Why have the loudness wars creeped into High Res releases?

Can you give us the details, in case we’re interested in checking it out?

 

Does this mean we are unlikely to ever get a great sounding version of this album?
Would be a shame. Some good tracks on there waiting for their liberation from the SQ.

 

"Leaves some of the sound." How generous.

 

the real truth is that niether engineers nor musicians are the best people to decide how their music should be

 

the gear thing should be optional, but the music itself should at some point be mastered at the highest level possible, and then released at various levels for audiophiles and the masses or casual listeners. from this thread it seems even after the album is mixed and mastered, it's not being brought to its best level even for archive reasons, which seems insane

 

I look at the waveform and run it through a few configs in izotope to determine the best declip setting needed. I sample listen to the results. I have configured about 2 dozen different presets.

90% of the audio files I get need some work. Even if not clipped to red I can fix a waveform that looks like a tube to bring out dynamics.

 

Yes, not even the engineers. Sad but true.

 

I do this as a general rule for most modern CD's / digital files I have. And I agree...it's not something I should have to do. But I find it necessary.

Not so much the DR difference, but obviously the audible difference between that + re-EQ'ing to something more akin to my TT / sylus setup. Less ear fatigue.

 

I allowed myself to be cowed by tech nerds in every field over the years, but really the majority of engineers in any field shouldnt have any discretion when it comes to what or why, just how

 

Thanks for your help

 

I'm glad you mentioned that, in those specific terms.

This could have been so easily fixed. A LONG time ago.

Ideally, you'd leave stereo masters in their original form, whether good, bad or indifferent.

At the user end, mobile device manufacturers should have included an EQ option from the very beginning. Let's call it a Loudness button, because that's what it would be: an artificial bass-n-treble boost – as an option – that the goobers could enjoy as well as more critical listeners (who'd likely use something better than earbuds anyway). Cheap digital circuitry, near-zero cost.

And sell it. Brand the EQ boost as: EarBlaster, BassBOOM, Digital Depth Charge, AtomicTinnitus, SkullSonix. So the goobers would feel they were getting something special, and others would know to avoid for the cheesy branding.

Too late now, of course.
.

 

Compression is the problem, and that's what should be moved to the playback device. As for a brand name, I suggest "Dolby L". Everyone will want that Dolby symbol on their device.

 

if we were thinking along the lines of master reels & iterations of 'reduced' versions, by now we'd have invented the maths for making 'copies' where compression isn't a thing, where the 'shadow' of the master, is 'economised', but still integral. You could find the whole in the part, or the totality in the sketch.

for most people they only need a certain level of richness

 

For rock/pop, the hi-res is usually just a higher bitrate version of the same terrible compressed CD. This isn't new at all.

 

yes that sounds about right from my experience, but in this case we're supposing the studios operate a pyramid structure of versions, all descending from the highest quality master available, but Im not sure if that would just be a very big computer file on a modern mixing desk, or if they would use really high quality tapes and new-old mixing desks and equipment

 

I don't suppose that at all. I think they send off a 24/96 file to be mastered, brickwall it, then send that out. No reason to suspect otherwise, with a few notable exceptions (Alanis' back catalog reissued in hi-res, that one recent Alice In Chains album they went back and re-did as a dynamic HR download). But most are like the Adele, Iron Maiden, etc releases: they only do one digital master, no matter what format you get it in. Companies don't care enough to do more work than that.

 

I'm going to ask this here, since this thread is current, has anyone listened to The Joker, Fly Like an Eagle, and Book of Dreams from HDtracks? I am tempted to buy them, searched the forum and didn't really see much discussion about them.

I assume The Joker would be an upgrade for me, as I have the old, standard CD. I do have the 30th anniversary edition for FLAE, and Book of Dreams is from those digipak remasters. Hope some of this makes sense, mainly just wondering about the SQ on the HDtracks versions.

 

thats what they most likely do, but we're saying wouldn't it be nice if ? etc

 

I was speaking of dynamic compression, not data compression. This is a thread about Loudness Wars, after all...

 

Maybe so, but audiophiles are the only ones who are buying $20 hi-res downloads or $30 DSD files, phone listeners and streaming fans don't buy these files. So I don't understand who they are marketing to, we (audiophiles) understand the loudness wars so there is noway I'm going to buy these files with the chance of this brickwalling going on.
That's the message that needs to be sent. Although if this is only present in pop music then so be it, it seems clear that majority does not care or understand.

 

Yep that is a lot of what I'm getting at in this thread. High res digital will not be streamed, won`t be usually used on cheap portable devices it does not need to be jacked up in volume.

Eventually if this keeps up audiophiles will stop buying this audio since it doesn't meet audiophile standards.
If record companies would take just a little effort in making sure high res audio actually sounded good without loudness wars they would make more money in the long term than just being lazy in the short term.

Letting loudness wars creep into high res is going to eventually kill the medium.

 

Just bought a couple of the Tool HDtrack releases, same boat they are legit 24bit 96k but also clipped pretty badly. So again I payed money for a product I'm going to fix on my own.

Who the heck is going to buy a 24bit 96k version of tool albums and want them clipped?

 

Neither are virtually anyone on this forum.

Or most anyone on this forum.

 

Yes! I am very surprised that members of this forum still don't know or understand the difference.