Would Critics View KISS More Favorably If 'Phantom' Were A Blockbuster Hit Film?

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by S. P. Honeybunch, Nov 30, 2019.

  1. S. P. Honeybunch

    S. P. Honeybunch Presidente de Kokomo Thread Starter

    Location:
    California
    You haven't heard of Two Against Nature or Everything Must Go?
     
  2. carlwm

    carlwm Forum Resident

    Location:
    wales
    Ha ha! :D

    I prefer Bowie even less as an actor as singer. He's not for me, bless him. :)
     
  3. Octavia

    Octavia Forum Resident

    Location:
    Cardiff
    I was 5 turning 6 in the UK in 1978 so I was the prime audience for this film. My only memories of Kiss in the 70s were seeing their photo in a teenybop magazine and then the video for I Was Made For Loving You played on Saturday morning kids TV (Tiswas?) I was surprised they were still going when Crazy Nights was a hit a few years later.
     
  4. craymcla

    craymcla Forum Resident

    Location:
    Nashville, TN, USA
    Why do you have this obsession with Robert Christgau, as if his opinion were an oracle from Delphi and supersedes all other reviewers? It wasn't and doesn't.
     
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  5. craymcla

    craymcla Forum Resident

    Location:
    Nashville, TN, USA
    Actually, I think a better question may be why do you think a silly rock 'n' roll based scripted movie had any significance in the late 70s? Hard Days Night was a milestone for sure, but also in a rarified class of it's own. After Monterey, Woodstock and Gimmie Shelter those types of scripted movies practically disappeared in rock 'n' roll, replaced by concert movies. I was there for all of those, as well as Phantom and Sgt. Peppers. The later two were insignificant and just not that widely viewed. But I judged both bands, KISS and the Bee Gees, on their music, not their questionable taste in choosing movies to star in. While those two movies were embarrassments, they were also an anachronisms and just not significant. That Christgau lost interest in those two bands after 1978 is merely a coincidence.
     
    Last edited: Dec 3, 2019
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  6. McLover

    McLover Forum Resident

    Location:
    East TN
    Also, with Kiss, they were on a label which was beginning to be on the beginning of a gradual downhill slide from peak success. Casablanca was much more a Disco label and focused on that market and hoovering up massive quantities of Cocaine. Bear this in mind, Disco sales in 1979 were peaking, Donna Summer (the label's biggest seller) was peaking in sales. And Disco was beginning to go through transition. 1979 was a major downward year in the record business. And sales were down, and several labels were having major cutbacks and bad sales years, after 12-15 years of ever increasing sales years. Smaller record stores often were closing, or having difficult years.
     
  7. johnod

    johnod Forum Resident

    Location:
    Canada

    Nope, not at all, different strokes for different folks.
     
  8. johnod

    johnod Forum Resident

    Location:
    Canada

    Apparently so. :)
     
  9. Crawdad

    Crawdad Detroit Rock Citizen

    You mean this isn't supposed to be Fellini?
     
  10. tkl7

    tkl7 Agent Provocateur

    Location:
    New York, NY, USA
    Have you not realized he is a trolling this board? Starting 3 separate threads on Hot In The Shade in one night? Posting a thread (since deleted) about a Rhodesian white supremacist folk singer? If he is 21, I'm a Scottish Lord.

    And how is my original post even taking a **** on him? I was just confirming to another poster that he wasn't joking with his post!
     
    Last edited: Dec 3, 2019
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  11. Cool hand luke

    Cool hand luke You shoulda heard just what I seen

    Location:
    Massachusetts
    Citizen KISS :biglaugh:
     
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  12. Cool hand luke

    Cool hand luke You shoulda heard just what I seen

    Location:
    Massachusetts
    There is something very odd about this dude, it smells fishy
     
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  13. JoeRockhead

    JoeRockhead Forum Resident

    Location:
    New Jersey
    You put too much stock in to how powerful Christgau was. He tried to bury the Bee Gees and Kiss, and failed. The role of the powerful critic like him has been diminished/irrelevant for decades. You are the one who needs to take your head out of the sand.
     
  14. Siegmund

    Siegmund Vinyl Sceptic

    Location:
    Britain, Europe
    Did Christgua actually even bother to review Kiss?

    They would obviously not be his bag, but he’s the kind of person who would just pass them over in silence rather than draw attention to them by ripping them a new one.
     
  15. JoeRockhead

    JoeRockhead Forum Resident

    Location:
    New Jersey
    yeah, the OP thinks that by ignoring them, the all-powerful Christgau could harm their careers. it didn't. The albums he ignored after said flop movies, Spirits Having Flown and Dynasty, both went platinum despite not being reviewed by the dean of America's blowhards.
     
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  16. GlobalObserver

    GlobalObserver Observing The Globe Since 1964

    If the members of KISS had all died tragically in a plane crash or a collective drug overdose after only releasing their first three studio albums and Alive!, they would be held in much higher regard by music critics today.
     
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  17. serch_777

    serch_777 Active Member

    KISS is one of the most interesting cases in contemporary music - I find them a case of them being much more talented than their critics believe, but far from the geniuses that their "army" regards them. Having said that, they're one of my favourite bands ever. I can't believe that people don't give them credit, at least for their albums between 74-83, as they all contain plenty of very well-written songs. I do think that their arrogant attitudes have damaged them through all their career, but as someone said, if they had called it quit after Love Gun, they would be highly regarded by many more people today.
     
  18. Crawdad

    Crawdad Detroit Rock Citizen

    Instead of Rosebud it would Firebird.. the last shot would be of Paul Stanley from the Alive! cover.
     
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  19. Greenalishi

    Greenalishi Forum Resident

    Location:
    San Francisco
    Kiss seem well known and popular today. Moreso than many of their era. The ups and downs of each album and project in a career Arc are just that overall they seem pretty successful really.
     
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  20. czeskleba

    czeskleba Senior Member

    Location:
    Seattle
    He reviewed four of their early albums: Dressed to Kill, Alive, Destroyer, and Rock and Roll Over. Didn't like Destroyer and gave mixed reviews to the other three. After that he stopped reviewing them. As I've noted repeatedly, it clearly had nothing to do with Phantom since the stopping point came two years before Phantom. My guess is that he stopped because he felt he'd said all he had to say about them, and then didnt like their change in sound with Dynasty. But I'm just guessing.
     
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  21. czeskleba

    czeskleba Senior Member

    Location:
    Seattle
    As I've noted already, SP Honeybunch is incorrect, because Christgau did review Spirits Having Flown, as well as their subsequent Greatest Hits. So clearly, the Sgt Pepper movie had no effect on his interest in the band.
     
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  22. carlwm

    carlwm Forum Resident

    Location:
    wales
    Under The Rosebud. :)
     
  23. Crawdad

    Crawdad Detroit Rock Citizen

    I'd like to speak to the administrator Who removed my posts.
     
  24. fishcane

    fishcane Dirt Farmer

    Location:
    Finger Lakes,NY
    i liked the CHiPs halloween episode, Rock Devil rock, does that count?
    [​IMG]
     
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  25. Crawdad

    Crawdad Detroit Rock Citizen

    Not if you enjoyed and Paul Lynde's holiday special more. :D
     
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