The Edsel Robert Palmer remasters

That denial is pathetic up to the last sentence where it becomes offensive. Basically I have invented the problem with my Amazon reviews. Maybe an apology would have been better.

 

Suspected?

 

Andy, I am glad you used the tools to verify that these remasters are horribly done.

 

It is simply hilarious to see people like Mr. Jennings commenting in such an amazingly poor way, even knowing that his answer won't be read by some complete morons, but by educated and interested people. Of course “We were given flat transfers ..., on CDs with Universal’s Belsize Road Tape Library inlays. ... The CDs certainly don’t have MP3s on them” translates to "It was dead obvious these CDs had sound files in MP3 quality on them, but as those files didn't end with '.mp3', but with '.wav', we very extremely confident nobody would notice!"

 

Shockingly, on their Facebook page, Super Deluxe Edition seems to be taking Edsel's side.
Here are some of their responses to posts from consumers.

"I have *some* sympathy with what he's saying - nobody and nothing is ever 'perfect' - yet reissues get SLAMMED for sometimes rather minor things. Having done the Paul Young remixes project, I got a feel for what it's like on the other side of the fence."

"Is this 16 KHz business really 'proof' of anything?"

 

What? This is the guy who comes here to promote his site and made a fuss for the Peter Gabriel So box set because he wanted a BluRay instead of a DVD? The 16kHz business is not enough? What about the mp3 artifacts found by the Tau Analyzer software?

 

Hey, don't hate on SuperDeluxeEdition. It's a great blog and he's doing a service by reporting on these issues here.

 

Of course SDE is going to take the middle road...they don't do the analysis so why would they take the word of 'some guy on the internet' as gospel? I see nothing wrong with what SDE has done...they got further with this issue than anyone here by getting Edsel to comment. I plan to return mine when it arrives (ordered it the day before the info about mp3's was posted) and that will speak much louder to Edsel than a bunch of SH.tv'ers sniping at people on websites.

EDIT: SDE = Super Deluxe Edition

 

The guy at Edsel is not to blame though, right? It's his customers who can't simply be happy with what he's selling.

 

But the thing is that anyone can run the same test with plenty of software to look at the spectrum of dozens of tracks all of them showing the same thing. It's not an unproven claim that nobody can verify.

 

I don't think that doing audio analysis is the point of SDE. SDE got an official response from Edsel after all the complaints. The blog does a good job-have even managed to get some releases improved with more and better content before they were released (Swing Out Sister's deluxe of "It's Better to Travel" for one).

 

It sounds like someone screwed over Edsel by sending them mp3 files and Edsel either didn't check on the quality of what they were sent or did the best with what they had. Our wrath should be directed in large part at the licensing label that has control of the masters. I suspect that outside of audiophile circles (MFSL, Analogue Productions, AF) this is standard operating procedure. If you don't insist on the best quality tapes to work with, you get what you get.

That said, I have 2 of these new Edsel releases but haven't had a chance to play and compare yet. I bought them for the bonus tracks and otherwise am content with the earlier versions anyway.

 

I also see nothing wrong with what SDE has done, but a comment like "Is this 16 KHz business really 'proof' of anything?" at least demonstrates a certain degree of ... let's call it cluelessness, especially if your website is devoted to re-releases. This guy should simply take a look at his (hopefully comprehensive) CD collection and see if he can find EVEN A SINGLE disc with no information above 16 kHz, before asking for proofs. The original releases had this information, the re-releases do no longer. Simple fact. No proof needed.

 

Ugh, this is what galls me more than anything else. I could probably have lived with the lossy-sourced CDs because I was so impressed with the packaging, which is quite well done and obviously went through some sort of careful vetting process. But now, I'm definitely returning the discs — if only to send the message that this kind of oversight is unacceptable when combined with sheer indifference to customers that care about audio quality.

I already own several copies of Clues, and these reissues basically were just a few tracks short of completing my lossless Robert Palmer collection. I'm very sad that until someone has the werewithal to actually dig out the physical tape masters themselves and give this man's timeless work the care it deserves we have to live with sub-par treatments.

 

Just for giggles I bought the same track ("Pride") from the US iTunes store:



Maybe Edsel needs to start sourcing their "remasters" from Apple!

 

Quality seals that should make you suspicious:

"Mastered for loudness war!"
"Remastered for iTunes!"
"Re-released as 16 kHz cutoff!"

To be continued ...

 

I agree ... Sinclair wouldn't be able to get attributable comments from record companies if he got a reputation for posting them and then sitting in judgment on them. (On top of which, if he depends on internet comments and they are wrong - which is not unknown - then he could be sued.)

That said, he does seem to have got the balance wrong here because use of quotation marks around the word look (audiophiles often like to 'look' at the sound of tracks via waveforms) implies (inadvertently I think) that this is some sort of New Age dowsing process or something.

 

Very annoying that someone who has an interest for deluxe re-issues must ridicule a complaint about audio quality with the usual "audiophile OCD" comments. Who is buying the super deluxe editions that he reviews? Certainly not the people who are happy with casual iTunes purchases or free Spotify.

 

...or correct the issue and re-release the CD sets with a proper mastering. But I guess that's way too much to ask....

You're right - that denial is just laughable, since the MP3 issue is easy to prove. It would be funny if it wouldn't be such a sad state of affairs for music lovers desiring nice remasters. All I can say is that it clearly shows that today's music market is driver by sheer incompetence when it comes to reissuing older albums. There's a few exceptions, but you really have to know where to get relevant information before you decide to buy - or not. Makes me even more thankful that a forum like this exists.

 

What makes it even worse, the 16 kHz lowpass is not just and indication of "mp3 source". It's an indication of a "very old and/or low quality mp3 source". Take a look at this table:

http://wiki.hydrogenaudio.org/index.php?title=LAME#Technical_information

The recommended settings that most people use with LAME codec are V2 and V0 and you can see those have a cutoff at 18 kHz or higher. Which almost certainly means, that with a 16 kHz lowpass, the source for these disc was a 128 kbps mp3 made with some old codec (Fraunhofer or Blade), made years (or maybe even a decade) ago. That's quite terrible even for those of us who normally have no problem with mp3. I posted this info on SDE too.

 

I would be greateful if you could post these facts on the Amazon UK site, perhaps as comments to my reviews. Unfortunately, due to a past episode, I can post reviews on Amazon but I can't post comments. I might be paranoid but I think Edsel is behind some of the comments my reviews are receiving. There is a new one this morning stating that "the tapes have probably lost SOME high frequencies while being stored. It happens often." Now they are resorting to blatant lies and I can't dispute them so, as a service to the potential Amazon buyers, please help me. At least this lie on the tapes themselves creating the frequency cutoff should be challenged.

 

the 10MB per album file they received should of been a tipoff

 

On his LinkedIn profile Demon Music Group label manager Val Jennings describes himself as a music enthusiast and record collector. So, apart from the excellent ACE records in the UK almost all the other labels are really only about marketing and NOT about delivering quality product or sound. They look around for catalogue material, they make the deal(s) and they make sure the PRODUCT is in the online channels and whatever is left of the physical channels. It is time for a complete boycott, really. I know the music industry is in big trouble now and has been for years, but sheer incompetence is inexcusable. It also saddens me what has become of once great labels like Island, Philips, Polydor etcetera. Their "heritage" is not in the right hands with Universal and hasn't been for years now.

 

Would a mastering engineer accept to work from 128 kbps mp3 files for a reissue project like this?

 

C'mon, I don't think SDE is ridiculing anyone. He's talking about judging music based on waveform images more than on the music itself. Lots of people on this very forum complain about this all the time.

And I disagree... I think the majority of people who buy these releases will neither notice nor care about the 16 kHz issue. Even in the reissue market, audiophiles are a minority.

I think Edsel simply took the cheapest possible route in bringing these releases back on CD. They didn't spend time checking sources or tracking down original tapes, etc. To do so would have been cost prohibitive. It's a terrible shame, but such is the state of the music industry today.