

Audiodesk customer service is non existent . Do a search. When , I had my Audiodesk lath I emailed Audiodesk with a question about replacement belts. No reply back.

Then and there I was put off with anything Audiodesk especially with the numerous failures I have read about such as yours. 4k plus for a boat anchor.