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Would Critics View KISS More Favorably If 'Phantom' Were A Blockbuster Hit Film?

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by S. P. Honeybunch, Nov 30, 2019.

  1. Cimrya Deal

    Cimrya Deal Forum Resident

    I never said it was bad or anything, I just said they were a joke.
  2. Wigru

    Wigru Forum Resident

    But do you like the punch-line?
    Crawdad and mark winstanley like this.
  3. Yeah, well, also in this parallel universe Bobby Fuller was never murdered, and he went on to write all the bestest and most popularest songs so the Bobby Fuller Four would be above the Beatles and the Rolling Stones and Kiss.
    mark winstanley likes this.
  4. seed_drill

    seed_drill Senior Member

    Tryon, NC, USA
    KISS' first four albums were, IMO, better than critical darlings, The New York Dolls, and their stage shows were like nothing that had ever been seen. Yes, Alice Cooper did theatrics, but KISS's show worked in arenas, whereas Cooper's sets were better suited to theaters. But Gene saw the critical drubbings and starting really dumbing down a lot of the material to appeal to early adolescent boys who were attracted by the image. KISS meets the Phantom of the Park was geared to boys even younger. It's Mighty Morphing Power Rangers level schlock.

    And while there were always some good songs on all KISS albums (save Unmasked), Ace and Peter getting heavier and heavier into drink and drugs and participating less and less in the recording process led to a bunch of slickly produced albums with session players and too many songs focused around Gene's peen.
  5. Burning Tires

    Burning Tires Forum Resident

    Atlanta, GA
    Nope. It was "Let's Put the X in Sex".

    When "Let's Put the X in Sex" was shown on MTV, it ruined any chance of me taking them seriously for the rest of my life. Prior to that, who knows?

    Hasn't their whole career been a non-stop, unashamed money grab? The critics were never the point.

    Comet01 and Django like this.
  6. Say It Right

    Say It Right Not for the Hearing Impaired

    Niagara Falls
    Their comic book image was established prior.
    S. P. Honeybunch likes this.
  7. mark winstanley

    mark winstanley 5.1 should be mandatory for my favourite albums

    I won't argue with that.
    I have no problem with sensible statements. :righton:
    carlwm likes this.
  8. blastfurniss

    blastfurniss Forum Resident

    Marion, OH, USA
    The critics generally hated everything KISS did. It didn't harm the brand or their bottom line.

    David Bowie by comparison was (mostly) adored by critics. He made good films, he made ok films, he made awful films. Had no impact on his musical career or the perception of his music.

    At the end of the day the only opinion that matters is your own. If you dig KISS and you dug the movie, good for you. Who cares what the critics or those of us on the board think? You liking something is all the justification you need.
    ARK, Crawdad, carlwm and 3 others like this.
  9. mark winstanley

    mark winstanley 5.1 should be mandatory for my favourite albums

    carlwm likes this.
  10. Baldo

    Baldo Forum Resident

    Butte, Montana
    FWIW, “Attack of the Phantoms”, the theatrical version released in Europe, is much better. For one, instead of the cheesy 70s porn music, it has tracks from the four solo albums.
    905, Crawdad, carlwm and 2 others like this.
  11. Wigru

    Wigru Forum Resident

    They have Always been honest about the money grab. Kiss only gets annoying when one of boths side starts to take them seriously. Just like fans/haters of that other kitsch band Iron Maiden.

    I don't think there are too many people taking them seriously these days, and I think it's a sign of the times. A good sign. Back in the day, too many people had too strong opinions about acts like that. And some believed the images bands like Iron Maiden staged. Just like that American Wrestling thing. Then, it gets ugly.

    If only people realized that everybody just wants to have a good time. And these days, if Kiss doesn't mean a good time to you, there are enough possibilities to ignore the whole happening.

    Not that I'm a fan, but that 'God Gave Rock 'n' Roll To You' song almost Always puts a smile on my face, because it's soooo over the top. It's like Abba's 'Thank you for the music', but with more punch and even more kitsch.
  12. nodeerforamonth

    nodeerforamonth Forum Resident

    San Diego,CA USA
    That's literally the WORST THING KISS HAS EVER DONE! Lol!

    Some people's tastes are completely backwards. To each their own, I guess, but I think I get why you're not a fan. Lol!
    Wigru likes this.
  13. Wigru

    Wigru Forum Resident

    Come on! It's comedy! And if they WERE serious about it, it's tragicomedy! Can't lose :)
  14. S. P. Honeybunch

    S. P. Honeybunch Presidente de Kokomo Thread Starter

    California, USA
    There are opinions and facts in those posts that anyone is free to counter with his own arguements.
  15. nodeerforamonth

    nodeerforamonth Forum Resident

    San Diego,CA USA
    It's not fun or funny. I'd almost rather listen to Pink Floyd. Almost.
  16. Trader Joe

    Trader Joe Forum Resident

    New Hampshire
    Terrible, terrible cover version.
    petem1966 and carrick doone like this.
  17. Oatsdad

    Oatsdad Oat, Biscuits and Abbie: Best Dogs Ever

    Alexandria VA
    Kinda hard to really compare "Phantom of the Park" with "Man Who Fell to Earth"!
    blastfurniss likes this.
  18. Oatsdad

    Oatsdad Oat, Biscuits and Abbie: Best Dogs Ever

    Alexandria VA
    Literally, since they appeared in Marvel mags circa 1977.

    I still think Kiss simply pandered to their kiddie audience too much. Kids are fickle, and the way they alienated their older teen crowd came back to bite them...
  19. AirJordanFan93

    AirJordanFan93 Forum Resident

    Once they knew that was where the big money was they definitely did that.
  20. Crawdad

    Crawdad Detroit Rock Citizen living in a Vinyl Free Zone

    You think too much about other people's musical tastes.
    ARK, 905 and JoeRockhead like this.
  21. Glass Candy

    Glass Candy Forum Resident

    KISS never had critical standing and the Sgt. Pepper movie has been forgotten. It only harmed the Bee Gees for a few months, they had another #1 by the end of that same year.
    JoeRockhead likes this.
  22. carlwm

    carlwm Forum Resident

    Yeah, at least Phantom is watchable on some level. :)
    Crawdad likes this.
  23. Octavia

    Octavia Forum Resident

    My 5 year old son has discovered Kiss via that Scooby Doo movie and he thinks they are pretty cool. Magical Mystery Tour went down like a lead balloon with Joe Public. A dodgy film need not kill a career - it’s more likely the material that followed over the next couple of years that did for their popularity.
    Celebrated Summer likes this.
  24. S. P. Honeybunch

    S. P. Honeybunch Presidente de Kokomo Thread Starter

    California, USA
    It isn't critics' jobs to sell albums and singles, though. Critics are involved with following and reviewing acts who they deem relevant. By 1981, Christgau had deemed Bee Gees unworthy of an album review. That ignoring lasted for the rest of their subsequent twenty year recording history. Why didn't Christgau also ignore The Rolling Stones and Steely Dan for the next twenty years?
  25. JoeRockhead

    JoeRockhead Forum Resident

    New Jersey
    The Bee Gees album AFTER the Sgt Pepper movie went platinum and had three No. 1 singles. The movie was a bust but was largely ignored, and it is mostly forgotten today.
    carlwm likes this.

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