Viewing a restored version of The Fellowship of the Ring - Questions.

Discussion in 'Visual Arts' started by Strat-Mangler, Jan 7, 2019.

  1. Strat-Mangler

    Strat-Mangler Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Toronto
    Finally watched a restored version I've found which addresses all the issues with The Fellowship Of The Ring such as the color grading among other major issues.

    Here are some images to show how aggressively and it was recolored for the Blu-Ray release. Click on the image to see all the detail.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    What made it challenging to fix is that it changes from scene to scene. There's a huge laundry list of issues that were also creatively fixed and the result is the most rewarding viewing of this movie in HD that I've ever had. It took an entire year to perform this entire restoration for many technical reason.


    Some thoughts and questions about the movie itself ;

    1. This has always bothered me. Why does the bartender at the Prancing Pony start off with an Irish accent and then a couple of scenes later have a Western cowboy-style accent?

    At 0:20 : "Good evening little masters..."
    At 1:54 : "He's one of them rangers..."



    2. How come Sam isn't the least bit interested in the ring? Purity of heart? Or are all hobbits naturally far more resistant to its evil? Might explain why Bilbo was able to live for decades with it largely unaffected, at least to the extent we were shown.

    3. I'm confused about what happened to Cate Blanchett's character. She's offered the ring and displays her own insecurities about wanting to be loved by everyone when she reaches for it, then comes back to normal, and looks defeated while saying "I passed the test." Huh? And then says she "will diminish and be called Galadriel". I thought Galadriel was already her name and "diminish" insinuates she will retreat and isolate herself. Can anybody explain this one?

    4. If the Nazgul are neither living nor dead, how come they feel pain? When Aragon throw that lit torch into one's face and his cloak is afire, he's screaming as if in pain and leaves the scene. The others eventually also flee. Why?

    Bonus question following the viewing of The Two Towers.

    Faramir was initially tempted once to get the ring but very quickly and easily was able to not give a care about it and released Frodo. It goes against how easily corrupted most men are (in the movies) with very few exceptions (Aragon). How come? Or is it quite different in the books?
     
  2. Parachute Woman

    Parachute Woman Forum Resident

    I love Tolkien, though I am not an expert and it has been awhile since I either read the books or watched the films. My attempts:

    1. Error by the actor.
    2. Yes, strength of character. Sam is one of only a tiny handful of characters who is unaffected by the ring. He is a beautiful little sweetheart. It's not a Hobbit thing, necessarily, It's a Samwise Gamgee thing.
    3. I'd have to rewatch this scene. But the "test" she passed, I believe, was that she believed even she was corruptible by the ring and she was correct.
    4. The Nazgul were once men, corrupted by the ring and enslaved to Sauron. Tolkien writes that they had immortality but "life became unendurable" for them. I think the point is that their whole existence is pain. They will live forever, but for no purpose as they gave themselves over to evil.

    Faramir's plot is completely different in the books. He is wise enough to resist the ring, does not bring Sam and Frodo off their course and sends them on their way pretty much with little incident--though he warns them about Gollum. Tolkien was very fond of Faramir and stated multiple times that he was the character in the books most like himself.
     
  3. Steve Hoffman

    Steve Hoffman Your Host Your Host

    TLOTR completely took over my life for a while in the early 80s. We had a JRRT book club and we read the entire trilogy outloud to each other. Took about 3 years!

    I suggest to anyone who has an interest to read the books, they are wonderful. Used LOTR paperbacks are sold for like $3 each. That's 9 bucks for the entire trilogy.. Well worth it.
     
  4. seed_drill

    seed_drill Forum Resident

    Location:
    Tryon, NC, USA
    3. Galadriel was the keeper of one of the Three Rings. Once the One Ring was destroyed, all that was created with the three would start to fade and she and all the Elves of Middle Earth would eventually go the Havens and leave, never to return.

    Having Frodo offer her the ring was an extreme temptation. She had the power to wield the ring to defeat Sauron, but the ring would have corrupted her, making her into a new Sauron. She used her power to show Frodo what would happen were she to have the ring. She passed the test because she did not take, nor accept, the ring.
     
  5. seed_drill

    seed_drill Forum Resident

    Location:
    Tryon, NC, USA
    I'm not sure they even gave themselves over to evil. They were given the rings by Sauron, as were the Dwarves and the Elves. It was his hidden master ring that brought them under his control. But the rings extended life but eventually trapped the wearer permanently in the shadows. They still could be wounded or killed through outside forces, though, as happened to The Witch King.
     
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  6. Aragorn is also not tempted by the ring in the same way that Boromir was. In the book there's a little more temptation for Sam, but he still resists it.

    I'm not sure if the line is different in the theatrical cut, but the film version is "remain Galadriel", which makes more sense.

    For comparison, her speech from the book:
    as discussed here: I wish Jackson hadn’t ruined Galadriel’s speech
     
    Last edited: Jan 7, 2019
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  7. Squealy

    Squealy Forum Hall Of Fame

    Location:
    Vancouver
    He's not speaking in a cowboy accent. It's a similar kind of working class accent to how Sam speaks. That usage of "them" in place of "those" isn't limited to American cowboys.

    In the book Faramir is not tempted at all, he is an unambiguously good character . Jackson and company, however, felt if there was no element of conflict this part of Frodo's story (which is running concurrently with the big battles the other characters are going through) was going to be dull and uneventful -- as stated above, "He is wise enough to resist the ring, does not bring Sam and Frodo off their course and sends them on their way pretty much with little incident." So they had Faramir be more suspicious and antagonistic toward them, and appear to be the same kind of danger that Boromir was, which some Tolkien fans found hugely upsetting for some reason. However, ultimately he rejects the temptation where his brother succumbed to it, and more or less assumes a similar role to what he has in the books.
     
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  8. Erik Tracy

    Erik Tracy Meet me at the Green Dragon for an ale

    Location:
    San Diego, CA, USA
    The scene with Galadriel and Frodo more or less follows the books but the full meaning goes way back. If you know the 'back story' it is much more powerful/moving.

    Galadriel is one of the Noldor, Elves who can directly recall their time in Aman, the Undying Lands, and under the 'care' of the Valar (Guardians of Middle-earth). The Elves were encouraged by the Valar to come under their protection during the struggles with Morgoth in Middle-earth (Sauron's master in the First Age of Middle-earth) - and also because the Elves were drawn to the divine light of the Undying Lands.

    However, not all is eternal bliss and happiness - and some of the Elves rebel after a time thinking that the Valar are constraining them against their full potential they think they'll have back in Middle-earth. The Elves would like to make their own realms.

    Galadriel is one of these old Elves and does leave The Undying Lands and does establish her own realm of Lothlorien. And later, in the Second Age, does come into possession of one of the Rings of Power. The Three elven rings had the ability to slow the passage of time, to preserve (or more darkly - embalm) that which is. The Elves were immortal and so regretted the passage/ravages of time.

    Ok, so here's Galadriel's quandary; when Sauron was initially vanquished and the One Ring lost, the other Rings of Power were more or less "free" to use their powers; Galadriel keeps Lothlorien protected and preserved.

    But, with the finding of the One Ring things get much more complicated: If Sauron finds the One Ring all of Middle-earth will be under his dominion and say goodbye to Lothlorien. If the One Ring is destroyed, the Elves knew that their rings would lose their power and Lothlorien is doomed to fade since Galadriel will no longer be able to hold back the passage of time.

    Lose, lose situation.

    But, if Galadriel were to come into possession of the One Ring – well, that is the scene where she says “All shall love me and despair.” She was very tempted by the One Ring as this was her only “out” to remain in Middle-earth and preserve/rule Lothlorien.

    However, she “passes the test” – she refuses the temptation to use the One Ring as she knows it will eventually corrupt even her. And, with perhaps some foresight, she sees that with the destruction of the One Ring and that her Elven Ring won’t be able to preserve Lothlorien and will fade, she no longer desires to stay in Middle-earth and will pass to the West and go back to the Undying Lands.

    I won’t go into the differences between book passage and movie scene, but that’s the gist of it.
     
  9. Strat-Mangler

    Strat-Mangler Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Toronto
    Clearly, you didn't listen to the passages I outlined. It is as I described. I invite you to use the video and tune indexes I posted.
     
  10. Steve Hoffman

    Steve Hoffman Your Host Your Host

    Another JRRT Geek. Glad to know ya.
     
  11. Erik Tracy

    Erik Tracy Meet me at the Green Dragon for an ale

    Location:
    San Diego, CA, USA
    Proud of it; got my own Tolkien website too.:righton::D
     
  12. Steve Hoffman

    Steve Hoffman Your Host Your Host

    Really? PM me the URL, or post here if you want..
     
  13. Erik Tracy

    Erik Tracy Meet me at the Green Dragon for an ale

    Location:
    San Diego, CA, USA
  14. Steve Hoffman

    Steve Hoffman Your Host Your Host

    Ah, thanks. Just like the type of discussions (and arguments) that we used to have in our group..
     
  15. Erik Tracy

    Erik Tracy Meet me at the Green Dragon for an ale

    Location:
    San Diego, CA, USA
    Like cables, amps, and hirez, here...eternally debated.:p
     
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  16. Mal

    Mal Phorum Physicist

    Sounds to me like a consistent West Country accent.

    West Country English - Wikipedia
     
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  17. Steve Hoffman

    Steve Hoffman Your Host Your Host

    We once did an assignment: Write some "missing" dialog for a scene in the book that needs it.

    JRRT's writing method was to write until he figured out who the character was and the motivation, etc. Then, he went back and erased it all, dialog included, because now that he knew someone, we didn't need to know the details. A fact that drove me nuts about some chapters.

    Remember when the FOTR was in Hollin and Aragorn was standing watch above them, looking at the empty sky and worrying? The others were down in the dale "talking and laughing."

    What could they have possibly been talking and laughing about? Boromir, laughing? Sitting there with Gimli and Legolas (who at that point were not friends at all) and Gandalf and the four Hobbits. I wrote a page of dialog as to what they could possibly be saying. I'll have to dig it up.

    Also, I wrote 4 pages (longhand, dude) on why Sam (who loves elves) never said one recorded word to Legolas in hundreds of miles.

    Ah, the good old geeky days.
     
  18. Squealy

    Squealy Forum Hall Of Fame

    Location:
    Vancouver
    Sure I did. And:

    It's that. I just wasn't British enough to identify it exactly.
     
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  19. Drew

    Drew Senior Member

    Location:
    Columbus, OH
    I can still remember the day this movie hit the theaters. All of us at work who were LOTR geeks had tickets for opening night but mostly at different theaters around town. I wrote down a list of 10 things that would be changed between the book and the movie and handed it to everyone. ("OMG! No! You don't really think they're going to cut out Tom Bombadil?!", etc).

    I hit the nail on the head with every single one of them.
     
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  20. PaulKTF

    PaulKTF Senior Member

    Location:
    USA
    Seconded. But read The Hobbit first. Yes, it's a children's book but it's a damn good one.

    I also recommend "The Letters Of J.R.R Tolkien" and "J.R.R Tolkien: A Biography" as supplemental reading- both books are full of information about Tolkien, the writing of the books, and other interesting information about his life.
     
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  21. I'm sure ol' Tom was the first to go!

    You wouldn't happen to have that list, would you? :p
     
  22. Frozensoda

    Frozensoda Forum Resident

    To answer your question about the Nazgul, quote comes from Aragorn when he and the hobbits were awaiting the attack on Weathertop,
    “Sauron can put fire to his evil uses, as he can all things, but these Riders do not love it, and fear those who wield it. Fire is our friend in the wilderness.”
    Fire doesn’t hurt them, they fear it.
    As for why all the Nazgul cut and ran from the fight, Tolkien had this to say and there were a few factors which drove them away (some of these references are specific only to the books,

    “[The Witch-king] had been shaken by the fire of Gandalf, and began to perceive that the mission on which Sauron had sent him was one of great peril to himself both by the way, and on his return to his Master (if unsuccessful); and he had been doing ill, so far achieving nothing save rousing the power of the Wise and directing them to the Ring. But above all the timid and terrified Bearer had resisted him, had dared to strike at him with an enchanted sword made by his enemies long ago for his destruction. Narrowly it had missed him. How he had come by it — save in the Barrows of Cardolan. Then he was in some way mightier than the B[arrow]-wight; and he called on Elbereth, a name of terror to the Nazgûl. He was then in league with the High Elves of the Havens.

    Escaping a wound that would have been as deadly to him as the Mordor-knife to Frodo (as was proved at the end), he withdrew and hid for a while, out of doubt and fear both of Aragorn and especially of Frodo. But fear of Sauron, and the forces of Sauron's will was the stronger.”
     
  23. Drew

    Drew Senior Member

    Location:
    Columbus, OH
    I could probably remember a few more given some time. I remember when I read the actors who were cast to the different roles and one stuck out to me... "Liv Tyler - Arwen"

    Huh? Arwen? She's a secondary character. "OMG! They're going to play up the love story between Aragorn & Arwen. They're going to turn the LOTR into a couple of chick flicks!"

    Which they did.
     
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  24. wow

    Y'know what, I'm good. You can just hang on to the rest of that list.
     
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  25. Jim B.

    Jim B. Forum Resident

    Location:
    UK
    Why didn't Gandalf just fly to Mount Doom on an eagle, run in and chuck the ring into the lava?

    I know this has become a joke but is there a reason why they just couldn't fly there on an Eagle?
     
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